Deliberations from Freezone

Good Morning,
I have a question, could you please help me?

Two believers are planning on getting married and both are AS.

The plan is to use IVF for birthing or perform some genetic test on conception.

Please what is your advice on this?

Also is removing an embryo in a case where one wants to prevent having a Sickler child against the word of God, as this is what will be done in IVF?

Thank you God Bless you

Responses from Ministers

The fact they know their genotype and have made such decisions means they have weighed their choices know what their choices would cost and have prepared for it. So, they can go ahead with it.

In the course of the journey of a pregnancy, an abnormality scan is always done to check if there's any abnormality with the baby. If there is, you'd be asked if you want to keep it or remove it. You will then weigh your option or "put your faith to the test". If they decide to do this for genotype, I think it's fine. I don't think that is "going against the word of God".

Would you rather bring a child to life to make him/her suffer nonstop and in the process, you too suffer or you terminate it and have peace?

If you do not have money to wedge the wahala, that is double wahala because frustration will wound you. - Sister Helen

Science has come up with solutions for these kinds of situations, I don’t think it’s against the word of God especially if they want to go the science route to make sure they don’t birth to children who would suffer, people with HIV get married now and science helps the other partner to be safe, it’s not against Gods word.
Also, I think if they want to remove an embryo, they should go ahead.
My question to them is, would they have the mental capacity to wait through the stress of selecting a healthy child tho?
If not the two both of them should face front. - Sister Rukky

Science can check and they can pick a healthy child but it’s not guaranteed. I have come across a couple who paid a lot of money here in the UK (Caucasian British Family) to pick a healthy child - they also did further tests in a private clinic to doubly ensure the embryo was healthy - after birth - the child had a very very rare disability.

If the couple in question, does this they really have to weigh the options and have the emotional and mental capacity for the journey.
I am just saying they should weigh the options!
Can and are they able to provide, go through, and sustain the emotional, mental, and physical needs that they as parents would need or that the child would need?
Don’t forget financial need as well.

What’s the point of walking into it with eyes open and then queuing night and day on a healing line, barging at God’s door night and day?

However, I found out recently from a clinical research pharmacist that trials have been done and there are now stem cell therapy treatments to change the SS cells.
- Sister Bukky

If both of them understand the commitment and the financial implications, and they are ready for it.
This is almost like asking if is it right to do IVF to have a baby, or is it right to give birth through CS or natural delivery? - Sister Funmilola
Since they have both agreed to this choice, no wahala
Do you know how many eggs are termed non viable before a good one is chosen for fertilization?
What happens to those eggs?😁
Couples who are AA have done this and they have their testimonies.
It is called “Assisted Reproduction”

Funny enough, they might not have an SS child💁🏼‍♀️ because the probability is 1/4.
I pray their love stands the test of time o - Sister Jennifer

I have a case in our church. The man is SS and the wife AS. Their first daughter is SS and for many years they didn't have any other child because of the stress of care. They however eventually opted for Assisted Reproductive Techniques and today, they have a son that is 4 years old and AS.
It's the financial implications they should consider and if they can afford it, let them go ahead. -Pastor Wale

Good morning family, in my opinion, they can go ahead with the IVF but using a donor egg who is AA. Who wants to go through the pain or stress of testing the embryo and destroying it after few months? - Sister Remi

Yesterday, the topic was transferring an unwanted pregnancy which we all assumed was a healthy embryo.
No one considered asking the young lady to have an abortion.
Is a child any less a child because the child is not in optimal health? - Sister FUNMI

While this is a way to look at it, it is also more reason for them to weigh their options well..their decision can affect someone else completely. How do you explain to a child that "..we knew we were both AS, we also had the option of assisted reproductive techniques but why abort you when you are not less of a child? Just a child that may live her whole life in pain. - Sister Nike

Do they have the financial war-chest(right now, not funds in hopes banksoo) for the medical procedures? If the answer is no, then they should deal with whatever feelings they have right now and part ways.

If they have the funds, then do they have the mental stamina to stand the waits and held-in expectations. The procedures require a lot of patience such that can easily peel-off those soft feelings they have for each other now.

Now they are already worried about removing embryo(s). They should know it's a practical part of the medical procedures to achieving healthy babies in such a situation. Can they stand this?
Why start future battles you can avoid today?
Why create multiple future heart aches while you can easily deal with just one now?
My candid take is;
It's better they handle that "overpowering feelings" that will still fade, and do the practical thing. Part ways. - Brother Pachiben

In my opinion (my own opinion o)
It is not only going to be financially stretching for them, but are they ready for the long emotional trauma and journey?
They are in love, I know. I just hope that love is enough for them in the long run.
There's no good or bad way to look at it, but it all depends on them and the long journey ahead of them.
If them go fit chest am, udo diri ha (peace be unto them). - Sister Ihuoma

Must they marry? It’s always better to bury the emotions early and find someone compatible in lieu of going through all the emotional, psychological and financial stress tomorrow. It’s always best to be practical, these same feelings they share today can change tomorrow cos marriage comes with its own weight. Me I feel it’s an unnecessary hazzle, na just small heartbreak it will cost now.

Or they have the faith to have their genotype changed supernaturally before tying the knot. - Sister Migdal
There is a way that seems right to man…….
We teach our children how precious they are. We quote scriptures telling them how God knew them before they were born and had His eyes on them in the womb.
Then we turn around and say, terminate embryos that look like they have issues?
There are states in America where babies have been terminated at 39 weeks. Is that less ethical than at 10weeks?
The real question here is the value we place on human life. Can I terminate my pregnancy is I want a boy and the embryo is female?
I have a good friend who believed the man was her husband and trusted God and married him. They have 2 children today, neither is SS.
My take is, if you do not have the faith to marry a fellow AS person, please walk away. - Sister FUNMI

This conclusion🤣🤣
Believers also have another option, the supernatural..but please, if no miracle happens to their genotype, or forth telling didn't stop the embryo from being unhealthy.. if it gets to the point they are sure the foetus is SS (except the Holyspirit is leading them not to, and they are sure He is the one o..) Please take it out..that is why you are having assisted reproduction in the first place - Sister Nike
What is the faith to marry an AS person, if I may ask?😃
I think it is a

Love Receipts

It was from the mouth of a comedian that I first heard the phrase “receipts of love”
The comedian was talking about his crashed marriage and how suddenly he realized that all the things he had done as a father and as a husband out of the goodness of his heart and the love he had for his wife and children did not count any longer unless he had receipts to prove them.
Imagine being happily married and keeping a receipt of every conversation you are having with your spouse, deliberately downloading apps to record your conversations in order to keep evidence of verbal abuse and other forms of abuse you are enduring in the marriage while being happily married to the person who you are gathering evidence against
A couple had a fight, and one or the other brought out a phone and started taking pictures of the damage done either to property, each other, or the children
How in God’s name is that still a marriage?
A marriage where every conversation is recorded secretly by the other party to extract evidence against the person who is supposed to be the most open and trustworthy partner in his or her life
I wonder how such partners feel when they make love to each other, knowing you are planning a divorce in your heart and gathering evidence against the person you are sharing that most intimate moment with
How is that true love?
How do you explain that to your children later in life?
How do you explain that to yourself?
Is that not more or less like sleeping with the enemy?
If you don’t want to be married to someone anymore, or you don’t want to be in a relationship with anyone anymore, what is wrong with walking away?
There are too many damaged people who have no business being in relationships but someone they found someone to relate with at that level and they are making the person’s life a sheer hell on earth just for the fun of it.
A brother explained to me that when he met his ex-girlfriend, she had recordings on her phone of evidences of wrongdoing by all her exes. These are carefully recorded conversations on the phone in which she would place a call to them after she must have hurt them and seen that they were about to break up with her
She would then speak in a very friendly manner, asking what her offense was and ensuring that for every answer she gave a counter reply regardless of how truthful or deceitful it is so that at a point the person would lose his or her temper and she would then claim the person had always had anger issues and was abusive in the relationship
He said she shared many of the recordings with him, like a red Indian sharing the scalp of his victims
He said he never knew she would do the same to him some months later
They had broken up, he wanted to settle things with her and see about reconciling when he suddenly got a phone call from her
He picked up the call and she began to speak to him in a quiet and composed voice about how the relationship started and other events that happened in the course of the relationship
He realized that throughout the conversation she was trying to paint herself as the sensible one while downplaying all the unscrupulous things she did in the course of the relationship
Suddenly it dawned on him that she was recording the conversation
He then asked her “Are you recording this conversation?”
At that point, she began to stutter because the recording is only effective when done without his knowledge
It was a puzzle to him
Who was she planning to share the recording with?
Her next lover?
Her parents?
Will it be the evidence that she couldn’t get married because all the men she had dated were crazy or will it be evidence that he was not a good match for her?
What could possess anyone to do such?
Insecurity?
Mental instability?
Seeking Validation from others?
Just being bitter and destructive on a whim?
I never could understand it
A lawyer later told me that these receipts are the evidence to present in the court of law in the case of a divorce
The lawyer said when a partner is causing you physical damage and other forms of damages, it is best to take pictures, videos, and audio recordings of such so that you can prove your case before a judge.
I understand that if we are talking about gathering evidence against a stranger, an enemy, or even a family member who had certain issues and would often deny it
This can be done so that such a person can see for himself or herself and seek help
For example, the husband denies snoring or the wife denies snoring
the husband then records the wife while she snored and the wife records the husband while he snored
They both listen to their snores and laugh about it
That is fun and when it is done in the right spirit, it is okay
It can also apply when a man or a woman has certain habits like drunkenness
The other partner can record the one with the habit so that he or she can show it to the other partner when such becomes sober
How can you in good faith love someone, be in a relationship with the person or marry the person and still have the ability to gather evidence against the person so that other people can act as arbiters of your love and judge between the two of you to decide what?
The moment you started gathering evidence, you had already logged out of the marriage
You do not need a judge to tell you that
The fact that you can still sleep with the person while you had logged out and had changed your intention to saboteur is what bothers me.
There are lines of decency nobody should cross
Not because of the other person but because of what it does to you
I read the story of two lovers who at the beginning of their relationship decided they wanted to do something as serious as marriage
The man was upfront with his intentions but the lady was cautious
She felt they needed to spend some time together in a relationship and see if they could work out as a couple
They got into the relationship, and it was good maybe even better than good but the man had some habits that the lady couldn’t stand
He had friends with whom he clubs once a week, and whenever he went off with them he would return to his apartment late
The lady by this time had moved in with him and she didn’t like the late-night crawling thing
She talked to him about it several times, cried about it several times, and eventually escalated issues and they had a bitter row about it.
The day after the bitter row, the man called off the relationship
He told her he was no longer interested in marrying her because of all the things she said and done the previous night simply because he went to hang out with his friends
The lady didn’t know he would take her escalation to that level
She had let go of her apartment and didn’t have anywhere else to go
So she told him she would like to renegotiate their terms of engagement
She said it was the “marriage expectation” that made her care that much about his habit of hanging out with friends in lounges and clubs every Friday
If they take marriage off the table, she won’t give a hoot anymore where he goes on Fridays and whom he hangs out with as long as he does not cheat on her
She proposed that they go into a friend-with-benefit relationship
She stays in his apartment, cooks his meals, and warms his bed
He will take care of her financial and emotional needs but she will be free to talk to other guys while he will be free to talk to other ladies
When she finds the right person she will move on and he can do the same but because she was staying in his house he will give her two months’ notice so that she can move out
They both agreed to the deal and from that point on their relationship was heaven
They had no more fights
She was open to other suitors but no serious one showed up
He was open to other suitors but no serious one showed up
They went on like this for a year
On the eve of the New Year, he gave her a huge sum of money as rent support
The money was enough to cover full rent or half of her rent depending on the location she might choose to rent

As Told To Say

The month of lifting
A lot of blessings disguised as an opportunity to help
Seeds sowing (not giving money to any pastor or ministry) but deliberate acts of kindness (not charity) but for the elevation of those who will come into your space with great potentials But without the immediate means to fulfill them.
Do not be mindful of those to whom you have shown kindness in the past who walked away without looking back or treated your extended hand of fellowship with disdain. Remember never to be wary of doing good, the season of harvest

I have always been a TRUMP supporter
I didn't choose to support him because of his party
I supported him because of his person
I like people who mean what they say and say what they mean
Political correctness is hypocrisy
Saying the "right "thing when I don't mean it is evil! I have equally respected the Democratic Party of America
I love Bill Clinton and Obama
I bought all their published books and read them with joy
I don't believe a political party can get it right all the time
And I believe not all candidates for a political office will appeal to

When you notice that someone has a soft spot for you, the ideal thing to do is to keep it as a form of social currency, so that on the day you really need him or her to come through for you, the person will not think twice.
Some of us think soft spots don't run dry, so we begin to milk it
We put all our problems on it and make a nuisance of ourselves
By the time the soft spot runs dry, we would have lost all our social credit with the person and turn ourselves into persona non-Granta
Managing relationships is a skill that has saved many from ruin from

People who face death everyday tend to think in a certain manner
The way they dimension reality is different from the way people who are into less risky lifestyles dimension reality
A soldier and a teacher are from two different planets, the way they see life and relate with life Are very different
The way they see love and relationships can never be the same
The way they arrange their world, separating what is real from what is not real is not the same.
Not all soldiers are combatants, every combatant deal with their own ghosts of war in their own way

When you read a thread accusing someone of doing any wrong on social media, don't be in a haste to support, retweet, fight for or encourage the accuser.
Dont start tagging the employers of the accused and go all out for blood, sometimes via @YouTube The accused is not guilty of the crime
You just may be nailing an innocent man or woman to a coffin
I am happy this doctor was cleared eventually
I stood by him when he was accused because I saw the evidence and it was obvious the girl was lying
I found myself in blogs and other

He wrote: When you guys started having children, you flew our mother to the UK for Omugwo
Between the two of you, mummy has stayed in the UK for over 16 years because as soon as she finished nursing the baby of A she would move to B's house to help her nurse her baby
We were five but you ladies being the first two girls manipulated it in such a way that mummy couldn't come to help any of us here in Nigeria to nurse our babies or care for our spouses when we got married and started having children
When Ada got married in 2011, mummy came home briefly for

Those Who Will Win

Oftentimes, I will get a message from a believer who claims God has made him or her certain promises but those promises have gone unfulfilled
I will ask for specifics and they will eagerly share how they received a word of prophecy or saw a vision and how several years later, the vision had gone unfulfilled while their lives had remained in limbo
I would tell them how i learned from the same person the difference between Faith and Hope
Faith does not understand how to wait, it is an action word, a doing word while hope must wait

Had a pastor friend
He worked as a consultant for many multinational companies and made a lot of money
He bought a house in Magodo, built another one in his home town, got married to the daughter of a judge from Ibadan
Had four children
When his wife clocked 50, he bought her a car
A Toyota Prado
His wife sold the car and gave the money to her younger brother who had been running an ailing business for over 20 years
This Pastor got angry and told his wife never to touch any of the other cars in the house
She should be jumping buses and riding Okada

This was the weather in my first three days in Manchester this year!
I had never been in the snow before, so I liked it at first and was feeling like a Gee!
By day three when I realized that the snow’s handshake is extending beyond the elbow and I was suffering instead of

enjoying
I said “Snow, it is enough! I want the sun to come out now. I cannot be wearing thermal wear and snow jacket and head warmer and gloves everywhere
I was not born for this weather so while I am here, you have to make allowance for me
There is no snow in heaven, neither

I learned quite early in life not to sit in judgment of others and the choices they were forced to make as a result of the issues life throws at them
I especially do not appreciate it when people sit in glass houses while throwing stones
I was involved in a case once, it involved a Pastor who found himself facing a panel based on petitions written against him by a female member of the church
The petition was written to the national headquarters of the ministry I was working with then and it was from there that a National Church Growth officer was sent to

She said: I never much fancied the idea of getting married and settling down to having children and running a home
It just wasn’t my scene
I grew up seeing many women broken by marriage
I grew up believing many women in the grace would have lived longer if they stayed single and faced their careers
This didn’t make me hate men or marriage
I just felt it was not for me
When I was in school, I had friends with different worldviews
Those who got married early who had loving husbands and beautiful homes
Those who fleeced off men just for the fun of it
Those

He said: She was a friend, a true friend
Maybe the only person I can call a friend out of all my colleagues
We work in the same organization
I am like her boss but not her direct boss
She was heading one of the branches of the organization at the time and I was supervising six branches
So she is under my region but a boss in her own right
We had worked in the same organization for four years and we usually met at the annual conference and annual general meeting of the organization
At the meetings I observed that she is a very competent leader who took

When i was quite young, i remember my father had a saying ehich he said very often
"KI AWON OMO MI TO JE OGUN, MA JE OGBON" meaning
"BEFORE MY CHILDREN WILL CHOP 20, I WILL CHOP 30"
The true meaning was that he was going to eat majority of his wealth in his tummy before leaving any inheritance for his own children
It was said as a matter of fact, and all his children took his words to mean all he had to offer us was our education but nothing by way of a legacy or an inheritance
This philosophy was so anti-scriptures and anti-christian but every man will

I met a young lady and her grandmother at the event we had in Maryland last Sunday
I last saw the young lady and her entire family in the year 2020 when they dragged her down to one of my meetings at Surulere and labeled her a witch
And they were right!
She enjoyed being a witch always lost in a trance in broad daylight
She would sit somewhere fiddling with the belt of her gown or the edges of a wrapper (marking time in a hypnotic state) for hours
Anyone who dares to touch her or bring her out of that hypnotic state would fall sick almost to the point

If you have never started a church or a fellowship in your life, you can never understand what it means to lead one.
If you have never started a company from the scratch but joined the company to earn your monthly pay, you can never claim you understand what it takes to run a coy The church that Jesus named Peter as its head in his lifetime was not run by Peter after resurrection
James the brother of Jesus became the Bishop of the church in Jerusalem
Peter, the Cephas, the chosen one became an itinerant Bishop visiting churches planted by others in Europe

It is puzzling to see those who really end up losing their heads in the tussle for rulership in the Bible really didn't have anything to do with the throne or the line of succession
They just put their mouths where it didn't belong and it ends up costing them their lives and liberty
Remember that Amalekite guy that came to David bearing a crown he found on the battlefield after Saul had committed suicide?
Instead of delivering the crown and shutting his mouth, he lied that he killed King Saul thinking David will reward him for eliminating the King!

She: Men do not truly appreciate what women go through during pregnancy
The body becomes big and bloated, her hormones go into overdrive, she sacrifices her beauty to bear his children
No woman should have to go through that sacrifice for any man just bear him children Him: I agree. Why don't we shelve the baby thing completely
I am fine without children
All i want is to be with you
She: Nooo, i want children. It has always been my dream to have two children and you cannot talk me out of it
Him: I felt we should keep your body intact so that

That some people will attribute the wonders of the Holy Spirit to the work of darkness is normal
Jesus told us to expect it
He said they called the spirit at work in Him Beelzebub
If you have not been so labeled, your gospel is only in words
It is not yet in Power
Remember this! Someone I was once close to while having a discussion with a family friend said “How can you explain someone that was a nobody in 2018 becoming a globally known minister of the gospel or the miracles or the move of the spirit?
His mother took him somewhere to do something for him

The Bible did not promote the concept of financial seed sowing
The main seed is Jesus
Genesis 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.
“And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice Genesis 22:18
The other seed the Bible talked about over and over again is the Word of God (Luke 8)
It is true that some things can be inferred rather than written in black and white when it comes to the Kingdom