I appreciated that this debate was more focused than just "baptism."

Some quick thoughts 🧵

https://twitter.com/JaredLongshore/status/1821325700223398201

@JaredLongshore argued that divine covenants are executed in history, cut on earth, not just an idea in heaven. Covenants must be established. Therefore, if the CoG was not established until the NC, Abraham, Moses, & David must have been saved outside the CoG.

"In the Mosaical oeconomy... some did believe [in Christ], others did not; and so some were related to God in the New Covenant, others remained under the Old[.]"

Nehemiah Coxe, Vindiciæ veritatis, 134 Coxe sounds like Augustine
“These pertain to the new testament, are the children of promise, and are regenerated by God the Father and a free mother. Of this kind were all the righteous men of old, and Moses himself, the minister of the old testament, the heir of the new"

@JaredLongshore "Jeremiah here speaks hyperbolically."

The problem with this claim is that it is contrary to how Jesus understood Jeremiah's prophecy. He did not interpret "all" as hyperbole meaning "a lot more" but rather as referring to everyone in the covenant: the elect. John 6:45 @JaredLongshore David Dickson
"They shall all know me, saith the Lord, that is, as Christ doth interpret it, They shall be all taught of God, Joh. 6. 45."

THERAPEUTICA SACRA Ch. VII
quod.lib.umich.edu/e/eebo/A35955.…

In 2 Sam 7:10 (the Davidic Covenant), God says

"I will appoint a place [Jerusalem] for my people Israel and will plant them, so that they may dwell in their own place and be disturbed no more." In Ezek 15:6 He says

"Like the wood of the vine among the trees of the forest, which I have given to the fire for fuel, so have I given up the inhabitants of Jerusalem."

(Cf Ps. 80:9-16; Isaiah 5:1-7; 27:2ff; Jer. 2:21; 12:10ff; Ezk. 17:1-21; 19:10-14; Ho. 10:1-2)

"Much confusion will be avoided and much help obtained if the Sinaitic economy be contemplated separately under its two leading aspects, namely, as a system of religion and government designed for the immediate use of the Jews during the continuance of that dispensation;... and then as a scheme of preparation for another and better economy, by which it was to be superseded when its temporal purpose had been fulfilled... There was nothing spiritual, strictly speaking, about it. It had a spiritual meaning when looked at in its typical character;...

“[The Covenant of Works] contained a promise; which was a promise of life, of natural life to Adam, and of a continuation of it so long as he should observe the condition of it;... just as life was promised to the Israelites, and a continuance in it, in the land of Canaan, so long as they should observe the law of God…

"Can the law be changed, and still continue to be the same law? If not, then the covenant of the Christian church, is another covenant than that of the Jewish church; having a new Mediator, a new order of priests, new sacrifices, and a new service... It follows, therefore, that 'The Jewish society before Christ, and the Christian society after Christ, are not one and the same church under different dispensations.'...

"That nation, that family of Israel according to the flesh, and with regard to that external and carnal qualification, were in some sense adopted by God to be his peculiar people, and his covenant people... not now as visible saints, not as professors of the true religion, not as members of the visible church of Christ; but only as people of such a nation, such a blood, such an external and carnal relation to the patriarchs their ancestors, Israelites according to the flesh...

When Owen disagreed with Westminster's position saying

"If reconciliation and salvation by Christ were to be obtained not only under the old covenant, but by virtue of it, then it must be the same for substance with the new."

he was not describing Westminster's view. That is, he was not saying they believe that salvation was obtained by virtue of the Old Covenant.

Their view was that salvation was the same under Old and New:

"Though I no longer call myself FV, I could still sign the first half of the FV Joint Statement."

Is there a second half that I'm not aware of? Could someone clarify?

The JFVS is contrary to the WCF on the Covenant of Works. WCF 7.2 says life was promised to Adam upon the condition of works and cites Gal 3:12 which says "the law is not of faith."

JFVS says the life offered to Adam was "a gift of grace, received by faith alone."

2008 Scientific American article.

scientificamerican.com/article/mind-c… 2017 Rockefeller University article. seek.rockefeller.edu/flipping-a-swi…

Bossche is the current Head of Vaccine Development Office at the German Center for Infection Research (DZIF), formerly the Senior Program Officer in Vaccine Discovery for Global Health at the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation. Look at his feed. alliedacademies.com/profile/Geert%…

https://twitter.com/GVDBossche/status/1367128400863846401

These mobsters say the science is clear. I wonder if they've talked to Bossche.

Aquinas' retroactive New Covenant, following Augustine (Old “Law” = Old Covenant; New “Law” = New Covenant):

[T]he Old Law, which was given to men who were imperfect, that is, who had not yet received spiritual grace, was called the "law of fear," inasmuch as it induced men to observe its commandments by threatening them with penalties; and is spoken of as containing temporal promises…

@reformedforum Berkhof said sacraments “are not absolutely necessary unto salvation… do not originate faith but presuppose it and are administered where faith is assumed… [M]any were actually saved without the use of sacraments. Think of believers before the time of Abraham[.]” (ST 618-19) @reformedforum Hodge said "a fourth… characteristic of the Reformed doctrine on the sacraments… is that the grace or spiritual benefits received by believers in the use of the sacraments, may be attained without their use… [They] are not necessary means of salvation." (ST III.XX.V)

"The unconverted are not members of the external, visible church. Believers only constitute the true church. They alone are members of the church, regardless of how one views them. This is clearly stated in articles 27–29 of the Belgic Confession of Faith"
contrast2.wordpress.com/2016/05/14/a-b… "Our definition of the church must not be framed in terms of an accommodation by which we make provision, within our definition, for the inclusion of hypocrites, that is to say, of those who profess to be Christ’s but are not really his."

contrast2.wordpress.com/2016/12/05/joh…

John Glas, Testimony of the King of Martyrs Concerning His Kingdom, 1777 Glas on the Davidic Covenant