The framing of the ESL women's only league is that the only things stopping women from competing in T1 Esports is discrimination, but it's hard to justify that.
There has been nothing stopping a woman from getting high challenger with a gender neutral ID for 10 years of solo q.
There has been nothing stopping a woman from getting high challenger with a gender neutral ID for 10 years of solo q.
You can make arguments that discrimination applies in CSGO/Valo due to voice chat, but none of that applies to league.
Solo queue can be an objective metric of skill free from discrimination, but in 10+ years, there hasn't been any women who could compete in even T3 leagues.
Solo queue can be an objective metric of skill free from discrimination, but in 10+ years, there hasn't been any women who could compete in even T3 leagues.
Some women have hit challenger, but being an Ahri supp OTP or a Sona adc OTP in challenger doesn't mean you're even close to going pro, and those women have expressed 0 interest in ever playing pro.
There are people who are 1.1K LP who have a hard time getting on a T3 team.
There are people who are 1.1K LP who have a hard time getting on a T3 team.
For one reason or another, the talent isn't there in an environment where discrimination can't explain it.
Nearly every player who's made it was already high elo before they ever played in a structured environment.
Creating a structured environment won't solve that issue.
Nearly every player who's made it was already high elo before they ever played in a structured environment.
Creating a structured environment won't solve that issue.
If anything, there can be positive discrimination.
Any high elo player has dozens of DM's from women asking for free coaching.
Women can often get unlimited coaching from world class players for free, simply because those men crave attention from women.
Any high elo player has dozens of DM's from women asking for free coaching.
Women can often get unlimited coaching from world class players for free, simply because those men crave attention from women.
Women's circuits have also already existed in Lol/CS for 20+ years, and it hasn't done anything to accomplish the stated goal of creating T1 ready women.
The 50th circuit attempt probably won't be any different.
The 50th circuit attempt probably won't be any different.
Another large hole in the discrimination angle is the success of trans women in several Esports.
There are less trans women than women in gaming, they obviously face more discrimination, yet are much more successful in T1 esports.
They don't get the positive coaching either.
There are less trans women than women in gaming, they obviously face more discrimination, yet are much more successful in T1 esports.
They don't get the positive coaching either.
There are many trans women who have way more success in harder esports than the best woman.
For trans women, Scarlett has been the top player in SC2, Remilia was in LCS, many other examples.
For women, the best example would be Hafu, who had success in WoW and Hearthstone.
For trans women, Scarlett has been the top player in SC2, Remilia was in LCS, many other examples.
For women, the best example would be Hafu, who had success in WoW and Hearthstone.
There are infinitely less transwomen in esports, get more discrimination, yet have more success.
Hard to justify discrimination being the primary cause of lack of women in the T1 scene when trans women exist.
Hard to justify discrimination being the primary cause of lack of women in the T1 scene when trans women exist.
You can also look at chess, as it's a close proxy for gaming.
Judit Polgár is by far the most successful woman ever in chess, peaking Rank 8 world, and being the youngest GM ever at the time.
She stated she sacrificed everything for chess.
Judit Polgár is by far the most successful woman ever in chess, peaking Rank 8 world, and being the youngest GM ever at the time.
She stated she sacrificed everything for chess.
When she was asked about competing in women only leagues, she said that she practices for 6hrs+ a day, while all the other women weren't serious about chess.
They'd only practice 2hrs a day, as they were more interested in baking, embroidery, house work, etc.
They'd only practice 2hrs a day, as they were more interested in baking, embroidery, house work, etc.
To tie this back into League, how many women who claim they want to go pro play 3k games a season?
There are top 50 challenger guys who play 4.5k games a season who have difficulties finding a team.
There are top 50 challenger guys who play 4.5k games a season who have difficulties finding a team.
That isn't to say women are lazy, but maybe there just aren't actually any skilled women who want to go pro.
Even if there was a woman with the talent to potentially compete in T1, streaming is a safer and less stressful job, and women tend to(rightfully so) shy away from risk.
Even if there was a woman with the talent to potentially compete in T1, streaming is a safer and less stressful job, and women tend to(rightfully so) shy away from risk.
Being a pro play is an incredibly dumb career path to take. You have to sacrifice your entire life for a small chance at potentially reaching success.
The only reason men do it is because they are more likely to take dumb risks.
The only reason men do it is because they are more likely to take dumb risks.
Having testosterone their entire lives alone can account for why only men are represented in Esports.
Test makes you more competitive, more aggressive, and more likely to be willing to take risks.
Test makes you more competitive, more aggressive, and more likely to be willing to take risks.
Aside from desire to compete, this could effect how you play in an actual game.
It's not society that makes women naturally trend towards being support enchanter players, a risk averse playstyle.
It's more likely that women are naturally more caring, nurturing, loving, etc.
It's not society that makes women naturally trend towards being support enchanter players, a risk averse playstyle.
It's more likely that women are naturally more caring, nurturing, loving, etc.
Men are naturally worthless unless they make something of themselves, so they have much more incentive to take the risk to go pro to gain status.
Women don't have to play that race, and I don't see why they should.
Women don't have to play that race, and I don't see why they should.
I don't see anything wrong with there not being women pros assuming it's from women simply not choosing to grind 3-4k games a year for a slim chance.
If a woman does decide to, they shouldn't be stopped, and there is real sexism that exists.
Mostly from non-endemics.
If a woman does decide to, they shouldn't be stopped, and there is real sexism that exists.
Mostly from non-endemics.
There is nothing wrong with having a women's league for the sake of it, but there is little evidence that this 50th attempt will achieve it's goal of getting women into T1 Esports.
If anything, the prize pool being only $500K is a lazy attempt. It should be 5mil minimum.
If anything, the prize pool being only $500K is a lazy attempt. It should be 5mil minimum.
Personally, I think it's unfair to women to judge them based on male metrics, like how well they compete in a childrens video game after spending 16 hours a day grinding on their own for years.
Also, as a reminder, this league isn't happening because of any desire to "create talent".
ESL just wanted money from a marketing firm that has money to only be spent on female only projects.
ESL just wanted money from a marketing firm that has money to only be spent on female only projects.
https://twitter.com/yasubro/status/1473845426201632768
There are also studies showing men get more harassment online, but when women get harassed, it's more likely to be based on their sex.
This makes sense, but can make it appear to seem that women are harassed more.
This makes sense, but can make it appear to seem that women are harassed more.
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