Thread by @WeAreTheMU

10 minutes to go until the next #AskTheMU! Got a question about streaming, royalties, or the campaign to #FixStreaming and keep music alive? Ask now #AskTheMU

https://twitter.com/WeAreTheMU/status/1305068705617866752

Hi everyone, this is Naomi Pohl from @WeAreTheMU and Graham Davies from @IvorsAcademy. We’ll be answering your questions about streaming over the next 30 minutes or so. Do you have a question about streaming, royalties or our #FixStreaming campaign? Ask us #AskTheMU

“If the song gets more money will the performers get less?” – anon #AskTheMU

Not necessarily. For a start, some artists are also writers, so they may get a better split from their publisher than their label. We want to see fairer deals for artists and a royalty for session musicians - NP (1/2) #AskTheMU

Essentially all creators and performers should get more. We want to see less of the streaming royalty pie going to major labels, and better transparency so everyone can understand what they're being paid and why - NP (2) #AskTheMU

Hi there. There has been quite a lot of noise about Facebook changing how music can be used across their platforms but my understanding is that there hasn't been any change to policy, it was incorrect reporting – GD (1) #AskTheMU

https://twitter.com/kingswing72/status/1301458464208715777?s=20

I think Facebook are trying to strike the right balance between enabling people to use smaller amounts of music, which are for a live element that is not held on the platform indefinitely, while ensuring that the music makers get duly paid - GD (2)

This happens through the agreements Facebook has in place with rightsholders. The rules as I understand them are that there are no limits on things such as music in Stories, or traditional musical performances (e.g. filming a live artist or band performing). - GD (3)

The greater the number of full-length recorded tracks in a video, the more likely it may be limited. Shorter clips of music are recommended, and there should always be a visual component to your video; recorded audio should not be the primary purpose of the video. – GD (4)

Our next #AskTheMU question is via Instagram: “When are PRS etc going to start paying out Streaming Royalties as Socan does in Canada? Socan pays £145 dollars per Streaming concert provided there is proof that at least 100 people attending the gig”
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The question about whether live stream events could be apportioned a set amount of the existing licences with YouTube/Facebook/Instagram by PRS is a good question. Socan and a number of other CMOs are going in this direction - GD (1) #AskTheMU

If PRS did this I believe it would not be new money but moving money around from the existing amounts - its an open topic I know and we should see if PRS can provide us with more on the latest - GD (2) #AskTheMU

Streaming is an international business and the solutions will need to be international. It was fascinating that an ex-Spotify employee agrees with us that the proportion of money paid by consumers that goes to labels over creators is wrong – GD #AskTheMU

https://twitter.com/TheWorldofMick1/status/1304204613911040002?s=20

Labels perform a very important function but the world has changed, how music is developed, recorded & distributed is very different to the era of CDs. We believe the share for the song and the performer needs to increase. – GD (2) #AskTheMU

No, they don’t and we think they should. Streaming is listened to like radio, for example with curated playlists. We believe royalties should come to session musicians through @PPLUK – NP #AskTheMU

https://twitter.com/CroutonCannon/status/1303638398134030337?s=20

"What actually is the black box problem?" - anon via web #AskTheMU

Black box is a massive problem in streaming - loads of streams are not matched properly and the royalties that are set aside are then paid out to the major repertoire that has already been paid royalties. - GD (1) #AskTheMU

It's a double payment which is unfair, particularly for smaller artists who self-release and can't manage their data as effectively. These monies should be paid to organisations that support music creators to sustain their careers. - GD (2) #AskTheMU

Hi Steve. There are a lot of potential solutions. Some creators would like to see a changes to user centric royalty distribution, which means the money paid by fans goes direct to the artists they personally listen to. - NP (1) #AskTheMU

https://twitter.com/twit_steve/status/1306172747098271745?s=20

There is also a call for streaming services to charge more to consumers and this has been part of the #BrokenRecord debate. It could help, especially if it means more money going to music makers (rather than just to labels)... - NP (2) #AskTheMU

... but it is a difficult time to ask people to pay more during a pandemic. We would like to see more of the streaming royalty pie going to the song as currently it feels undervalued. - NP (3) #AskTheMU

We would also like to see a royalty to performers via @PPLUK, as this would help unrecouped artists and session musicians. These are things we're talking about as part of the #FixStreaming campaign - NP (4) #AskTheMU
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Thanks Crispin! It is interesting to see Spotify complaining about the amount that the platform takes for making the content available, given Spotify is taking a similar deduction for making available music rightsholders content - GD (1)

https://twitter.com/crispinhunt/status/1304354098364461056?s=20

Platforms do a great job with their services carrying a lot of the cost of managing the content, data, marketing etc. Whether 30% deduction should remain or start to reduce as the market matures is a good question. - GD (2) #AskTheMU

“Those who have it, don't need it as much as those who don't. Should we spread the wealth?” – Kevin via @UKChange #AskTheMU

It’s an interesting question. Should the few top earning artists and labels get less per stream so that artists and labels further down the chain can get more? This would help support the whole music eco system. It could be part of the solution. - NP #AskTheMU

It's worth adding that if we got the black box reforms, it would mean that top earners would not get a top-up bonus. Instead, that black box money would be distributed to those receiving fewer performances and struggling to sustain their career - GD #AskTheMU

“Who is actually getting all the profits? It’s certainly not the musicians who made the music!” – Alexandra via @UKChange #AskTheMU

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Streaming is boomtime for platforms and the major labels - we know this because they say so via their reports. Costs of labels have reduced significantly. - GD (1)

And while it is true that the biggest artists have been getting bigger advances, too much profit is being concentrated with a few parties. This is unsustainable and is unfair at a time when creators earnings from other sources are disappearing with Covid-19. – GD (2) #AskTheMU

Thanks for all your questions! We're going to stay a little bit longer to get through as many as we can - NP & GD #AskTheMU

“How we have reached the current situation where artists receive paltry remuneration for streaming. Who was responsible for negotiating the woeful deal which we currently have?” – Patrick via email #AskTheMU

"The current situation isn’t the result of negotiation in most cases. Artists are often paid royalties like they were on CD and vinyl sales. We think this is unfair. We think artists should get a 50% royalty on streaming." - NP (1) #AskTheMU

Some labels already do this, eg: some @AIM_UK members, but other artists signed on older deals may get much less. There could even be deductions for breakage, something that applied to physical product but shouldn’t apply to digital files which can't break! - NP (2) #AskTheMU

We also have a legislative issue. Session musicians don’t get a royalty from streaming, but if the law changed or was clarified, they could do. We believe they should get a royalty via @PPLUK like they do on radio play. #AskTheMU

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“Streaming does not work for musicians. Why should music be free?” – Gavin via @UKChange #AskTheMU

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"Our fantastic music industry starts with the music creators. Without them there is no content for people to sell" - GD (1/2) #AskTheMU

It is wrong for the non-featured performers to get nothing from streaming. No copyright should be made available for free, and @IvorsAcademy is campaigning with @WeAreTheMU for all creators to get fair payment from streaming. – GD (2/2) #AskTheMU

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If these models enable performers to get income from a box office, this is to be encouraged, but of course we need PRS to respond with a solution for collecting a licence and how to pay these royalties out. @PRSforMusic what's your view? - GD #AskTheMU

https://twitter.com/mamjambo/status/1306175453498085377?s=20

“There is a lot of information for writers/composers but very little for the musicians that play the music. I have never received a penny, ever from streaming, yet I know that tracks I am on are streamed. It is not fair.” - anon via Hotjar #AskTheMU

If you're a session musician, then you won’t receive a royalty. If you are a featured artist then you should, but it may depend on whether you have recouped your advance - NP (1) #AskTheMU

We would like to see royalties for session musicians from streaming and a limit on the length of time that an artist can remain unrecouped - NP (2) #AskTheMU

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“What else are you doing? A petition isn’t going to fix it” – anon via web #AskTheMU

Our #FixStreaming petition calls for an urgent government review and @CommonsDCMS want to investigate streaming royalties. We're also calling for an internal industry debate as there are issues that affect all stakeholders. - NP (1) #AskTheMU

Should Spotify put its prices up for example? In principle yes, but it is difficult during Covid-19 when consumers may not be earning. And what do we do about YouTube? Continue the fight for copyright reform to protect creators and proper licensing of YouTube - NP (2) #AskTheMU

Hi there. Music rightsholders do charge the streaming services rather than the consumer directly. Consumers buying music is a good thing. Music has value, music has fans and subscription streaming services can develop this market. - GD (1) #AskTheMU

https://twitter.com/snnakepit/status/1306177890078334977

The advertising 'free' model has eroded perceptions of the value of music. Creating music is far from free, the costs of creating music are enormous - and it's only fair that creators are paid for their work. - GD (2) #AskTheMU

Hi Russ. #FixStreaming is an @IvorsAcademy + @WeAreTheMU campaign that focuses on music streaming services, like Spotify, rather than artists doing gigs online. Over the pandemic, both issues have been highlighted as needing improvement - NP (1) #AskTheMU

https://twitter.com/RussWilsonUK/status/1306173507504672768

Songwriters will receive a royalty via @PRSforMusic for online gigs as platforms such as Facebook are licensed internationally. Musicians tend to ask for donations but this absolutely does not replace income lost from live work. - NP (2) #AskTheMU

We are also concerned about musicians working for free in the pandemic. It is a profession, not a hobby. Work should be paid #WorkNotPlayMU. But we understand keeping engagement up with fans and musicians performing are both important. - NP (2) #AskTheMU

Hi Howard - great to hear from you and a blast from my old @PRSforMusic past! You, like me cherish the PRS rule that safeguards writers income; we need more of these safeguards not less - GD (1) #AskTheMU

https://twitter.com/GuildfordHoward/status/1306176570818789376?s=20

There are more and more instances of writers being pressured to give away rights, split their writer share with non-writers, and give in to buyouts. Writers need to come together to fight this trend and defend important principles - GD (2) #AskTheMU

This is the advantage of a collection society. It is much more transparent. The 50% rule is a cornerstone @PRSforMusic principle. The same applies in practice to royalties for performers collected by @PPLUK: 50% to the label, 50% shared among the performers - NP (1) #AskTheMU

We see a role for @PPLUK in making streaming royalty distribution fairer and more transparent. A recent EU-wide survey of performers showed they would trust a collection society like PPL to collect streaming royalties, and this does happen in some EU countries - NP (2) #AskTheMU

That's a wrap! Thanks @WeAreTheMU for enabling me & the @IvorsAcademy to take part in #AskTheMU. It is vital that we come together to fight for creators rights and income at this time of crisis. We should do more of these, Until then, contact me at ivorsacademy.com/contact-us/ - GD

Thanks everyone! At times like these, we need to ensure income streams to creators and performers are strengthened. Royalties sustain careers. To support us, sign the #FixStreaming petition and get involved with the #BrokenRecord campaign #AskTheMU - NP

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