This is the second morning session of Maria Kelly v Leonardo UK.
The sound from the courtroom is often very bad. We apologise for the fact that we will inevitably miss some parts.
[New witness takes oath]
J Counsel will use phrases c t ppl as discuss]
STName
AR Andrew Russell Letton. Known as Andy R in workplace.
ST VP for People [+ ?] Services Leonardo
ST What is a home site
AR Where are you contracted
ST Any ppl have home site and also travel. Flexible co policy to also work from home.
AR Yes, esp c covid.
J Counsel will use phrases c t ppl as discuss]
STName
AR Andrew Russell Letton. Known as Andy R in workplace.
ST VP for People [+ ?] Services Leonardo
ST What is a home site
AR Where are you contracted
ST Any ppl have home site and also travel. Flexible co policy to also work from home.
AR Yes, esp c covid.
ST So on any given day only a percentage of employees on site in office
AR yes
ST What does L do
AR [explains]
ST Engineering a main profession on Edin site
AR Yes and throughout L
ST A percentage of employees based at Edin? In human resources etc.
AR Yes, a range.
AR yes
ST What does L do
AR [explains]
ST Engineering a main profession on Edin site
AR Yes and throughout L
ST A percentage of employees based at Edin? In human resources etc.
AR Yes, a range.
ST Agree c 2,800 on employees at Edin? As home base
AR yes. 587 f
ST F percentage at Edin just over 20%
AR yes
ST Phase 1 and 2. Any impression of more f employees on one
AR Don't know exact numbers
ST Would expect 20% in one building rather than other
AR Off the top of my head more f in phase 1
AR yes. 587 f
ST F percentage at Edin just over 20%
AR yes
ST Phase 1 and 2. Any impression of more f employees on one
AR Don't know exact numbers
ST Would expect 20% in one building rather than other
AR Off the top of my head more f in phase 1
ST Your role?
AR People function in co. Attraction and engagement, talent development, people services and analytics. Six disciplines in my job inc benefits, compensation, pensions, travel employee relations.
ST Are there people reporting to you for each discipline.
AR Yes
ST Who do you report to
AR X Allen.
AR People function in co. Attraction and engagement, talent development, people services and analytics. Six disciplines in my job inc benefits, compensation, pensions, travel employee relations.
ST Are there people reporting to you for each discipline.
AR Yes
ST Who do you report to
AR X Allen.
ST Where is she based?
AR [missed]
ST Could you describe c security on site.
AR Majority of work is re UK defence. Class X facility. Superior vetting. [describes c access to site for public]
ST Individual staff members - some may only have access to one building or area?
AR Yes, there is security clearance needed for access
AR [missed]
ST Could you describe c security on site.
AR Majority of work is re UK defence. Class X facility. Superior vetting. [describes c access to site for public]
ST Individual staff members - some may only have access to one building or area?
AR Yes, there is security clearance needed for access
AR [explains c different security protocols, badge access, etc]
ST Are you based in Phase 1 or 2
AR Dept based in Phase 2. Since covid gave up facility and predominantly work from home, and travel. Me more in Phase 2 site
ST Does co have system to swipe in and record who on site on particular day?
AR Yes
ST System is called?
ST Are you based in Phase 1 or 2
AR Dept based in Phase 2. Since covid gave up facility and predominantly work from home, and travel. Me more in Phase 2 site
ST Does co have system to swipe in and record who on site on particular day?
AR Yes
ST System is called?
AR Good question [missed]
ST Ground floor Phase 2. Who has access?
AR Only employees. [ explains c visitor escort]
ST Second floor
AR Again only employees unless visitor, escorted.
ST First floor
AR All employees have access to first floor.
ST All areas accessible to employees, inc cafeteria
AR Y
ST Ground floor Phase 2. Who has access?
AR Only employees. [ explains c visitor escort]
ST Second floor
AR Again only employees unless visitor, escorted.
ST First floor
AR All employees have access to first floor.
ST All areas accessible to employees, inc cafeteria
AR Y
ST How long worked at L
AR Started 1977 as apprentice and worked way up
ST Culture of org?
AR Lots of change at Edin site and change of culture. We have v inclusive culture. Invested heavily to create this environment. Now an office-type environment. Very inclusive.
AR Started 1977 as apprentice and worked way up
ST Culture of org?
AR Lots of change at Edin site and change of culture. We have v inclusive culture. Invested heavily to create this environment. Now an office-type environment. Very inclusive.
AR [missed] We can see change in dynamic in workforce. Some there a long time. Then apprentices etc.
ST has demographic of young group changed
AR Yes, compared to back in 70s. health apprentice population and graduate pop. We are seeing change in demographics.
ST has demographic of young group changed
AR Yes, compared to back in 70s. health apprentice population and graduate pop. We are seeing change in demographics.
AR Re aging workforce. When thinking of joining a co considerations - not as unhealthy as other employers, people see opportunities in working for us. [discusses L] We have longevity, people see us a leading employer, we provide opportunities
ST Any industry bodies L works with
ST Any industry bodies L works with
AR Make UK for employability and skills. I sit on Employment policy and skills committee. We get early access to what's happening, in touch with other employers
ST Do L also have own legal dept
AR Yes. We've used Make UK for number of years. Access to their website, use for policy doc etc
ST Do L also have own legal dept
AR Yes. We've used Make UK for number of years. Access to their website, use for policy doc etc
ST Re other orgs L affiliated with. Any orgs co linked / uses re DEI
AR My colleague Rachel R has been working hard in this area and making good steps to help us improve diversity. We have ambassadors, links with schools and universities.
ST Is Rachel Ruxton in role created before she joined co
AR My colleague Rachel R has been working hard in this area and making good steps to help us improve diversity. We have ambassadors, links with schools and universities.
ST Is Rachel Ruxton in role created before she joined co
AR Co identified a need c 2017 and we recruited somebody to post. They stayed 2-3 years and then interim person and then Rachel.
ST Since 2022 Rachel R been EDI. And relationship Make UK
AR Not just Edin. Relationship we have is we get advice from Make Uk, helps us get regional support.
ST Since 2022 Rachel R been EDI. And relationship Make UK
AR Not just Edin. Relationship we have is we get advice from Make Uk, helps us get regional support.
ST L in relation to staff networks. What available.
AR Been v active. Interest in staff networks, lots of ways to be involved.
ST How info communicated
AR There is a DEI page and people have access to
ST DEI just internal networks or outside
AR We include information c outside events too
AR Been v active. Interest in staff networks, lots of ways to be involved.
ST How info communicated
AR There is a DEI page and people have access to
ST DEI just internal networks or outside
AR We include information c outside events too
ST Co posts on intranet. What about info that all employees might be interested in.
AR Use Connect UK which is info for all. Through management briefings. People leaders, teams and events that take place to make aware what happening.
ST Culture of co specifically. Union affiliation?
AR Use Connect UK which is info for all. Through management briefings. People leaders, teams and events that take place to make aware what happening.
ST Culture of co specifically. Union affiliation?
AR Longstanding with Unite union. Senior TU rep on each site. Consult and inform.
ST What matter req to be consulted on
AR Anything re changes to T&C. Changes to practices etc.
ST Percentages - how much of workforce union members
AR [discusses} 35% [tt note - think that was the final figure]
ST How are relations
AR we are changing eg pension arrangements. And on pay. [ends with fairly good]
ST What matter req to be consulted on
AR Anything re changes to T&C. Changes to practices etc.
ST Percentages - how much of workforce union members
AR [discusses} 35% [tt note - think that was the final figure]
ST How are relations
AR we are changing eg pension arrangements. And on pay. [ends with fairly good]
ST Meetings?
AR Some meetings every two weeks. Employee consultations. Changing nature of workforce from closed shop high TU membership. Needed to find way of engaging with employees. T Us are given seats. Union reps are elected by union, other members elected by employees.
AR Some meetings every two weeks. Employee consultations. Changing nature of workforce from closed shop high TU membership. Needed to find way of engaging with employees. T Us are given seats. Union reps are elected by union, other members elected by employees.
AR Some difficulties but worked hard in getting people to sit together. Agendas vary. [difficult to hear all his points]
ST That give opportunity to hear from elected reps from employees. Other structures to enable this.
AR We have an employee speak up line - anon.
ST That give opportunity to hear from elected reps from employees. Other structures to enable this.
AR We have an employee speak up line - anon.
AR We have surveys to give employees the chance to feedback.
ST What is done with data
AR Info is dealt with by managers and we have top level action plans. [sound]
ST May capture range of issues, but what if employees have individual concerns.
AR Speak to LM to raise matter and then we have procedure
ST What is done with data
AR Info is dealt with by managers and we have top level action plans. [sound]
ST May capture range of issues, but what if employees have individual concerns.
AR Speak to LM to raise matter and then we have procedure
ST Grievance procedure needs employee to go through informal first
AR Yes. Necessary to go through stages.
ST Qs c Eq opportunities and diversity policy. [to bundle] To policy in force in March 2023. Summary - L is committed to providing working environment etc
AR Yes. Necessary to go through stages.
ST Qs c Eq opportunities and diversity policy. [to bundle] To policy in force in March 2023. Summary - L is committed to providing working environment etc
ST committed to diversity etc. Does it reflect co
AR Yes. Commitment to diversity. W
ST If there are issues where L needs further advice what steps taken
AR Make UK, would check with them
ST [ to bundle] current policies can be found on BMS. Co has policy c grievances etc.
AR Yes. Commitment to diversity. W
ST If there are issues where L needs further advice what steps taken
AR Make UK, would check with them
ST [ to bundle] current policies can be found on BMS. Co has policy c grievances etc.
[missed]
ST [to bundle] Diversity and eq opportunities are areas where employees and employer have legal obligations, etc. Treating people fairly, no unlawful discrimination, etc. Does that reflect co approach in 2023
AR yes
ST and now
AR yes
ST [to bundle] Diversity and eq opportunities are areas where employees and employer have legal obligations, etc. Treating people fairly, no unlawful discrimination, etc. Does that reflect co approach in 2023
AR yes
ST and now
AR yes
ST Reads sometimes need to make eg reasonable adjustments in order to treat everyone fairly, etc. Reflect your opinion of co
AR [sound] [ but generally positive agreement]We want people to talk freely about how they are feeling.
ST Have you been involved in considering aims of diversity policy
AR [sound] [ but generally positive agreement]We want people to talk freely about how they are feeling.
ST Have you been involved in considering aims of diversity policy
AR If not directly, certainly involved
ST bullet point c valuing all employees. Co committed to this is writing. What's your view c practice?
AR WE have an environment where [words not clear, but generally agreeing]
ST Does policy inc details c who employee should speak to if suffered discrimination etc
ST bullet point c valuing all employees. Co committed to this is writing. What's your view c practice?
AR WE have an environment where [words not clear, but generally agreeing]
ST Does policy inc details c who employee should speak to if suffered discrimination etc
AR Yes, first = line manager
ST reads list of people to speak to. Do you feel the routes provided to employees provides a number of options?
AR Yes, HR contact, people partners, TU rep, etc. I hesitated on restricted work contract but [missed]
ST How open is culture for employees to raise issues
ST reads list of people to speak to. Do you feel the routes provided to employees provides a number of options?
AR Yes, HR contact, people partners, TU rep, etc. I hesitated on restricted work contract but [missed]
ST How open is culture for employees to raise issues
AR Very open. We get lots of comments. c 60% employee engagement gives us an idea of temperature of employment. T Us, lots of avenues.
ST Raising anon issues? Could that be referred to a your whistleblowing link?
AR Yes, another avenue. We don't have lots but there will always be one or two [raised in this area]
ST Raising anon issues? Could that be referred to a your whistleblowing link?
AR Yes, another avenue. We don't have lots but there will always be one or two [raised in this area]
ST Views coming out of networks/
AR Networks meet together.
ST Any personal knowledge of Equalise network
AR No personal. Seen correspondence
ST Knowledge of aims?
AR To ensure we are inclusive employer. Allows an opportunity for people to raise matters.
AR Membership?
AR Networks meet together.
ST Any personal knowledge of Equalise network
AR No personal. Seen correspondence
ST Knowledge of aims?
AR To ensure we are inclusive employer. Allows an opportunity for people to raise matters.
AR Membership?
[ Note: That should be: ST Membership?]
AR Not sure there is any group of employees who aren't
able to join.
ST Am now going on to next part of my questioning. Might it be a good time to break?
AR Not sure there is any group of employees who aren't
able to join.
ST Am now going on to next part of my questioning. Might it be a good time to break?
J Back at 2 [they confirm timing, J tells AR c not to talk to anyone while still giving evidence]
[ends]
[ends]
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