Thread by @MMaluskeCTV

Good morning.. back to the Veltman trial again today.. I want to reup the article from Mondays opening statements windsor.ctvnews.ca/i-admit-that-i…

Today, the jury is expecting to hear evidence from a London Police detective who interviewed Veltman

But before we get going.. a warning that some of the details will likely be offensive and difficult to read.

Four members of the Afzaal family were killed on June 6. Grandmother Talat, her son Salman Afzaal, his wife Madiha Salman, their daughter Yumnah, & their son was injured

Nathaniel Veltman is charged with 4
Counts of terrorism-motivated first degree murder and 1 count of terrorism-motivated attempted murder

Testifying today: Detective Micah Bourdeau

Det. Bourdeau was called @ 909pm (approx. 30 mins after incident) to come in.. got to HQ @ 945.. he read the “call notes” and then attended a major crimes briefing

He was tasked w assisting with a search of Veltman and interviewing him

The detective went down to the “detention unit” & 1st met Veltman @ 110am

He took Veltman to an interview room (which the jury saw video of yesterday) to be photographed and interviewed

The jury will now watch that video and they have a transcript of the conversation in their hands

The judge says the transcript has redacted portions.

A second WARNING.. the content of this interview will likely be difficult or upsetting to read

D. Bourdeau starts w a warning about Veltmans right to a lawyer

“Well maybe eventually” when saying he’s already talked to duty counsel (a lawyer offered to anyone facing a criminal offence

The detective says because more charges are being added, they need to advise Veltman of his rights

He says he understands. “I’m a little shaky but I’m fine.”

He is photographed again by a forensic ident officer

The detective gets him shoes, water and offers food at any point “if you get hungry”

V: “I’ve done so much research before I did what I did.”

WARNING…. Much of his statements are offensive to read.

Veltman says when he turned 18 he got interested in politics, specifically “the Trump election”

He says she was “going insane” being at home during covid, not going anywhere, not talking to anyone so he went to the internet

“I felt the media was being dishonest”.

He believes the media was “lying” being “dishonest”

“Straight down the rabbit hole I went”

GRAPHIC WARNING

He is most upset about “Muslim on white (people) crimes that went unreported.”

He admits he “kept too myself” & tells police he “became a recluse”

GRAPHIC

In cases when white people are hurt “they (the media) won’t report it as a hate crime, they just report it as murder”

“I just kept searching and searching (the internet) and kept finding more and more of it” he says “I couldn’t handle it”

He says he would try to avoid it because it “filled me with such rage”

GRAPHIC

He says he had a “breaking point” when he read about an alleged case in the UK, where a “Muslim-grooming gang” was allegedly sexually assaulting young girls who he says were themselves charged by authorities

“I just snapped” he says “I’m done.”

GRAPHIC

“I decided I’m gonna commit violence” he told the detective “I’m gonna commit a terrorist attack”

“I would rather be peaceful” he told the detective saying opinions like his are not acceptable by the public & he isn’t “free to say what my concerns are”

“I did not want to do this” he told police “I felt sick to my stomach after I did it (the attack on the Afzaal family)”

GRAPHIC WARNING

He says he was “inspired” by other people & he wanted to be an inspiration “to send a warning” to those allegedly assaulting young girls “to back off”. He wanted to make sure it didn’t happen in Canada.

GRAPHIC WARNING

“I felt like I had to do it (attack a Muslim family)” he told police “they left me with no choice.”

And then he tells police he had planned to go on a “rampage” but changed his mind after the attack.

“It was very damaging to my soul”

The judge asks for a break for the jury.

Back in 15 minutes.

In looking back over my notes, he is given 6 offers to speak with a lawyer and declined them all

“I know I could just be quiet & not say anything.”

He told the detective he understands his words can be used against him to “make my sentence worse”

“I’m not planning on pleading insanity” he told police “I’m gonna be honest about what I did”

Court resumes

Justice Pomerance starts by addressing the jury about emotional reactions to the opinions expressed by the accused, telling them it’s normal & human

Justice Pomerance “it’s critical to identify and set aside emotional reactions when deciding this case”

“The question isn’t if the comments are offensive. The question is how do they relate to the case that’s before you to decide.” -Justice Pomerance

Detective Bourdeau asks him to go backwards and to go through the last few days

He said it was a “normal day”, he woke up feeling “sh**ty”, admits to consuming “shrooms” (magic mushrooms/psilocybin) the day before

GRAPHIC

He went to work. On the way home he told police “I saw some muslims walking on the street” and he told himself “I can’t do this (anymore).”

He went home, “wrestling” with his self worth & decided to go back out. He told the detective he hesitated in the parking lot of his home but decided to go out.

GRAPHIC

“I forced myself to do it pretty much.”

He left his apartment @ 730pm on June 6.

GRAPHIC

“I was ready to throw my life away for what I considered to be the greater good.”

Describes his actions as “very, very distasteful”

GRAPHIC

Before the attack, he went on his computer & looked up another alleged case of “muslim grooming gangs” in the UK & decided “yeah, I can do this”

GRAPHIC

He drove around London, pulled over to put on a bulletproof vest and helmet. Told police he also had an airsoft gun, machete and 2 knives in his truck.

GRAPHIC WARNING!

He tells police he couldn’t attack someone with a knife. A gun or a vehicle is “easier”.

GRAPHIC

He doesn’t know how many people were in the group or how old they might have been

“It all happened so fast”

GRAPHIC

After the attack he said to himself “I’m gonna surrender. I’m not gonna go on a rampage. This is enough.”

GRAPHIC

He tells police “it was such a blur”, he is “still pretty shocked by what I did”, admits his foot was “pedal to the metal” in his truck and “I admit it was terrorism.”

GRAPHIC

“I was a ticking time bomb” because he didn’t have an “outlet” to talk about his views & can’t be a public activist against alleged acts of crimes by muslims

He tells police he wasn’t under the influence of anything on the evening of June 6 other than the “come down” from “shrooms” he consumed the day before

He told police “it was a pretty brutal thing to do”, and “I didn’t have a desire to continue after”

GRAPHIC

“It had to be brutal. It had to be a very strong message.”

GRAPHIC exchange w detective
D:”who were they?”
V:”I don’t know”
D:”why did you kill them?”
V:”because they were Muslim”
D”how did you know?”
V:”well, from their clothes”

Note; he is repeatedly offered food or drink and has now rejected 7 offers to speak with a lawyer

Court now on afternoon break until 215pm

Court resumes with Justice Pomerance giving a mid-trial instruction to the jury about Veltmans' confession about terrorism previously. She tells them even though he admitted it, it doesn't necessarily meet the legal test for a charge of terrorism.

He is offered a lawyer for the 8th time and rejects the offer "for now" but won't answer some questions from Det. Bourdeau.

He believes "white" countries were suffering from declining birth rates & mass immigration problems.

GRAPHIC

He says it was a "side bonus" that his actions could inspire other "young white men" to act.

He says no one else knew about his plans, that he has "some people" in his life but he had "nothing to lose" so he "took advantage".

Det. Bourdeau asks more questions about the family and when he first saw them.

Veltman asks for a lawyer. The Detective has left the room.

The Detective comes back, notes its 335am & asks if he's okay.

"I hope I have hammered home the message about a lawyer."-Det. Bourdeau.

GRAPHIC

Veltman didn't know he was arrested near a mosque and admits attacking a mosque was never part of his plan.

The first police video statement is done. Det. Bourdeau is now pulling up the second video statement from Monday June 7 around 955am.

Veltman says he got "a little bit of sleep".

"Eventually I will..." speak with a lawyer he tells Det. Bourdeau. "Now i'm just really confused, I still don't understand..I'm in shock."

"Unfortunately I might need a little bit of time before I can speak again. I'm in shock. I don't know how to explain it."-Veltman

Det. Bourdeau - "you understand, this is a massive investigation for us?"

V:"oh yeah"

In the video, he does look & acts more tired than the first video statement. Tells police his truck wasn't damaged before the accident, he's not on any medications and says his "crusader" shirt is "just a joke"

Reminder: he is wearing a white t-shirt with a black cross on it.

GRAPHIC

Det. Bourdeau asking about inspiration. In the first video, he seems more confident that his actions will inspire others but now he's not certain

"I don't control others"

Going back to the question about "research" that he mentioned earlier in the first video. Veltman says now that it was trying to find where the facts of a story weren't reported.

"Did you purchase (your truck) for this purpose?" - Det. Bourdeau.

"I can neither confirm nor deny."-V

"Until I speak to a lawyer I can't really speak about my actions."-V

"Your questions concerning my actions I can't really answer right now." But then says he needs "time" to talk to a lawyer. "I just can't right now"

"Do you think the reality of your situation is starting to sink in a little bit?"-Det. Bourdeau

"Yes sir"-V

Det. comments on how his demeanor is very different now (1015am versus 3am)

GRAPHIC

"You killed an entire family except one little boy."-Det.

"Yeah, that's a pretty extreme thing."-V

GRAPHIC

Veltman said he never went out previous to June 6 to take actions like this but said he wanted to wait for summer. "A few more months of freedom"

Apologies: court is on break

Justice Pomerance excusing the jury for the weekend.

Trial resumes Monday @ 10am

-30-