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Oct 6, 2021 15 tweets 7 min read Read on X
Alright, the United States and its flight deck fantasies Part 1: The Flight Deck Cruisers

The Washington Naval Treaty, as well as the later London Naval treaties, were an incredible achievement for halting (temporarily) a growing naval arms race.
The German and Japanese navies are best known for their attempts to circumnavigate treaty restrictions. However, this does not mean other countries were playing by the rules.

The United States Navy was also looking for ways to circumnavigate treaty restrictions.
One of the more notable attempts to do this was through hybrid cruiser-carriers. Cruiser-sized warships with a large flight deck and a cruiser-level armament.

Such warships were desired for a variety of reasons.
1. The US Navy was well aware of the scouting ability of aircraft. Combining them on a fast warship equally capable of surface scounting was seen as advantageous.

In addition, should the ship be caught by enemy warships, it would retain the ability to defend itself.
2. Multiple smaller cruiser-carriers would be less vulnerable than one large fleet carrier. There was less likelihood of losing a substantial part of the air group in the event of a ship being sunk.

Multiple warships would also allow more ships to be deployed to multiple areas.
3. The final reason, and the most important, was that such a warship was not subject to the carrier restrictions in the Washington Naval Treaty.

In theory, the US Navy could build as many cruiser-carriers as they wanted as the ships were considered to be cruisers.
Thus from the late 1920s until the Second World War, the United States investigated several of these cruiser-carriers, designating them Flight Deck Cruisers. They were even given the special hull designation "CF".
Earlier proposals were the largest and most impressive.

In 1930, one design mated the rear of a Wasp class carrier to the forward half of a Brooklyn class cruiser. The resulting ship was over 650' in length. 24x aircraft, 9x 6", and 8x 5" guns were carried.
By the late 1930s, the Flight Deck Cruisers started to shift focus onto the aviation aspect. Two 12,000 ton cruisers were designed in 1939.

Both were armed with three 8" guns in a single triple turret forward. Secondary armament was eight dual-purpose 5" guns.
The difference was the arrangement of the secondary battery. Both ships were armored comparable to other cruisers and could steam at 32-33 knots.

Both Flight Deck Crusiers were estimated to carry between 24 and 36 aircraft.
The last flight deck cruiser proposed was in 1940. This design was slightly heavier than the previous ships, trading the triple 8" turret for two triple 6" turrets mounted, one mounted forward and the other aft. Only four 5" dual-purpose guns were carried.
The additional main battery guns were achieved at the expense of a shorter flight deck. However, it was somehow still estimated that up to 36 bombers could be carried. Performance was similar to the 1939 designs.
Despite the considerable interest in the ships, they remained designs only.

It was determined that the flight deck cruisers would fulfill neither role well at their displacement. The concept was shelved though not abandoned.
It was only at the start of WW2 that the concept was abandoned for good (From a certain point of view, more on that later).

With a breakdown in treaty restrictions, the US Navy could simply pump out a deluge of more capable carriers. And so they did.
But the US Navy loved flight decks and aviation. Cruisers were but one type of warship they considered slapping a flight deck on. We will look at some other projects over the next series of posts. Stay tuned!

#USNavy #wednesdaythought #tuesdaymotivations #History #Navy #Military

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More from @thegeneralboard

Apr 17
On the post about the Yamato class and torpedoes, someone had pointed out that they always seemed to take on roughly 3,000 tons of flooding after they were initially torpedoed by aircraft or submarines.

Perfect because I wanted to talk about a design flaw in the Yamato design. Image
Japanese designers went above and beyond in the design of the Yamato class, stretching their capabilities to the limit to produce a very advanced warship.

Notably, the Yamato class used plenty of full scale testing in its design. This was especially true for the armor design. Image
Gunnery tests against Tosa showed that large calibre shells retained enough momentum to travel for some distance underwater, allowing them to bypass the main armor belt entirely by going under it. Image
Read 13 tweets
Apr 12
I don't know who needs to hear this, but Bismarck was sunk by the Royal Navy, not scuttled.

I wanted to do a post on the torpedo protection of the Yamato class, but recent events required a change of plans. Image
There seems to be this weird, persistent belief that the Royal Navy could not sink it and the Germans scuttled it.

Some of the more extreme takes seem to suggest that Bismarck was in great shape prior to her being scuttled. Image
The facts of the matter is that the Royal Navy quickly "mission-killed" Bismarck, negating her use as a fighting vessel.

This allowed them to close the distance and begin pummeling her at close range. Image
Read 10 tweets
Apr 10
If you think Bismarck supporters are crazy with the "It took an entire British fleet to sink it", Let me introduce you to the Japanese equivalent when discussing the Yamato class.

This picture is tossed around way more than it should, being inaccurate and without proper context Image
The problem I have with this picture, and the loss of the Yamato class for that matter, is that people don't understand the progression of damage.

They almost seem to assume that the ship's were perfectly fine until that final hit that sent them under. Image
The fact of the matter is that US Navy aircraft continued hitting the battleships long after they were done and sinking. Some of those bombs and torpedoes were gratuitous at best.

Instead, the proper question is what straw was it that broke the camel's back? Image
Read 15 tweets
Oct 28, 2023
Yes and No and that answer only applies to the specific time period.

Tumblehome has its original benefits that made it attractive to designers (reduced top weight, better maneuvering in restricted areas, etc).
Image
In turns of protection, tumblehome was also effective in countering gunfire at close ranges (approaching horizontally). So much so that the US Navy designed a battleship that returned to a tumblehome hull reminiscent of a civil war ironclad. Image
However, gunnery ranges ultimately increased so that shells approached at steeper angles. Here, they negated the slope of tumblehome hulls.

This meant that armor that inclined outwards was superior. Image
Read 4 tweets
Aug 20, 2023
The unsung heroes among the United States cruisers during the Second World War were the Brooklyn class light cruisers.

The impact of these cruisers extends far beyond their service. Their very design influenced all future cruisers of the US Navy. Image
The Brooklyn class cruiser introduced the long flushdeck style hull (increasing structural strength and stiffness) that would be used on future heavy and light cruisers.

The safer location of the stern was chosen to carry aircraft and their equipment (rather than amidships). Image
Other features were also introduced for cruiser designs. The propulsion system was arranged into the unit system. The final two ships of the class would even introduce the 5"/38 guns in twin mounts. Image
Read 7 tweets
Feb 10, 2023
An accurate representation of the state of my DM box following the posts on the King George V class.

I've been challenged to name my favorite Treaty battleship.

Of course, I imagine it's so that ruffians might be able to poke holes in my opinion.
Jokes on them because we are talking about the Richelieu class today.

My friends across the pond either concede that the Richelieu class was a valid Treaty design or they get more distracted by attacking the French, ignoring me completely.

I win either way.
Now, why do I think the Richelieu class was the best treaty battleship?

Well, a lot of it ties into what I said on the last post about the King George V class perhaps being the best "pure" or "true" treaty battleship.
Read 11 tweets

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