Thread by @ncdave4life

@Veritatem2021 @EthonRaptor @3GHtweets @SZOMB @Willard1951 @Ceist8 @Climatehope2 @WillWat6 @SGMTrailbuilder @priscian @BouchellJohn @Mark_A_Lunn @ShroedingerBird @6lennybravo @glinch72 @ianrowley677 @tevet @JimBowersclimb @MustBeJoshing @BlasphemousBan1 @Winston43105474 @ItsTheAtmospher @Dannyboy7293 @Jaisans @jbonbon91 @EricWil06256732 @DarthFeodor @TWTThisIsNow @BradPKeyes @atherton_chris @DGinCheshire @BointonGiles @AuroriaTwittori @RushhourP @MartinJBern @Anvndarnamn5 @BailFund_Brawl @AristotleMrs @gstrandberg1 @Jakegsm @ammocrypta @DTGvmd @wille99 @PaulDFarrar @TheDisproof @Data79504085 @Hji45519156 @KCTaz Perhaps I can translate.


Consider a planet with no air, in thermal equilibrium: it emits same total energy as it receives, at average surface temp T₀.

Now give it a thick, transparent argon atmosphere. Q: How will that affect average surface temp (T₁)?

@Veritatem2021 @EthonRaptor @3GHtweets @SZOMB @Willard1951 @Ceist8 @Climatehope2 @WillWat6 @SGMTrailbuilder @priscian @BouchellJohn @Mark_A_Lunn @ShroedingerBird @6lennybravo @glinch72 @ianrowley677 @tevet @JimBowersclimb @MustBeJoshing @BlasphemousBan1 @Winston43105474 @ItsTheAtmospher @Dannyboy7293 @Jaisans @jbonbon91 @EricWil06256732 @DarthFeodor @TWTThisIsNow @BradPKeyes @atherton_chris @DGinCheshire @BointonGiles @AuroriaTwittori @RushhourP @MartinJBern @Anvndarnamn5 @BailFund_Brawl @AristotleMrs @gstrandberg1 @Jakegsm @ammocrypta @DTGvmd @wille99 @PaulDFarrar @TheDisproof @Data79504085 @Hji45519156 @KCTaz There's one complication we'll ignore: the definition of "average" temp. It can't be a simple arithmetic average.
Per Stefan-Boltzman, radiative emissions are proportional to T⁴, so to calculate an "average" temp that emits same energy we'd need to avg T⁴ and take the 4th root.

@Veritatem2021 @EthonRaptor @3GHtweets @SZOMB @Willard1951 @Ceist8 @Climatehope2 @WillWat6 @SGMTrailbuilder @priscian @BouchellJohn @Mark_A_Lunn @ShroedingerBird @6lennybravo @glinch72 @ianrowley677 @tevet @JimBowersclimb @MustBeJoshing @BlasphemousBan1 @Winston43105474 @ItsTheAtmospher @Dannyboy7293 @Jaisans @jbonbon91 @EricWil06256732 @DarthFeodor @TWTThisIsNow @BradPKeyes @atherton_chris @DGinCheshire @BointonGiles @AuroriaTwittori @RushhourP @MartinJBern @Anvndarnamn5 @BailFund_Brawl @AristotleMrs @gstrandberg1 @Jakegsm @ammocrypta @DTGvmd @wille99 @PaulDFarrar @TheDisproof @Data79504085 @Hji45519156 @KCTaz Alternately, we can make our hypothetical planet out of a thermal superconductor, so the entire surface is always the same temperature, even though the equator gets more solar radiation than the poles.
(I just want an excuse to ignore the fact that atmospheres move heat around.)

@Veritatem2021 @EthonRaptor @3GHtweets @SZOMB @Willard1951 @Ceist8 @Climatehope2 @WillWat6 @SGMTrailbuilder @priscian @BouchellJohn @Mark_A_Lunn @ShroedingerBird @6lennybravo @glinch72 @ianrowley677 @tevet @JimBowersclimb @MustBeJoshing @BlasphemousBan1 @Winston43105474 @ItsTheAtmospher @Dannyboy7293 @Jaisans @jbonbon91 @EricWil06256732 @DarthFeodor @TWTThisIsNow @BradPKeyes @atherton_chris @DGinCheshire @BointonGiles @AuroriaTwittori @RushhourP @MartinJBern @Anvndarnamn5 @BailFund_Brawl @AristotleMrs @gstrandberg1 @Jakegsm @ammocrypta @DTGvmd @wille99 @PaulDFarrar @TheDisproof @Data79504085 @Hji45519156 @KCTaz An argon atmosphere is transparent, so ALL radiation from the surface escapes to space, with or without an atmosphere.

If the argon atmosphere causes a warmer surface, then T₁ > T₀.

Of course, a warmer surface must radiate more energy, per Stefan-Boltzman: E = ε σ T⁴.

OK?

@Veritatem2021 @EthonRaptor @3GHtweets @SZOMB @Willard1951 @Ceist8 @Climatehope2 @WillWat6 @SGMTrailbuilder @priscian @BouchellJohn @Mark_A_Lunn @ShroedingerBird @6lennybravo @glinch72 @ianrowley677 @tevet @JimBowersclimb @MustBeJoshing @BlasphemousBan1 @Winston43105474 @ItsTheAtmospher @Dannyboy7293 @Jaisans @jbonbon91 @EricWil06256732 @DarthFeodor @TWTThisIsNow @BradPKeyes @atherton_chris @DGinCheshire @BointonGiles @AuroriaTwittori @RushhourP @MartinJBern @Anvndarnamn5 @BailFund_Brawl @AristotleMrs @gstrandberg1 @Jakegsm @ammocrypta @DTGvmd @wille99 @PaulDFarrar @TheDisproof @Data79504085 @Hji45519156 @KCTaz T₀ is temperature with no atmosphere (in Kelvin).
T₁ is temperature with a thick argon atmosphere.

If T₁ > T₀ then the surface must EMIT more radiative energy with an atmosphere than it would without one.

Right?

@Veritatem2021 @EthonRaptor @3GHtweets @SZOMB @Willard1951 @Ceist8 @Climatehope2 @WillWat6 @SGMTrailbuilder @priscian @BouchellJohn @Mark_A_Lunn @ShroedingerBird @6lennybravo @glinch72 @ianrowley677 @tevet @JimBowersclimb @MustBeJoshing @BlasphemousBan1 @Winston43105474 @ItsTheAtmospher @Dannyboy7293 @Jaisans @jbonbon91 @EricWil06256732 @DarthFeodor @TWTThisIsNow @BradPKeyes @atherton_chris @DGinCheshire @BointonGiles @AuroriaTwittori @RushhourP @MartinJBern @Anvndarnamn5 @BailFund_Brawl @AristotleMrs @gstrandberg1 @Jakegsm @ammocrypta @DTGvmd @wille99 @PaulDFarrar @TheDisproof @Data79504085 @Hji45519156 @KCTaz But argon is transparent, so the surface RECEIVES (almost exactly) the same amount of solar radiation, regardless of whether it is airless or has an argon atmosphere. (Please, just let us ignore the negligible "lens effect" of the atmosphere.)

Right?

@Veritatem2021 @EthonRaptor @3GHtweets @SZOMB @Willard1951 @Ceist8 @Climatehope2 @WillWat6 @SGMTrailbuilder @priscian @BouchellJohn @Mark_A_Lunn @ShroedingerBird @6lennybravo @glinch72 @ianrowley677 @tevet @JimBowersclimb @MustBeJoshing @BlasphemousBan1 @Winston43105474 @ItsTheAtmospher @Dannyboy7293 @Jaisans @jbonbon91 @EricWil06256732 @DarthFeodor @TWTThisIsNow @BradPKeyes @atherton_chris @DGinCheshire @BointonGiles @AuroriaTwittori @RushhourP @MartinJBern @Anvndarnamn5 @BailFund_Brawl @AristotleMrs @gstrandberg1 @Jakegsm @ammocrypta @DTGvmd @wille99 @PaulDFarrar @TheDisproof @Data79504085 @Hji45519156 @KCTaz Do you see the problem? If T₁ > T₀ then adding the argon atmosphere means the planet is emitting too much energy. It's emitting more energy than it receives from the Sun.

That means it is cooling down.

@Veritatem2021 @EthonRaptor @3GHtweets @SZOMB @Willard1951 @Ceist8 @Climatehope2 @WillWat6 @SGMTrailbuilder @priscian @BouchellJohn @Mark_A_Lunn @ShroedingerBird @6lennybravo @glinch72 @ianrowley677 @tevet @JimBowersclimb @MustBeJoshing @BlasphemousBan1 @Winston43105474 @ItsTheAtmospher @Dannyboy7293 @Jaisans @jbonbon91 @EricWil06256732 @DarthFeodor @TWTThisIsNow @BradPKeyes @atherton_chris @DGinCheshire @BointonGiles @AuroriaTwittori @RushhourP @MartinJBern @Anvndarnamn5 @BailFund_Brawl @AristotleMrs @gstrandberg1 @Jakegsm @ammocrypta @DTGvmd @wille99 @PaulDFarrar @TheDisproof @Data79504085 @Hji45519156 @KCTaz In fact, it will continue to cool down until it only emits as much energy as it receives, i.e., when T₁ = T₀.