Thread by @RyanRingdahl

1/113 Ok, I've got some wine and time, so let's do this. Thread on the #WheelOfTime show/book discrepancies

#TwitterOfTime

2/ First of all, what this thread is not: it isn't about casting, though I have Opinions; it isn't about the special effects; it isn't even about whether or not the show 'worked'

3/ This is about what the producer @rafejudkins (with @BrandSanderson) decided to change from a wildly popular book series that sold literally millions of copies

4/ Here's the thing about adapting a book. If the book was good, I'd just, you know, stick to the book. That's why so many LOTR fans loved the movies (not the Hobbit ones). Because what happened in the books happened on the screen. We got to live the story

5/ (I hear you Tom Bombadil and Glorfindel and elves at Helms Deep.)

For the vast majority of LOTR, what the books said is what the movie gave us. Gloriously

Many of us had similar hopes about WoT

That is not what we got

6/ Now, if you like the show, that's fine. I enjoyed it for what it was

This thread is about what it wasn't

I've watched the whole season 3x, and reread the first book in between episode releases (thanks Amazon)

So, #WotBookSpoilers and #WoTShowSpoilers coming here

7/ So, with no further ado, let's take this Episode by Episode

Episode One starts by saying back in the day they tried to cage the Dark One and failed. That isn't true. They succeeded, which is why the Dark One is in prison. He retaliated by putting the taint on the male side of

8/ the Source to drive men mad if they channeled

It then says the Dragon could be a boy or girl, and nope. It's a boy and they know it's a boy

Then a man getting chased and caught by the Red Ajah while Moraine watches. Didn't happen. Reds don't get introduced until later

9/ They then gentle him, without a trial by Liandran, who isn't even in the first book

Then Moraine says there are 4 ta'veren in Two Rivers. Nope, there are three. Robert Jordan and @BrandSanderson are pretty direct about the girls not being ta'veren

10/ Then we get this ambushing shove into the river ceremony for Egwene, that never happened in the book. Nynaeve wouldn't be part of such 'man-headed' an event to prove adulthood. Completely out of character

Still not talking casting

11/ Rand and Tam bring wool and brandy to town, and that happened. But then Mat is already degenerate gambling, which wasn't in the book.

Perrin is freaking married? Wild divergence from the boy who is bashful and not good with girls

12/ I know it's a little thing, but the Aes Sedai rings are different, and in a significant way. The book rings are just a serpent biting its own tail. Simple gold circle, no gem to distinguish between Ajahs, a symbol that all Aes Sedai are unified in their sisterhood

13/ Also, the Two Rivers bumpkins don't recognize the Aes Sedai rings

Perrin apparently has his own forge? Is he not an apprentice?

Mat's mom is a drunk and dad is a cheater?

Also, in the book, the peddler tells them of the war, not Perrin sharing gossip

13/ Rand and Egwene smash? What? In the book their whole thing was an unconsumated, unspoken promise, with no hint of even a kiss

Lan and Moraine bathing together was new, too. Great opportunity for some bare man ass, though

14/ In the books the line is always Wisdom "seldom" marry, not "never."

Mat is stealing from townspeople?

English curses like bollocks. Jordan came up with his own style of curses, changing them is just petty

Lan doesn't find slaughtered animals in shape of Dragon's Fang

15/ Changed Beltine from 3 large bonfires to dozens of little lanterns floating in the river. This was cool, but a change

In the book we spend the whole Beltine night with Rand and Tam, and only hear about Moraine's heroics in the morning, but was cool to see her and Lan fight

16/ in the book, Tam kills 5 Trollocs, because he earned that heronmark sword, which even in the Age of Legends signified a blademaster. Here he needs Rand to save him from one

Nynaeve doesn't get snatched by a Trolloc

Perrin doesn't have a wife, certainly doesn't kill her

17/ Moraine doesn't get injured

Rand doesn't get the horse, he drags his dad to town where not snatched Nynaeve tells him she can't heal him

Thom Merrilin, a gleeman who is in the town, tells Rand to ask Moraine for help

18/ In the show Moraine tells them that she's looking for the Dragon, which she doesn't say in the whole first book

Also, Egwene is 2 years too young to be the Dragon, the same way Nynaeve is 5 years too old. Apart from it being a man

Thom goes with them when they leave town

19/ in the show, Moraine doesn't give the 3 boys a coin to create a bond that she can use to track them

Also, in the show, only Rand brings weapons, as opposed to Mat bringing a bow and Perrin his axe. The axe is kinda significant

20/ Alright, Episode 2: start with Valda, who wasn't even in the first book, eating a creepy meal and torturing a yellow Aes Sedai to death and adding her ring to his collection. Never happened. Creepy cool dude, though

21/ Fleeing the Trollocs, but unlike the book, Moraine doesn't summon a fog to hide them from the draghkar, flying shadowspawn the fades are using to flow the troop

In the book, the ferryman shows up with armed hands to try and rob them, put off by all their weaponry

22/ In the book, Moraine pays off the ferryman, and doesn't kill him

In the book, Thom is with them, telling stories and training the boys in instruments and juggling. Lan trained the boys in their weapons, except the bow, which they are all already good at

23/ In the show, Egwene doesn't undo her braid after learning to channel, showing her acceptance of leaving home

In the show's dreams, Dark One doesn't mention Eye of the World. In the book, the boys don't tell Moraine of their dreams, on Thom's advice

24/ Rand is a stubborn petulant boy, which is right on point fwiw

Also, another small thing, but Lan isn't wearing a colorshifting cloak. Disappointing

In the book they don't run into Whitecloaks on the road, Mat and Rand run into some in Baerlon, a city which the show skips

25/ Baerlon is a not insignificant stop

This is where Nynaeve catches up with the whole group and tries to convince them to come home. They convince her they need to go to Tar Valon, and she decides to come with

Also, Min is on Baerlon. Her visions foreshadow the whole series

26/ Min is hugely significant and her visions foreshadow things that come up in this episode. Skipping meeting her is when I realized they just weren't gonna be making the book into a show

27/ In the book they never sing a song about Manetheren. Moiraine tells them about Manetheren, of which they'd never heard, before they even leave Emond's Field. Neat song though

28/ The bit with Perrin and the pack of wolves, nice touch, but didn't happen in the book

In the book, the Trollocs and Fades surround them and they have to fight through to reach Shadar Logoth, using weapons they don't have in the show. Mat cries out in the Old Tongue, which

29/ Mat and the Old Tongue is significant

Shadar Logoth looks awesome btw

Aridohl fell when corrupted by Mordeth, a wicked advisor whose poison still darkens the city

Mat doesn't go off alone, the 3 boys go together and meet Mordeth, who's 1000s of years old

30/ Mat doesn't take the dagger from a pile of trash, Mordeth leads the 3 to a treasure trove and tries to tempt them into taking something outside. Mat is holding the dagger when they flee Mordeth, together

I'll have more to say on the show's vilification of Mat later

31/ In the book Fades force Trollocs into the city, chasing them while the fog threatens to unmake them. The party splits, but Egwene keeps her horse, Nynaeve is with Lan and Moraine, and Thom is with Mat and Rand

Egwene keeping her horse is significant

32/ Alright, Episode 3.

Nynaeve never got snatched, so obviously she never escaped and killed a Trolloc

Now, like the book, the party is split, Perrin with Egwene, Nynaeve with Lan and Moraine, and Mat with Rand, although unlike the book the latter two are not with Thom

33/ This episode was all about cutting peripheral characters

First, Rand, Mat, and Thom are supposed to get on a boat, whose captain Bayle Domon, is a recurring character throughout the series

34/ 2nd, Perrin and Egwene met a person Elyas Machera, a man who speaks with wolves and tells Perrin he can too, and who introduces the pair to the Tinkers and leads them when they leave

Also, Egwene doesn't channel to start the fire

35/ Not having Rand and Mat on the boat, we miss more training with Thom, and some foreshadowing of a metal tower and huge hand holding a crystal ball which both feature prominently later

36/ In the book, Nynaeve doesn't even try to heal a Trolloc wound because she knows what she can and can't do, but here she tries anyway

The wolves should be guarding Perrin's dreams, not eating his dead wife in them. But again, he didn't have a wife

37/ Also, because they are with Elyas, they travel with the wolves, not get chased by them

There's no dead Aiel in any town Mat and Rand stop at, so obviously Mat doesn't go grave robbing. Another slight to his character

38/ At least we finally meet Thom, although in the book he wears a multicolored patchwork cloak and doesn't have a guitar, but a harp and a flute. Song was cool though

Other things that happened in the boat: Rand used the One Power and discovered Mat's dagger

39/ Rand and Mat don't start staying at random villages until after they split with Thom, when they pay their way with performances Thom taught them, not chopping wood or serving drinks

Moraine wasn't wounded, so there's no need for Lan to ride off for help

40/ In the book, Elyas knows the Tinker rituals, having stayed with this group before

Also, the Tinkers wore bright, garish, colorful clothing. These people are as drap as anyone else

None of the innkeepers think Mat and Rand are gay, fwiw

41/ Thom doesn't bury the dead Aiel, as there was no dead Aiel. They never stopped at a small village at all with Thom. They split at Whitebridge, the first town the reached on the riverboat

42/ While they do get attacked by Darkfriends, that's after they left Thom, and none of them were woman innkeepers. Thom never killed a darkfriend for them. Thom went with them in the first place because they were caught up with an Aes Sedai, but here no Aes Sedai, no motivation

43/ Nynaeve, Lan, and Moraine never run into Liandran or Logain. In the book they go searching for the one boy who still has his coin, Perrin, Mat and Rand having spent theirs on the boat, but Moraine wasn't wounded, so there's no reason to seek out Aes Sedai

44/ Episode 4. This is where the show just departs from the book altogether

We start in Ghealdan, with Logain hearing male and female voices while taking the country. Never happened in the book. He took the country, but it's never shown

45/ The visualization of the taint on saidin is cool, though

The whole bit with the camp with the Aes Sedai while Moraine gets healed: never happened. Again, she never got wounded

They shield Logain with just two Aes Sedai. In the book they used 8

46/ They used so many because they didn't want to risk him breaking free. You know, like he did in the show

The warders training and joking together? Cute, but didn't happen

Corienne, the Green Ajah? Not in the book

47/ In the book, Perrin has an axe, and a complicated relationship with it that has nothing to do with the death of a wife he didn't have

The Tinkers sing all the time, even when just walking

Mat, Rand, and Thom didn't stop at a farm together.

48/ They stopped at farms after splitting with Thom

Moraine's dog wasn't in the book either

Again with the women Dragons. Not in the book

They do make the note that women can't see men's weaves, which is good

49/ Liandran trying to appeal to Nynaeve didn't happen in any of the books, and again, Liandran isn't even mentioned until the second book

Liandran saying the Reds defend from other Aes Sedai, which isn't their role in the book, just hunting male channelers

50/ The boys do stop at the Grinwell's farm, but without Thom, and their daughter is older and flirts with Rand, and Mat isn't given a protector doll (named Birgette, which was a nice touch)

Thom doesn't connect the poisoning by the dagger to his nephew's channeling madness

51/ Thom does have a nephew who channeled and got gentled, and that's the reason he first joined up with the group, you know, in Two Rivers

The fun campfire with the warders? Didn't happen. Nynaeve didn't meet another warder until reaching the Tower in book 2

52/ The Tinker women in the show didn't do a seductive dance for blushing Perrin, more's the pity

Aram in the book puts the full court press on Egwene, and she encourages him

Tinkers leave the wagons at 20? That's new

53/ In the book, the Tinkers tell Perrin and Egwene about an Aiel who tells them a story about the Eye of the World

Mat can't use the dagger to find Fades

Thom does fight a Fade for them, but in Whitebridge, and they flee with Thom's instruments, which they use to perform

54/ Nynaeve didn't have an Old Tongue prayer from her parents

Also, in the show Nynaeve didn't hear the story of Manetheren, so Lan's explanation wouldn't make sense to her

55/ In the book, we never see Logain's army, there is no attack, and he never escapes shielding

Cool battle, but it didn't happen

Moraine never had a one on one convo with Logain

Logain didn't hear the voices of the past Dragons

56/ Logain, having not escaped, didn't kill an Aes Sedai, and certainly didn't slit Lan's throat

Nynaeve can only channel when furious, and she didn't look furious in the show. She didn't channel in the 1st book

Also, Logain shouldn't be able to see her channel

57/ They didn't gentle Logain on the road in the book. They did it at the Tower in the 2nd book

58/ Episode 5, starting with an evocative burial of the dead from a battle that never happened in the book. Cool overhead shot, though

This whole episode was about the grief of this warder, who wasn't in the book, over the death of an Aes Sedai who wasn't in the book

59/ So in the show Lan and Moraine travel with Logain and the other Aes Sedai who they never met up with to Tar Valon, which they never went to in the first book

Rand and Mat get to Tar Valon, which they never went to in the book. Rand in particular Never goes to the city

60/ until a significant moment later in the series

We finally get a "blood and ashes" but it's by Rand, not Mat, which is backwards

Padan Fain followed them, good, but he isn't crazy, bad

61/ So Thom never met Moraine? Gonna make some rather significant events later in the series difficult to pull off

Nynaeve gets to the tower in the second book, as a novice

62/ In the book, Perrin and Egwene leave the Tinkers before meeting the Whitecloaks. When they meet the WC's, Elyas and the wolves fight them, and Perrin is talking with the wolves and one wolf, Hopper, dies for Perrin who then kills two Whitecloaks

63/ Hopper is significant through the whole series

Rand meets Loial, but in Tar Valon instead of Caemlyn, which they skipped altogether. In the show, Rand doesn't tell Loial his whole story, which in the book convinces Loial Rand is ta'veren and he wants to join him

64/ Jain Farstrider is a guy, btw

In the book, Mat doesn't go to see Logain and Logain never sees either him or Rand. Rand sees Logain in Caemlyn, when he climbs up to Elayne's garden and meets her and her brother. Elayne is not a minor character they skipped

65/ anymore than Min is

Again, in the book the boys never know why the Dark One is after them. They don't know anything about one of them being the Dragon

This warder, Steppin? anyway, backstory for a character not in the book

66/ Melting the ring was cool. Not a thing in the book

The White Tower is neat

The Whitecloaks strip and wash Egwene? That's new. Also, Valda wasn't with the Whitecloaks who took Perrin and Egwene

They undid her braid, which in the book she did herself

67/ The Whitecloaks in the book don't suspect Egwene of channeling

The Whitecloaks beat Perrin, because he killed two of them, but they don't torture him to force her to channel. And his eyes are fully yellow, because he's already talking with the wolves

68/ Liandran trying to appeal to Nynaeve, again. In the book they don't even meet until the next book, and Liandran never appealed to her

Again, Rand doesn't think Mat can channel in the book

In the book, Lan knocks out the Whitecloaks and Nynaeve steals horses

69/ while Moraine summons lightning as a distraction. Egwene doesn't stab anyone

Awkward intimate moment between Moraine and Liandran didn't happen in the book

More backstory for Steppin. Cute Forsaken idols. Lan in denial about Nynaeve. Steppin drugs Lan and kills himself

70/ The Warder grieving ritual was cool, and not from the book. And Lan, who takes everything stoically, is reduced to screaming tears, tearing his shirt. Entirely out of character

71/ Episode 6, starting with a look at young Siuan Sanche, which wasn't in the book, including an adorable epithet from her dad. There's no textual evidence that Siuan's house was burned down and marked with the Dragon's Fang

72/ In the show we get A formal calling of the Hall of the Tower and none of the women are wearing their official Aes Sedai shawls. At least Liandran's hair was finally in her trademark braids

None of this happened. Moraine never went back to Tar Valon

73/ They didn't gentle Logain on the road, so no Aes Sedai were brought to task. Moraine was never questioned for her activities. Logain became mellow and spiritless, not defiant and vulgar

74/ I'ma skip over questions of why the others were dismissed and Moraine and Alanna detained when they all had the same to do with the gentling. Stay focused on book discrepancies

75/ In the book, Egwene (and Elayne) are the most powerful channelers in 1000 years. Nynaeve is more powerful still.

Nice to see Moraine wearing the stone on her head she should have been wearing in Two Rivers

76/ In the book, Moraine, Lan, and Nynaeve free Perrin and Egwene from the Whitecloaks, then Moraine finds Mat and Rand in Caemlyn

Moraine can't heal Mat's connection to the dagger, but she contains it and he keeps the dagger

Rand doesn't try to stop Moraine, he asks for help

77/ Rand doesn't see the darkness from the dagger

Dagger was feeding off the darkness in Mat? More slander of the boy's character

Maigin(?) tells Moraine to stay in the Tower. Again, Moraine never went back to the Tower, wasn't detained

78/ Egwene didn't steal back the rings, there were no rings, and Valda wasn't there

Moiraine didn't deceive anyone to keep the group apart

Egwene didn't tell Moiraine about the wolves, Moiraine knew because Perrin's eyes were fully yellow

79/ Moiraine has some kind of teleportation device in her room? In the book the Aes Sedai didn't know any teleportation, otherwise they wouldn't have needed to take the Ways

If this was a ter'angreal, it's one that wasn't in the book

80/ So, Moiraine and Siuan were 'pillow friends' when they were younger, which meant a kind of lovers, but they never hook up in the book as adults, nor is there even the remotest implication that the relationship lasted beyond childhood

81/ This new prophecy of a Dragon split into 5 souls wasn't in the book at all, and again, the Dragon was clearly a man

In the book, Siuan doesn't have a dream of the Eye of the World. She isn't a dreamer

82/ Instead, the Tinkers tell Perrin about the Eye of the World, Loial has another story of the Eye of the World, and the 3 boys all have dreams about the Eye. The 3 signs convince them to go to the Eye

83/ Liandran teasing Moiraine about the Two Rivers kids didn't happen, and Liandran doesn't meet with a man, and Moiraine doesn't threaten her into silence

Loial has already committed to accompanying Rand, because he is ta'veren

84/ Again, Moiraine never at the Tower, never called to account, never exiled, never swore the oath on the Oath Rod (obviously similar to a wedding oath) using Siuan's dad's epithets, there's no sisters turning their backs

85/ In the book The Waygate at Tar Valon is in a Ogier Grove, not out in the middle of nowhere, and looks like a wall covered with leaves. It doesn't require channeling to open, as the Ogier can use them, by moving the appropriate leaf on the wall

86/ In the book they take the horses into the Ways. They have strong relationships with their horses that last until the final book in the series

Mat definitely goes with them into the Ways. He doesn't abandon his friends. More slander of the boy's character

87/ Ok, Episode 7. We start with Rand's mother, an Aiel, fighting on the side of the Dragonmount before dying in child birth. The fighting was Awesome, but this never happened in the book

Also, an Aiel would have pulled up her veil to fight

88/ Again, the darkness in Mat. My boy was done so wrong

The Waygate in the book doesn't require channeling, so they could have just reopened it

In the book the guiding was defaced with Trolloc runes, which Moiraine recognized

89/ In the book they were always going to Fal Dara in the Ways

They didn't get attacked by a Trolloc in the Ways, and no one channeled to stop one

The Machin Shin didn't Whisper to them

Nynaeve didn't channel to hold back the Black Wind

90/ She can only channel when furious and she wasn't, here

In the book Agelmar, lord of Fal Dara, welcomes both Moiraine and Lan as good friends, not curt and suspicious

Agelmar's sister can't channel

If the Waygate requires channeling, how did Padan Fain follow?

91/ In the show Min is in Fal Dara, instead of Baerlon. Her visions in the book foreshadow many things, including the dagger with Mat

Moiraine never sics the Red Ajah on Mat, but again, Mat came with them

Padan Fain in the book is dirty, wild and crazy by Fal Dara

92/ In the book Min sees all of them together, including Mat and Thom. She sees Perrin with the wolves, not just yellow eyes. She doesn't see Rand with a baby. In the book she tells Rand that Egwene isn't for him, and this happens early in the book so he knows all book long

93/ In the book Min tells Rand much more about each of them

In the book Moiraine never tells them about being the Dragon and doesn't tell them if they aren't the Dragon they'll die at the Eye, so there is no 'choice' for them to make

94/ Mat doesn't stay behind, so the others never argue about him. Perrin doesn't stand up for Egwene, and Nynaeve never says they're fighting over her. The whole Egwene and Perrin implication is nowhere in the book. And again, Perrin doesn't have a wife

95/ In the book Lan never goes to eat with other Malkieri, Nynaeve doesn't follow and join him. Nynaeve wouldn't enter Lan's room, as a matter of principle, and they never slept together. He didn't tell her about his past, Agelmar told all of them while Lan and Moiraine were out

96/ Rand would never miss a bullseye at 20 yards. Even without channeling he could hit a bird on the wing at 100 yards

In the book, there was no argument about Mat, so there was no make up hook up with Egwene

Again, in the book the line was a Wisdom 'seldom' weds

97/ In the book we get Tam's fevered recollection early in the book, before we leave the Two Rivers

Rand certainly didn't channel in the Ways

Min told Rand many things, but she never tells him that he's the Dragon. She just sees images, not entire scenes like Rand being born

98/ and raised

She didn't see the Eye of the World

Rand doesn't go to Moiraine and tell her he's the Dragon, and they don't head off to the Eye of the World just the two of them. The whole group, including Mat, goes together

99/ Finally, Episode 8. Cool view of the Age of Legends at the beginning, speaking the Old Tongue, but not in the book. The Dragon had to try and reseal the Dark One's prison or the world would have fallen to the Shadow, not simply Broken

100/ In the book they are all together, and the Blight isn't some passive, poisonous trees. There are monsters, and Lan, Perrin, and Mat help fight them off

Perrin and Egwene don't have to make sure they're Ok, because there was no fight

101/ Lan's touching lines to Nynaeve about her being beautiful as the sunrise and all are pretty much directly from the book, which was nice, but he doesn't run off after Moiraine because she didn't leave him behind

Rand didn't talk with Ishamael in dream and dream kill himself

102/ Moiraine didn't have a male sa'angreal (if she didn't know if the Dragon was a boy or a girl, why'd she bring a male one?)

Egwene doesn't get left behind, so doesn't listen to the wind to sense the Trollocs coming

Moiraine never shares a story about being beaten

103/ Min wasn't in Fal Dara so she didn't foresee the soldiers dying

It wasn't 60 Fades, it was 600 approaching Tarwin's Gap

Padan Fain had been arrested and interrogated by Moiraine before they all left

103/ In the book the Eye of the World moved, in a place hidden by a giant tree man called the Green Man, who created a pocket of forest garden in the midst of the Blight

There was no scene of Agelmar saying his sister was right or charging her to hold the city

104/ At the Eye of the World, two Forsaken were waiting and the Green Man helped Rand and Moiraine fight them off

The Eye wasn't some chamber with a mosaic, and it wasn't the Dark One's prison, that was Shayol Ghul

105/ The Eye of the World was a reservoir of saidin, the male half of the One Power cleansed of the Dark One's taint, which is part of why the Dragon had to be a man

Rand wasn't tempted with life with Egwene and a baby, as he knew they wouldn't be together

106/ Ishamael (they think it's the Dark One) didn't shield or still Moiraine

Min wasn't in Fal Dara so she didn't flee

Agelmar's sister didn't wear armor and summon women who could channel

The Horn of Valare wasn't in Fal Dara

107/ Rand used the massive source of clean power at the Eye to wipe out the Dark army, Agelmar didn't die, and Agelmar's sister didn't have to link to save the city

It was touching that Rand held to what Egwene wanted to resist temptation, but it didn't happen in the book

108/ Moiraine didn't threaten to kill Rand

Cool touch having Ishamael have the same ring/bracelet as Lews Therin, but that wasn't in the book either

Where did Padan Fain get the dagger? In the book Fain steals it from Mat in book 2

109/ In the book Nynaeve and Egwene are with Rand, they don't link, Nynaeve doesn't find some way to stop Egwene from burning out, burning out doesn't kill you, and Nynaeve doesn't die, and the One Power can't bring people back from the dead, so Egwene can't do that

110/ In the book Fain steals the Horn of Valere when Darkfriends break him out of prison in the second book. He doesn't kill Loial or Uno, the guy with the eyepatch

Rand didn't break the cuendillar seal, which in the book is the size of a hand

111/ Again, it's suggested that some of the 5 ta'veren will choose the Dark, suggesting that it's gonna be Mat. More slander. And there's only 3 ta'veren

Rand doesn't leave the others. They all are together and they go back together

112/ Rand finds the Horn and the banner of the Dragon under the now empty reservoir of the Eye of the World, the first hint that he's the Dragon

We don't see the Seanchan, the people in the boats, in the first book, but their woman channelers are on a leash in the book

113/ I think that's all I've got

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