Discover and read the best of Twitter Threads about #notallfrummen
Most recents (2)
Me: Here is a fairly specific diagnosis of an issue with the "demand" for women's Gemara learning in a specific community, replete with specific evidence.
Frum men: Nuh-uh, because as a man in a yeshivish community, things aren't like that *at all*.
#NotAllFrumMen, of course.
Frum men: Nuh-uh, because as a man in a yeshivish community, things aren't like that *at all*.
#NotAllFrumMen, of course.
Of course I can be wrong. I'm wrong all the time. I never went to Stern or learned in GPATS or did any women's Gemara learning in a formal setting until last year.
But how is men's experience learning Gemara in the yeshivish world at all apposite here?
But how is men's experience learning Gemara in the yeshivish world at all apposite here?
Every single thing I'm talking about--sociocultural support, infrastructural support, money-where-mouth-is support, exists in spades. (I commend to your attention the dais at the Mir dinner.) And I didn't even engage what the support looks like within the family unit.
There are two things that I think are inapposite about this response, even as it is meant to help. (Akiva is a sensitive and thoughtful person and this is not ch"v an attack. I'll try to make sure it doesn't sound like one.)
1. @btzelemelokim was talking about, as I understood it, the experience of growing up in the frum world and hearing this taught. (Responding to my general point about what we are teaching, and how it shapes the context in which victims come forward and abusers act.)
He was sharing a painful personal experience that illuminated yet another way in which teaching Torah--accurately!--might convey messages that we don't think we're conveying, or want to convey, and that we have to figure out how to explicitly address that.
