Thread by @Hung_TT_Nguyen

Vietnamese and other peoples of Southeast Asia have naming conventions very much different from those in the Anglosphere. For us, writing our names overseas is a big headache. Let me first explain Vietnamese names, then I'll touch on names in other cultures.

Vietnamese name order is surname, middle name, given name. For example, Nguyễn (surname) Thục (middle name) Quyên (given name). However, the distinction between middle name and given name is not rigid. Nguyễn Thục Quyên can be addressed by either Thục Quyên or Quyên.

In journals, we have to cut our names according to western norms. But how? No clear rules. Some hyphen the name and middle name, e.g., Thuc-Quyen Nguyen scholar.google.com/citations?user…

Some follow this order without the hyphen. Below, Dang An is a compound given name, like Thuc Quyen, and no middle name is used scholar.google.co.nz/citations?user…

Yet some prefers one-word given name, or consider their surname as two-word, so they hyphen the middle name and surname. For example, this scientist is cited as Ngo-Duc et al. but his surname is Ngo. scholar.google.com/citations?user…

Yet others reverse their names completely and follow the first name, middle name, last name order. For example, Đỗ Xuân Hồng lists his name as Hong Xuan Do (single given name), but like Dang An Tran, he could have used Xuan Hong Do (compound given name) scholar.google.com.au/citations?user…

That's not all. In Vietnam, the formal address is by name, not surname, even for dignitaries. Prime Minister Phạm Minh Chính should be addressed as PM Chính, not PM Phạm. At home, I'm Dr. Hưng, not Dr. Nguyễn. So some Vietnamese scientists use their given name as surname.

For example, Võ (surname) Quốc (middle name) Thanh (given name) lists his name as Vo Quoc Thanh, and he is listed on citations as VQ Thanh, and cited as Thanh et al. So he is cited by given name, not surname. scholar.google.co.nz/citations?user…

That's still not all. More problems come when one has four names instead of three, e.g. yours truly. My name is Nguyễn Tân Thái Hưng. Technically, Tân is my middle name (same as my father's) and Thái Hưng is my name. Thái means tranquility and Hưng means prosperity.

It's a compound name. But I always feel that it's too formal, so I prefer to be addressed as just Hưng since young. Turns out I made the correct choice. Non-Vietnamese already struggle with Hưng, now add the Thái.... So my name in journals is Hung T. T. Nguyen.

In American legal contexts (e.g. visa, tax) my name is forced (by a US Department of State's employee) to Tan Thai Hung (a 3-word given name) Nguyen, which has led me to being called "Tan Nguyen" and receiving emails starting with "Dear Tan". That's another story.

Here's a prominent Vietnamese-Canadian hydrologist who uses a 3-word-given-name. His original name is Nguyễn (surname) Văn (middle name) Thanh Vân (compound given name) Not sure whether the 3-word-name was by choice or by the visa people's decision. scholar.google.com/citations?user…

So next time you talk to a Vietnamese scientist, ask them about their name. It's a headache, but we're used to it and it has become rather amusing.

Now onto Malay names. Malays don't have surnames. Marina binte Mohamed means Marina, daughter of Mohamed. Azhari bin Buang means Azhari, son of Buang. Neither Mohamed nor Buang are surnames. But as far as I know, Malay scientists often adopt their father's name as their surnames.

Next, Indonesian names. Many Indonesians have one single name (yep, that's their full name). So they often have to invent a surname in foreign contexts. My friend Fendi's Facebook name used to be Fendi Muahaha. Nature published a career column about this. nature.com/articles/d4158…

Next stop: Myanmar. Burmese don't have surnames either. Some are named after the day of the week when they were born. Some names include honorifics... Burmese names are complicated. Burmese scientists often use the last word of their name as their surname.

I didn't use "first name" and "last name" in this whole thread. Those terms are specific to western norms. I often say, half jokingly, that "my first name is my last name and my last name is my first name". Some people here find it weird. It's only weird if you use those terms.

In closing, as long as the Anglosphere still dominates world's norms, many Southeast Asian people will still have headaches with names overseas. Hey, I'm not complaining. That's the world we live in (we can't even have a standard power plug, for crying out loud).

We're used to it and we often laugh it off. But sometimes it is a serious problem. So we would appreciate if you understand.