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Vindman looks a WHOOOOOOLLLLE lot more uncomfortable than he did going into closed hearing.
Schiff now integrating last week's testimony, that Trump did not give a damn about Ukraine.
Jennifer Williams, too, looks like she's hating this.
"It was the second time in two weeks that Vindman had raised concerns with NSC lawyers."
"Col Vindman believed Zelensky must have been prepped for the call, which has now been confirmed by other witnesses."
Schiff: Ms. Williams, we all saw the insults Trump hurled at you. We are grateful. Col. Vindman, I note you have shed blood for America. I hope no one on this committee will become part of those vicious attacks.
Schiff reminds it's up to Congress, not the witnesses, whether to impeach the President.
Nunes claiming there's a disconnect between testimony and what "mainstream media" reported on it.

"They admitted they had not talked to POTUS about these matters."

Schiff's statement anticipated this well--Nunes is claiming witnesses have to push impeachment.
Nunes again saying that Dems claimed Trump was a Russian agent.

3rd opening statement, 3rd time he aired this lie.
Nunes now claiming that Buzzfeed's report that Trump directed Cohen to lie.

Nahhh. That's been confirmed now, bubb.
Nunes again lying that Dems coordinated whistleblower statement.

(Lie 3)
Nunes claims there are inaccuracies in his complaint.

(Lie 4)
Nunes now suggesting the whistleblower was prohibited by law in conveying the information he did.
Whooboy: Nunes now claiming that Ukraine meddled in 2016. JOHN SOLOMON! Drink!!

That's like a lie-squared.
Nunes now submitting a bunch of John Solomon garbage.

[Note: he hasn't asked Solomon to testify.]
Now, Ken Vogel!!

Congratulations to Ken Vogel, getting full double billing w/John Solomon.
Shorter Nunes: John Solomon and Kev Vogel's erroneous reporting, good, erroneous (and in some cases confirmed) reporting from other outlets, bad.
Yo: Nunes, some of us have called it bribery from day one.

Nunes now spinning Burisma's influence peddling as bribery.

Nunes now claims half the country voted for Trump.

(Lie 5)
Schiff emphasizing that these people are both Republicans, with Vindman hired into NSC and Williams working for Bush, first hired as a political appointee.
Schiff: Congress will not tolerate any threat of reprisal. [Both witnesses know that's an empty promise.]
Williams says that Condi is a hero.
Williams: This spring it was the highest privilege of my career to be asked to work for the Vice President to advance the Administration's agenda.
Wiliams: On May 15th (13th?), an assistant to CoS called and told us that POTUS had decided VP would not be attending.
Williams describes how all the pros wanted the aid released, but OMB said POTUS would not release it.
Williams: I found July 25th call unusual, it involved discussion of what appeared to be a domestic political matter.
Williams keeps pursing her mouth like it's gone dry. Cannot imagine how stressful this must be.

Well, maybe I can.
Vindman reading directly from statement, meaning he's only looking up (so at the camera) intermittently.
Vindman describes Lutsenko and Rudy as dual malign actors.

"NSC grew increasingly concerned abt impact such [propaganda] was having on our policy."
Vindland describes how Bolton cut meeting short when Sondland raised requirement of investigations.

"I stated that this was inappropriate and had nothing to do with national security."
It's really cowardly of Bolton to make Vindman go first here.
Vindman: I was concerned about hte call and reported my concerns to Mr Eisenberg. It was also clear that if Ukraine pursued an investigation, it would be interpreted as partisan play.
Vindman: When I reported my concerns, I did so out of sense of duty, in chain of command, through proper channels.
Vindman: My only concern was to act properly and out of sense of duty. I immediately returned to implementing President Trump's policy.
Vindman now talking about the diversity of the military, how they don't serve any party but the country.
Vindman now talking about how grateful he is for being accepted as refugees, and noting he and both brothers served in the military.

Vindman talking about how this would not be possible in Russia, meaning to shame those who want to retaliate.
Vindman: Dad, That I am sitting here testifying to congress is proof you made the right decision to come to America. Do not worry about me telling the truth.
Schiff: September 18. Were you on the call? Relevant to investigation.

Lawyer: As we previously discussed, OVP taken position that 9/18 call is classified.
Schiff: I only asked if you think there's something relevant?

Williams: Very happy to appear for closed session as well.
Schiff: Talking points? Include rooting out corruption?
Vindman: Recommended TPs cleared through staff.
Schiff: Record of that call. Did Trump mention corruption?
Vindman: He did not.
Schiff: High level delegation. Williams, Pence attend?
Williams: Yes. CoS office that POTUS had told VP not to attend.
Schiff: You learned this on May 13. Inauguration had not been set by May 13? What accounted for decision?

Williams: Do not know.
Schiff: Advice to Zelensky?

Vindman: Be particularly cautious wrt RU and its desire to provoke Ukr, stay out of US domestic policy.

Schiff corrects, "politics."
Schiff gets Vindman to explain that he gave the warning abt politics bc in March certain actors were engaging in such things.

Then switches saying it was consistent with US policy.
Schif: you both learned hold in early July. Neither learned of reason.

Williams; OMB reviewing to ensure in line w/US priorities.

Vindman: Review to ensure remained consistent w/US priorities.
Vindman: Sondland said UKR would have to provide deliverable, investigations.

Schiff: Bolton?

Vindman: We had not completed all agenda items but Bolton cut short meeting.
Vindman: May not have been entirely clear at that moment. Connection to President may not have been entirely clear at that point.

Schiff: Agreement w/Mulvaney that Ukr would get meeting if Ukr undertook such investigations.
Vindman: Without hesitation I knew I had to report to WHCO. I had concerns, I knew I had to report concerns to proper people in Chain of Command. It was inappropriate, improper for POTUS to request, demand an investigation into a political opponent,
Vindman: esp foreign power, where at best dubious whether impartial investigation. Undermine our foreign policy.

Schiff: really a demand?

Vindman: When a senior asks you to do something, it's not to be taken as a request. It's to be taken as an order.
Schiff: Unusual and inappropriate. Something else. Shed some light on other motivations.

Williams; How I felt. In reflecting in what I was thinking. First time I had heard internally, president reference investigations I had only heard abt thru Rudy's press reporting.
Williams: at that moment it was not clear, it was noteworthy in that regard. I did not have enough information to come to conclusions.
Schiff: both recall Burisma, doesn't appear in call record?

Vindman: This transcript may have not caught the word Burisma. In the transcript that was released, "the company."

[This is BS, but Vindman is trying not to blame people like Eisenberg.]
Schiff; Zelensky brought up Burisma, led you to believe he had been prepped.

Vindman: Unlikely he'd be familiar with a company in broad basis of bipartisan relationship. In the press or otherwise prepped.
Goldman: TPs for July 25 call? What were they based on?

Vindman: Not in public record, areas we consistently talk about in public. Reform, anti-corruption, end Russia's war.
Goldman: Process to determine official US policy?

Vindman: My job to ensure we had cohesive policy.

Vindman: POTUS can choose to use TPs or not, he's the POTUS. But they were not consistent, yes.
Goldman getting Vindman to explain that the 2016 election stuff not in TPs, not in official US policy.

Goldman: Were you aware of theory that Ukr interfered in US election? Any credible evidence? Putin promote this theory?
Goldman gets Vindman to explain that Biden was not in official policy.

Vindman: It was not consistent with policy as I understood it.
Even Williams says she's not aware of any credible evidence that Biden did anything inappropriate.

Goldman: Had you ever heard a call like this?

Williams: Specific investigation different than any call I had listened to.
Goldman: Any discussion w/Ukrainian Embassy? Demands for investigation? Concerns about hold?

Vindman: In August timeframe, Ukr embassy asking if I could substantiate that.

Goldman: Before it became public?

Vindman: Yes.
Goldman: Why concern that Ukraine lose bipartisan support?
Vindman: Significant security assistance, and maybe even more importantly, public support, would encourage RU to pursue further aggression, undermining Ukr security and European security.
Vindman: I speak Russian and Ukrainian, and a little bit of English.


Vindman: Zelensky made valiant effort to speak English, but also spoke Ukrainian.
Goldman points to part of call record where Zelensky said Burisma. When Zelensky said Burisma, sounded like he was prepped for that call.

Goldman shows text message from half hour before call, bt Volker and Yermak.

Goldman: Kind of thing Zelensky prepared?
Goldman laying out how the tie between WH visit and investigations may reflect the text sent right before the call.
Goldman: Why report call?

Vindman: Tracking other narrative, July 10 call ended up being pronounced by Sondland, subsequent to that report, invited to f-up with any other concerns.
Vindman: To prevent leaks and preserve integrity of transcript should be segregated to smaller group of folks. Didn't take it as anything nefarious.
Goldman: Concern abt integrity of transcript, shouldn't include Burisma?

Vindman: Not necessarily. Sometimes that doesn't happen.

[He's bending over backwards to paint censorship of transcript as innocent.]
Vindman describing another correction: You can look into there are recordings.
Goldman: Why separate secure system?

Vindman: Not unprecedented. Limit number of people who can access. Decision made on the fly, after I conveyed my concerns to Eisenberg. Ellis came in, on the fly.
Goldman: April 21 call, corruption. See where it says root out corruption? Readout false?

Vindman: Not entirely accurate. Consistent with US policy, statement that goes out, reading out mtg, also indicate what is important.
Goldman: Even tho included in TPs. Corruption not included in either (call).

Vindman: Correct.

Goldman: So when POTUS says now held up bc concerned abt rooting out corruption, not expressed?

Vindman: Correct.
Goldman now tracking what happened between first call and May 13.

Recall of Yovanovitch. Telephone call w/Putin. Rudy planned trip to go to Ukraine to pressure Ukrainians.

Vindman: Aware he was traveling there, promoting investigations.
Goldman: What did Sondland say when Ukrainians raised WH meeting?

Vindman: Specific investigations.

Goldman: Broader meeting.

Vindman: Bolton ended meeting.
Vindman: I said request to conuct investigations was inappropriate, had nothing to do with NatSec policy.

Goldman: Was Volker there?

Vindman: He was there for some it.
Eisenberg took notes on July 10 meeting.

Vindman: It was inappropriate. Had short convo w/Dr. Hill, discussed needing to report this.
Goldman: By July 10, Ukrainians understood WH meeting depended on investigations.

Vindman: Was first time I heard it.
Goldman: First thing Zelensky asked Pence?

Williams: Security assistance.
Goldman: Did Pence provide reason for hold?

Williams; Unwavering support. Need for European countries to provide ore assistance.

Goldman: Did Pence report back?

Williams: Not privy to convo that evening.
Goldman: You didn't learn why hold lifted?

Both Williams and Vindman say no.
Vindman: First I heard of whistleblower complaint was when news broke.
Nunes: You spend extraordinary amount of time on Ukraine.

Williams: Wouldn't say extraordinary. It's in my portfolio.

Nunes: aware that Ambasasdor investigate Burisma? Aware of anti-Trump efforts.

Williams: No.
Williams says she only became aware of concerns abt Burisma until Kent's testimony.
Nunes establishes that Williams didn't know allegations abt BUrisma.

Note, at least one of his claims is bullshit.

(Lie 6)
Note, Vindman is making a distinction between stuff he is aware of and Nunes' conspiracy theories. He's saying he's not aware now on anything but what Kent said.
Here, Vindman corrects Nunes when he ties Biden's involvement.
According to Mark Meadows' standard, there was collusion laid out in the Mueller Report.

(Lie 7)
Now Nunes claiming a lot of classified info leaked from this committee.

Much of it leaked through his staffers, so maybe that's an admission.
Vindman: We have an NSC press shop. I do not engage with the press at all.

Nunes: Do you know of anyone who engages with press?

Vindman: I do not know, but likely press shop did.
Nunes now asking if they spoken to anyone out side WH, or used other people's computers.

Vindman: Spoke to two people outside WH, Kent, and intelligence community.

[Kent had testified to this]
Nunes: Mr Vindman, you testified you did not know who the whistleblower was.

Vindman: It's Lt Col.

Vindman: Per advice of counsel, I've been advised not to talk abt members of intel.
Vindman: What I can offer, properly cleared individual with need to know.

Nunes: You can plead the Fifth, you're here under subpoena.

Lawyer: We're following rule of Chair.
NUNES LIES that the Chair has tabled the subpoena.

He entertained that motion, and the COMMITTEE voted it down.

(Lie I forget how many)
Caster: You thought Zelensky mentioned Burisma?

Vindman: I had it in my notes. I know he said that.

Castor: Yours came up on page 5, substitution for word "case."

This i their defense.
Caster: Prep of transcript followed ordinary process?

Vindman: On clearance, etc, different system.

Vindman: Concerns abt leaks seemed valid, was not going to question attorney's judgment.
Williams says her supervisor was on the call so did not feel the need to raise it.

Lt General Kellogg was on the call.
Williams: I ensured Pence had access of transcript. As I was preparing him, news just broke on security assistance.
Castor now laying out how Trump hates aid and wants Europeans to step up on burden sharing.

Vindman corrects that EU has provided $15B, just not military assistance.
Castor now laying how it's corrupt for energy officials to have role in Ecology Ministry.

Again, I'm not sure he realizes that this damns Trump, who does the same.
Castor now trying to suggest Trump pulled Pence trip bc they were out of the country at same time.

Amazing the degree to which he's really operating as a defense counsel--this is all abt reasonable doubt, not truth.
Castor: Did Secret Service ever deploy?

Williams: They were looking into it but did not yet deploy.

Castor suggests it was Ukraine's fault that USSS didn't deploy.

It was OMB's.

Again, this is their defense.
Williams makes it clear that Ukraine was supposed to take priority.
Castor tries to cut off Vindman when he's listing all the attendees at the July 10 meeting -- bc he just listed more people the press can call about it.
Castor: General feeling of group was positive?

Vindman: Bolton exceptionally qualified, we asked him to take photo.

Vindman did not answer that there was good feeling. He said Bolton (!!) was professional enough to hide anger.
Vindman describes following Rudy's stuff via numerous sources, going back to March. Including interagency concerns.
Vindman says Burisma, Biden, and 2016 were all mentioned.

Castor: On page XX, you said you weren't sure 2016?

Vindman: It was asked multiple times. Later I said all three.

Castor: "Refreshed recollection"?

Vindman: That's a thing now.
Vindman notes that Morrison recalled Vindman was recalled early from leave to prepare for E Europe trip. But then Morrison told him he wouldn't be on trip he was recalled to prep for.
Castor now airing attack GOP aired (via leaks from people Castor surely doesn't care for) that Morrison or Hill thought he worked outside chain.
Castor: Did Danilyuk offer Defense Minister?

Vindman: I declined, notified proper chain of command and counterintelligence.


Vindman: I'm an American. I came when I was a toddler.
Vindman: I did not leave the door open at all.


Again, this is not helping.
Vindman: Once I mentioned it to Ereth, it never came up.

Vindman: Didn't become aware of US govt officials involved in alternate channel until July 10.

[Vindman just made a ref to what foreign officials knew]
Vindman: They were trying to bring him in the tent. I only know Rudy as NY's finest mayor.

Castor: America's Mayor.
I guess if the GOP is going dual loyalty bullshit they'll ask about that woman sleeping in the White House? I mean, Melania's been here a fraction of the time Vindman has been.
Remember: The GOP has expressed no concern that Mike Flynn was a paid foreign agent of Turkey while getting TS briefings with Trump as a candidate.

But Vindman is suspect bc he appropriately rejected a request.
So to sum up: Castor had direct witnesses to the matters at issue.

The one thing he established abt call is that Burisma came up 2 times, and both instances were removed.

Otherwise, he asked these direct witnesses for hearsay, after the GOP has bitched for a week abt hearsay.
Schiff clarifying that Trump ordered Pence not to go bc date hadn't been set.
Schiff clarifying that Pence trip canceled after Rudy had to cancel his.
Schiff: Any ambiguity abt Trump request re Bidens?

Vindman: no.
Schiff: Those two investigations, precisely same investigations Rudy calling for publicly?

Vindman: Correct.
Schiff now laying out that Pence did not bring up investigations in larger meeting.

Schiff: Immediately after meeting broke up he went to Yermak and told Yermak if they wanted aid have to do investigations.

Williams: not aware at the time.
Schiff: You can't speak to private meeting?

Williams: Correct.
Schiff: aware that Bolton told him to talk to WHCO.

Vindman: I learned it after.

Schiff: You thought you should go to lawyer on your own, correct?

Vindman: That is my recollection.
Schiff: This "drug deal" as Bolton called it involved conditioning of aid, correct?

Vindman: That is my understanding.

Schiff: Very same issue Bolton said go talk to lawyers, comes up in call w/POTUS.
Schiff: Ever access someone's computer w/o knowledge or authorization?

Vindman: W/o authorization, no.

Reminder: Mark Ellis probably has.
Jordan: Why do people have doubts about your judgement?

Vindman pulls out Hill's comments in last performance review,

Vindman: Can't say why Morrison had questions abt judgment. We didn't work together very long.
Vindman says that he only read out two individuals who weren't on the call attesting to the fact that Eisenberg succeeded in keeping the call close hold.
Jordan: YOu have said, even though no one believes you, that you don't know ID of whistleblower.
Anyone besides me notice that @EliseStefanik got demoted by her male colleagues today, having served her purpose?
Himes raises Trump attacking her as a Never Trumper.

Himes; Are you engaged in POTUS attack? Never Trumper?

Williams: No. Tweet surprised me, I was not expecting to be called out by name.
Himes: would you call yourself a Never Trumper?

Vindman: I'd call myself a Never Partisan.

Himes: Ever deviated from protect and defend COnstitution? Accusing dual loyalty. It's the kind of thing you say when defending indefensible. It's what you stoop to.
Ratcliffe now pretending that a number of us didn't correctly ID this as bribery.

Ratcliffe: You used word "unusual." Vindman, inappropriate and proper.

Note, again, GOP Is trying to ask witnesses to do Congress' job.
Ratcliffe now quoting one of his colleagues attacking Biden.
BREAKING: Rudy Giuliani, the President's lawyer, has refused to attend.
Sewell: Did Ukrainian officials understand political nature of request.
Sewell: Why important for countries not to get involved in politics:

Vindman: Russia's involvement in 2016, heavy sanctions.
Turner blowing his 5 minutes having Vindman correct something.

Now trying to justify Sondland's involvement.
Turner doesn't note that Kay Baily Hutchinson, rep to NATO, not involved in this like Sondland is.
Now Turner making much of the fact that the White House is a really hierarchical place.
Turner talks over Vindman while he's saying something that doesn't help him.
Turner: Do you have evidence that other witnesses have perjured themselves?

Williams notes that she hasn't read anything.
Schiff misstates the post-McDonnell standard on bribery, bc trading a meeting does not apply.
Carson laying out that Eisenberg invited him to bring any more concerns to him.
Wenstrup: Chain of command. YOu were direct report to Hill and MOrrison. When you had concerns
abt 7/25 call, you didn't go to Morrison.

Vindman: I reported to Eisenberg, tried to report to Morrison, he didn't avail himself.

Wenstrup DIRECTLY MISSTATES what Vindman said.
Wenstrup: Did you insist that word Demand be put into transcript?

Vindman: I did not.

Wenstrup: But you did in your opening statement.
Schiff needed to give Vindman an opportunity to 1) explain how he tried to inform Morrison 2) how policy works.

Especially since they cut him off twice.
Vindman states he was excluded from meetings that would have been appropriate. Says he can't make judgment abt why excluded.
Vindman answers carefully that nothing that NSC prepared included investigation.

There are processes from opening investigations, We're prohibited from being involved in DOJ to foreign power convos, to avoid interference.
Stewart notes he's wearing dress uniform, notes he's wearing his dad's wings. You corrected Nunes on rank.

Vindman: I'm in uniform wearing military rank, I think it's appropriate.
Stewart now taking issue w/Vindman attaching his understand abt authority.

Stewart: I was in military, I could distinguish between favor and order. Zelensky did as well.
Stewart now bases his refutation of Vindman using "demand," based on what ZElensky heard, in response to Vindman raising a convo that didn't involve him.
Stewart again asking a witness to interpret the law.
Again, Stewart just demanded someone who's a direct fact witness to provide hearsay testimony.
Quigley getting Williams to repeat how, in 3 meetings, OMB offered only explanation that hold came from WH Chief of Staff.
Vindman talking abt putting a hold on Congressional notification. This is important.
Quigley: Did anyone raise legality of withholding funds.

Following subPCC, a meeting conducted by MOrrison, there were questions raised abt legality of hold, after July 26 Deputy's meeting, opinion rendered that it was legal.

Quigley didn't do what he needed to there.
HEYYYY Elise finally got to go!!!!!
Stefanik names Bolton as NSA.
Swalwell: DOD certified that anti-corruption terms had been met?

Vindman: Yes.

Williams says 5-6 in listening room at the time.

Swalwell You've been asked to describe what legally this means? Are you a lawyer.
Williams laughs at Swalwell and Vindman's joke abt attempted murder.
Williams mentions that Pence did not bring up investigations.

Williams says she's not in position to speculate.
Hurd starts by saying he shares a personal hero in Condi Rice.

Hurd: DId you personally hear how information would be used?

Vindman describes that Bolton didn't use TPs bc of deep level expertise.

Hurd: Do they always use them? Does Trump stick to script?
Gotta say the Dems' questions aren't up to what they were last week. More of them speechifying.
Castro gets Vindman to explain why Ukraine couldn't be trusted to conduct a non-partisan investigation into Biden.
Ratcliffe: You testified domestic political issue. Different than making a demand. Didn't sound like you heard it as a demand.

Williams: I don't believe I'm in a position to characterize it further.
Ratcliffe states why Vindman felt it was a demand.

Ignores the import of July 10 call.
Now Ratcliffe ignores that Williams is not making a conclusion abt the call -- but she doesn't say she disagrees w/Vindman.

But Williams also wasn't at July 10 incident.
Vindman explains that he went immediately to Eisenberg, but before he could talk to Morrison, Eisenberg told him not to talk to anyone else.
Vindman: Eisenberg was cool, calm, and collected, he told me he'd look into it.

Heck makes it clear Vindman shared info that Mick held the aid.
Vindman notes Eisenberg is Assistant to POTUS. Telling him to instruct him of other concerns is an order.
It sounds like Eisenberg told Vindman to stop talking to everyone when whistleblower complaint came in via CIA GC.
For those veterans and service members who react badly w/the "Thank you for your service" comment, today is a bad day.
Jim Jordan is now mocking a hostile attack on our country, treating an investigation as spying.

BREAKING, it also happened with Clinton Foundation.
Jim Jordan: "They got nothing"

Mueller: Except the guilty verdicts of the campaign manager, deputy campaign manager, NSA, foreign policy aid, personal lawyer, and rat-fucker.


Maloney: You went and immediately reported it. Why?

Vindman: Because it was my duty.
Applause when Vindman says he would be okay bc it was America. He just wiped one eye, tho not sure if it was a tear.
Williams looks like she's counting the minutes until she's done and boy I don't blame her.
Vindman describes Ukrainians considering themselves as barrier between Russian aggression and Europe.
Now Krishnamoorthi seems like he's losing it talking about being an immigrant American.
Krishnamoorthi walks Vindman thru Lutsenko's lack of credibility for his claims laundered thru John Solomon.
Ranking member of Intel Committee now attacking about 6 departments of Federal govt that have found Trump to break the law.
Schiff reminds that Morrison 1) also went to Eisenberg 2) didn't go to his supervisor.
Schiff laying out that there's no evidence of Trump fighting corruption.
Williams smiles when Schiff talks abt Yovanovitch attending an anti-corruption event when she was recalled. One of the first shows of emotion on her part.
Schiff notes that Trump doesn't bring up all the anti-corruption stuff that GOP has focused on in this.
Schiff reminds that Sondland stated that Trump doesn't give a shit about Ukraine.
Schiff: We care about our defense, defense our allies, and defense of our Constitution.
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