Thread by @tribunaltweets

This is the second half of the afternoon session of Peggie vs NHS Fife & Dr B Upton.

[Discussion re timing]
NC [to bundle] LGBT ally. Why does that appear on your email signature. [missed - sound]
NC positions you on one side of debate
IB I'm an ally to t ppl, doesn't mean I'm not to w
NC If someone added G C ally and suffragette colours to their email - okay

IB It's a ;protected characteristic
NC You don't mark every email with - lists disabled ally, women ally etc
IB No
NC Give impression board's Eq lead that gender reassignment etc is top priority
IB I'm an ally, not necessarily top one
NC But it gives that impression
IB No, don't

agree.
NC Act permits service provider to exclude someone if exclusion is proportionate in achieving legitimate aim. Did you think if excluding t ppl from sss facilities would proportionate for other ppl
IB I wasn't aware of any concerns at that time so it didn't seem

proportionate.
NC [to bundle] Sex Matter's submission to GRNHI [?]
JR Don't see how this will assist
J We'll see how we go
NC Please read . ..
NC Is there anything there that you now believe to be untrue or misleading. Not asking you to agree it's correct. But anything

you disagree with.
IB Would have to do my own research. It's a page and a half.
NC If you don't know...
IB I don't know if there is anything in there that is untrue?
NC Please read part under 'Stonewall...'
NC Same q. JR may have a witness who can be more helpful.

IB Don't know if anything there is true or false.
NC Can you agree this may be an explanation of the consensus across the Scottish boards
JR I don't understand q
J This witness hasn't written policies and you are asking her to give an opinion...
NC Will come back to it in sub

NC PCs are sex and gender reassignment. And sex means sex
IB As in male and female
NC yes
NC [bundle] NHS Scotland application form.
IB I believe so. Haven't seen one of these in a while.
NC Q 2. Which best describes your gender m /f /another way / prefer not to say

NC Is this NHS Fife form.
IB I'm not involved in this data collecting
NC Nothing collecting info re sex, just gender. Suggests Scottish board not interested in sex discrimination.
IB Don't think that. Just that they have chosen specific language.

NC [to bundle] Your email to KSearle on 3/1/24. You say you have through Datix. KS wasn't charged with i/x.
IB I have no involvement in i/x
NC So what business was it of yours if neither involved.
IB KS coming to me as Eq lead for advice. Would have been my opportunity to

defend w rights as well - be balanced
I said should engage with HR, appropriate for me to signpost them to HR
NC HR already involved though
IB Didn't know that
NC Why didn't you just say go to HR
This looks more elaborate. I suggest the plan between you and KS

was to make sure SP was punished.
IB That's quite a jump. Not the case.
NC No further qs.
J Back to doc. When did you first see [email from Jamie Doyle]
IB When added to bundle. After February.
J Date is 29 August 2023. It says made contact with IB and Maggie already in touch,

J Chronology is confusing
IB I would suggest it's a typo
J Any recollection of timing of your discussion
IB No
J All you can say is question raised in summer 2023.
IB Yes
J I thought you said someone was about to join but hadn't yet.
IB Yes. About to join.
J Prospective.

J Not yet joined.
IB yes
J [to doc] Some of your answers seem to be referring to another section - did you also read paragraphs under gender reassignment and single sex services.
IB Can I read that
J yes

J Trying to understand if just read 13.57 or the rest
IB I would have read it all. Probably should have referenced [another part]
J Exceptions. Do you know what that is referring to.
IB y
J Did you look at EA 2010
IB Yes, would have done as part of scoping for original policy

J This code of practice [missed - sound]
J Have you seen the cr in this case.
IB No. Not been there.
Now JR
JR Was court of appeals case in Croft part of your analysis
IB No
JR This is public sector equality duty. Please explain to tribunal which relevant to this

IB Could be argued every PC could be relevant
JR And for DU
IB Gender reassignment, birth
JR You were asked q c women and t ppl working at board - whether women's privacy dignity and safety were sacrificed
IB No don't think so. Some individuals might feel that way

JR How many individuals approached you with regard to their privacy dignity and safety
IB None
JR That concludes my questions.
[discussing witnesses, inc Gillian Malone]
[Session ends. Resumes normal time tomorrow, so assume 10 am]

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