Part two of morning session in Peggie vs NHS Fife & Dr B Upton will continue here. No witness evidence this morning, discussions about timetable, further material and additional witnesses. See our coverage here. archive.ph/lCyHK
Judge & Panel return.
J - we've got the docs, JR have you looked at these
JR - don't object, simply object to 2 add'l witnesses
J - we consider in principle that it is permissible to call add'l witnesses in response to what R's late witnesses says. And in principle, to recall
C. It's unclear what the evidence of the new witnesses will be. We are going to allow subject to; must particularly focused on relevant to the issues, the questions must take account of very limited time available, all qs to be as short and to the point as possible. We will
impose time limits to allow us to finish by 4 pm tomorrow. Evidence out to be complete by 4 pm today. We must work to conclude evidence. We are going to see how things goes, on qs for witnesses for Rs and all evidence of the issues before the Tribunal. The evidence of LN may
be tangential to the main issues. On submissions, we are going to take stock at the end of day tomorrow. We will see how we go before we impose time limits.
And where are we on witnesses?
JR - I would like to call FW now.
J - are you able to ask all your qs.
JR, yes. <leaves to get witness>
<brief pause whilst waiting for witness>
<now waiting for J to return>
J returns. Takes FW through formalities.
FW - affirms, <affirms>
J - give instructions of microphone, and his note taking.
JR - give full name for tribunal
FW - Fiona Elizabeth Wishart, have been at Fife for 41 years since I completed training
JR - job title, role -
FW - emergency nurse practitioner, describes, triage, discharge, deals with minor injuries
JR - Xmas, eve, takes to photo of CR
<JR sound is patchy>
JR - one view of FCR, another view at 661, look familiary
FW - yes
JR what time finish shift on xmas eve
FW - about midnight
JR where did you go after your shift
FW - home
JR - before you went home
FW - to CR
JR - anyone with you?
FW - Dr Beth Upton and another doctor, spelling name
JR - how did you come into the CR with them,
FW - don't remember if they were in there or we went in together
JR - what happened next
FW - nothing untoward, coming off shift, exchanging a few pleasantries with my colleagues, then I went home
JR - who else in there
FW - me, DU, other dr, and SP.
JR - when did SP come in
FW - I don't recall
JR - where were you standing
FW - near the stool
JR - DU?
FW - near the blue lockers
JR - SP?
FW - near the toilet door
JR - what state of dress was everyone in?
FW - SP in uniform, I don't recall what everyone else was wearing, DU I don't recall but when I've seen her changing before always lower half covered and wearing a bra at least
JR - how to people get changed
FW - come in and get on with business of changing
JR - when you left
who was still there?
FW - SP, DU
JR - other dr
FW - I don't recall
JR - describe other changing rooms
FW - we aren't supposed to use to change, our official space in dank basement, never used
JR - what is your r'ship with SP
FW - professional
JR - ever socialise
FW - on at least one occasion, a lunch in early September, with A&E colleagues, SP made derogatory remarks about DU
JR - what type of remarks
FW - I can't recall but was told by others, she said weirdo and freak
JR - anything else
FW - I had heard that SP used the term it for DU,
JR - do you recall who told you and when
FW - <missed name>, don't recall dates, never expected to be in tribunal
JR - who else was at the lunch
FW - list of names, <did not hear with sufficient certainty to report>
JR - pic on soc media, put to family member of SP in February, SP said she didn't share those views, can you comment
FW - I can only say that I think she would share those views,
JR - why do you say that
FW - because I've heard her make derogatory remarks about people of ethnic
origins, other sexual orientations, etc.
JR - what kind of remarks
FW - about immigrants coming to steal our jobs, those opinions don't align with ours
JR - anything else
FW - off the top of my head, no.
JR - a page from soc media about mosques, comment about that issue
FW - lunch, she made reference to mosque being built in Kirkcaldy, she had a mind to post <missed> through the letter box, I remembered because I found it offensive
JR - how did others respond
FW - I can't
remember, she made derogatory remarks about Beth, my colleague LN responded.
JR - anything beyond, freak etc.
FW - no, nothing else.
J - thank you, we will break for lunch.
Court rises.
End of morning session.
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This is the second afternoon session, Sandie Peggie vs Fife NHS Trust & Dr Upton at the Employment Tribunal in Dundee.
J No questions from us. NC?
NC No
J That was your chance to follow up on your objection q
NC Nothing further
J Thank you SP. You may go. Concludes C case
J We would like written submissions, partial or skeleton, with at least a list of authorities by noon tomorrow and parties can
provide supplementary by 25 August. Appreciate more time requested but we are trying to balance all commitments to avoid further delay. If oral subs desired, we've identified some dates in Sept - 1, 2 or 29th.
JR Can do 1 or 2 if NC can. Early Sept would be good.
NC Yes, can do
The afternoon session will start at 13.20 with a private case management meeting. We expect to be admitted after the private matters are concluded. Sandie Peggie vs Fife NHS Trust & Dr Upton at the Employment Tribunal in Dundee.
The employment judge has given specific directions to witnesses called by the parties to not read our, or any other, coverage before giving evidence:
Second morning session continuing cross examination of Dr Maggie Currer on final day of evidence about to start:
NC Re the 1 line para of letter of 5 Jan re SP being referred to NMC: want to set a few things out. If the NMC does take FtP claim she'd be able to see evidence of
referrals. Or arising from other hearings. So other evid may come to light
MC I understand
NC U seem to be acknow a referral has been made. It's what u were told in a face to face mtg
MC I never thought she had been referred. Pending the Ix results, if found if she'd broken
NMC code of conduct she cld be referred. No idea why I wrote it. At no time thought she had
NC Its a big deal to be referred, tell colleagues this
MC Yes, was no intent in my error typing the email
NC What plausible way to make that error. It doesnt look like an autocorrect
We are due to begin live tweeting day 9 of Peggie v Fife Health Board and Dr Upton at the earlier time of 9.30am.
Today is the final day of evidence and will begin with Dr Maggie Currer returning to the witness box.
A reminder about our reporting:
An admonition from the Judge for future witnesses:
We resume after a break for an issue with the bundle not containing all of the new pages
JR This is new evidence recently produced. The BGC from Jan 2024. We wont say others names. [reads re trans have all the rights and the only way we can get round this is ??]
What did u make of this by SP?
LN I just need a moment to think. I think she's trying to find a quicker way around this , going forward
JR Can u describe any more
J Can u put yr mic down?
JR what do u mean?
LN Only way we can do this is to say we werent told about this.
She's trying to find someone to blame as we have the protocols. She possibly shld have looked at the protocols when she 1st realised she had an issue w DU
JR GH says about mtg DU [reads omg I had the same shit..on and on about pronouns. who did the it refer to?
LN To DU
Our scheduled start time in Peggie v NHS Fife & Dr B Upton for this afternoon's session is 1.30pm. Two witnesses are scheduled for today, both emergency nurse practitioners: Lindsey Nicoll and Fiona Wishart but if there's time a new witness for the Claimant may give evidence.