NC -we will address you very briefly on this. And come back on Monday.
CE Has the panel had the opp to read it? we are not applying for an order but if the tribunal makes an order that has appears to arisen. Primarily it's about putting a marker. With a view to come back on..
J have you seen it?
CE I can't see what kind of order can be sought
J do you want us to read this?
CE - yes
Document referred to is the NHS Fife statement. Link to follow
CE - a good part of the reason this is taking place in Dundee not Edinburgh because in part because of threats made to SP legal team. At that time SP didn't describe that publically or attribute this to anyone because doing so would be entirely improper
unfortunately paras 3 and 4 of this press statement seem to do that. If i can finish.
If we look at para 3 that's identifying the CEO of Sex Matters and the claimants barrister and describes that orgs involvement in the media and suggests it's involved in steering public opinion
Para 4 seems to conclude that in the context of this debate that this has evolved into more worrying behaviour that has required the involvement of police Scotland. This statement on day 3 of resumed procedings...It is a matter of some concern that a party to these procedings...
...with SP has been linked to behaviours of members of the public. There are factual inaccuracies that will be dealt with on Monday.
The short point is that this is unusual conduct. It is irresponsible in the context of what we already know. It is for this reason we bring
..this to the Tribunals notice and any other steps to be taken?
J - Miss Russell?
Jr - I would also like time to think about it I am still unclear what order isbeing sought. On this statement - nothing said that isn't true. I d
on't think there is any defamation. In any event none of it isnt true. A stretch to say that Para 3 is leading to Para 4. That the roles of the people in para 3 are associated to the worrying treatment in para 4. I don't make that connection
..because this has taken place in public, I am afraid that threats have been made to them as have been made to me. I don't have the details of what CE is referring to, I had not understood threats made to legal team, there may be things I was not told about. Yes...yes..
..there's a referral to a citizen's arrest. But that does not entail a different view. It is important that everyone taking part feels safe. There is nothing in this statement that strikes me. There is nothing that the Tribunal needs to make an order. Doesn't Fife have article
10 rights. I find it ironic is seeking to restrict Fife's speech. In reality there is no basis for that feeling (of feeling unsafe) but I would like to take instructions and think further on it.
J - it will be necessary for us to have a think before making any public comment
...the claimants have the time to articulate an order. We can then consider it. I can say at this stage that nobody should feel intimidated, that is the matter for the criminal court, and Police Scotland. Obviously matters of defamation are not in our jurisdiction.
..after making these general comments we will leave this until Monday.
[some discussion about people's availability]
Anything else?
[nothing]
J we will convene on Monday
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The court is at present taking a short break, and we expect to resume about 3.45pm.
We are restarting.
J: Anything on Debique, NC?
NC: I think SC and I are agreed that it doesn't take us forward; group disadvantage in this case has been agreed, so we don't need to go there.
Good afternoon. This afternoon we will be tweeting the oral submissions by Counsel in the case at Employment Tribunal of LS vs NHS England.
There was no hearing this morning as the barristers were composing and exchanging their written submissions to the Court. This will be the last session of the public part of the hearing; the panel will spend Monday deliberating on the case.
We expect the afternoon session of Day 5 in LS vs NHSE to begin at 2 pm. It may be a short session. Our coverage of earlier sessions and background on the case can be found on our Substack here: open.substack.com/pub/tribunaltw…x.com/tribunaltweets…
Afternoon session is starting. J reminding attendees, no hot drinks allowed. Witness PM will resume.
J - SC you mentioned a floor plan?
SC - have one, sent to Cs team.
J - NC have you had a chance to speak to C's do you have further qs?
NC - I was perplexed because
I was nearer the end than I expected. I do have the floor plan.
J - Clerk, can you print off 4 copies? NC - would you like to look at it
NC - would like to take instruction quickly
J - apologies, everyone has to leave the room and the remote
Today we are reporting day 4 of LS v NHS England (NHSE). LS, also using the pseudonym Faye Russell-Caldicott, is claiming indirect discrimination on the grounds of sex, religion and disability (PTSD) and harassment related to her sex and philosophical belief (gender-critical).
We are a collective of citizen journalists and work on a voluntary basis. We endeavour to report everything that we hear but do not provide a verbatim report of proceedings.
You can support us by subscribing to our Substack (link in bio) which funds some travel and our IT costs.
X was down at the beginning of Part 2 of the afternoon session. The session is only expected to last 45 minutes. Our reporter is taking notes and will post later.
The rest of this thread is a copy of the notes we took during the second part of the afternoon hearing, while X was down.
Naomi Cunningham (NC) is continuing cross-examination of the respondent's witness Philip Goodfellow.