Thread by @Dave_Boucher1

The Michigan Board of State Canvassers meeting is scheduled to start at 1 pm. They'll take up what in the past has been the routine task of certifying statewide election results.

You can join 4,000 (and climbing) other people and watch the meeting live freep.com/story/news/pol…

As many have noted, there are a litany of outcomes from this Board of State Canvassers meeting.

Essentially all of them end with President-elect Joe Biden receiving Michigan's 16 electoral votes.

More on the board and it's duties from @clarajanehen freep.com/story/news/loc…

We've passed 10,000 people watching the livestream of the Board of Canvassers meeting. Clearly, lots of interest in the electoral process!

Meeting should start any minute. freep.com/story/news/pol…

Alright, meeting is underway.

Board of State Canvassers are now considering the canvass. Jonathan Brater, director of the Michigan Bureau of Elections, now speaking.

He says staff recommends the board should certify election. (Here's memo and mtg materials they submitted last week michigan.gov/documents/sos/…)

Brater: "Election workers have been on a marathon to ensure our elections can continue to run."

Brater: The bureau has not identified any irregularities this year that are outside of what generally happens during a regular election.

Brater: Any errors in reporting of unofficial results were quickly caught soon after they occurred or during the canvass process.

Brater: By any metric, the election in November was better run in Detroit than the primary election or the 2016 General Election.

Acknowledges some out-of-balance precincts, as is usual, and says continued improvement in Detroit is needed

AG attorney Heather Meingast (she's the attorney for the board): The constitution and the statute contemplate conducting audits post election.

"We don't have statewide results until this board certifies."

Board member Julie Matuzak offers a motion to certify the state election results.

GOP member Aaron Van Langevelde says he's not saying he's for or against motion now, but wants to hear public comment first.

Matuzak says there can still be public comments as part of motion

Van Langevelde: The board's duty today is very clear: we are here to certify the election.

Says "we owe it to the people" to allow them to speak.

This could telegraph the certification vote may pass once it's actually put to a vote.

Chris Thomas, a well-respected former state elections director under Republican and Democratic secretaries of state in Michigan, is going to speak during public comments. He helped out in Detroit's election this year, at the request of the Secretary of State.

Thomas involved with the planning of the general election, dealing with TCF operation, and several other issues with satellite sites, drop boxes.

"I've been impressed with the city of Detroit's turn that they've made since 2016 and since the August primary of this year."

Thomas: The desire to vote by mail, during a pandemic, was palpable in Detroit.

Says Detroit City Clerk Janice Winfrey said high-speed tabulators were a lifesaver in assisting the city accumulate results in significantly less time than in the past

Thomas: "You have raised your voice, about not only Detroit and other jurisdictions...in terms of their processing of absentee ballots, back in 2016 and again in this primary."

"Is there work still to be done (in Detroit)? Yes."

Thomas: The fact of the matter is Detroit, like many other cities, "had a tsunami of mail ballots descend on it, and did the best that they could."

He heralds administration of a largely mail-in election, pivoting from general elections that were previously majority in-person

Roughly 26,000 people watching the livestream now. Board members have indicated this could be quite the lengthy meeting, given how many people would like to provide comment.

Not sure how many of those 26,000 will stick around to the end...

Norm Shinkle now speaking. He says he spoke with Thomas before the meeting.

Argues today that the election did not go smoothly, although it may have gone better than administration of the August primary election.

Thomas, to Shinkle and the board: "You can't vote no. There is no no, in these circumstances."

"Each of you play a necessary role. You're at the pinnacle of Michigan's Democracy. You're the end game."

Thomas: The remedy stage begins after you say yes: recounts, audits, investigations, they all happen after the vote.

"If you have the completed returns, I don't think you can adjourn."

Thomas: "I think you're mandated to certify when you have the completed results. There's no reason to sit on it for 40 days."

"What would you do for 40 days? You don't have authority to conduct an audit. What would you do?"

Shinkle is asking these questions because he's clearly entertaining the idea of voting against certification.

Board member Aaron Van Langevelde up next. Van Langevelde is an attorney and advisor for the state House Republican Caucus

Van Langevelde: The law basically says we have a legal duty, or a clear legal duty, to canvass returns.

Are you aware of any legal authority out there that allows us to review more than county returns during that certification process?

Thomas: I am not.

Van Langevelde: We don't have the authority to conduct a trial here to say whether or not election fraud occurred, correct?

Thomas: You are correct.

Again, sounds like Van Langevelde outlining the authority and purpose of the Board of State Canvassers. Seems like he would want to do this to set up a vote in favor of certifying election results. We'll see when the vote happens later.

That's it for Thomas.

Next up is Daniel Baxter, former director of elections for Detroit. He ran operations at TCF Center this year.

That's where Detroit counted it's roughly 174,000 absentee ballots.

Baxter discussing his conversations with Clerk Winfrey about how the Detroit would approach absentee ballot tabulation for the November General Election.

Says city wanted to avoid primary election issues: staffing issues, or staff leaving without tabulating every ballot

Baxter discussing staff recruitment efforts by the city. Had more than 4,000 people apply to assist with absentee ballot tabulation.

Baxter: Training was more effective for the General Election. Supervisors trained 8-10 hours, "to make sure they understood every aspect of the operation."

They were trained alongside poll workers who would work with them on Election Day.

Baxter: Election week was one of the most exciting, engaging endeavors I've ever worked on. Says he joined the city department of elections in 1985.

Baxter: "No matter what happened on Election Day, whether or not challengers shouted stop the vote in the TCF Center, whether or not they were violating social distancing rules...nothing, and I mean nothing, deterred our poll workers from being engaged. They stayed focused."

Baxter: When you walk into Detroit Dept. of Elections, there's quote from Abraham Lincoln on wall: "and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth."

Says dept. is a non-partisan operation focused on ensuring every vote counts.

Shinkle asks whether counting board was out of balance by more than 600 votes.

Baxter said as of Wednesday night, three counting boards did not count. They were re-run during the canvass, and the difference exceeded 600 votes. Those results were included in the official results

Shinkle asking questions about the city's electronic poll book.

Baxter says if a name was not in the electronic poll book, workers needed to look for the name in the city's supplemental document.

(In Michigan, people can register to vote through Election Day)

Shinkle asks about how poll workers are hired, and asks whether there were enough Republicans at the AV counting board.

Baxter says there were not enough Republican poll workers recruited for each central counting board. (This will definitely be a point of contention for GOP)

No more ?s for Baxter. Board of State Canvassers meeting has lasted about an hour now.

Motion to certify the vote is still up for discussion.

Next to speak: Jeff Timmer, a former member of the BSC. He's a former exec director of the Michigan Republican Party and opposes Trump

Timmer: Joe Biden won Michigan by a margin of more than 154,000 votes.

Whether the margin is one vote or 1 million votes is irrelevant to the legal duties this board must fulfil today.

Board member Van Langevelde asks Timmer some questions.

Van Langevelde: Are you aware of any legal authority for us to go beyond those returns to review anything before certification today?

Timmer: No

Next speaker: Livonia City Clerk Susan Nash.

Livonia is a majority white suburb in Wayne County. Nash is also the president of the association of Wayne County clerks.

Nash: A record number of Michigan voices came out to be heard, and they need to be heard.

I'm sure there were mistakes that were human error, that shouldn't happen.

We need to certify these results.

Next speaker: Michelle Anzaldi, the clerk in Pittsfield Charter Township.

Anzaldi: "I think it's important that you guys certify the results, because that is what is required from you."

Clerks are dedicated and committed to the election process. It was difficult, challenging

Anzaldi: "To discount all the work that we do, every day, when we are running elections, to discount that work and say that the process wasn't fair or transparent or fair or accurate, is in my opinion, wrong."

Next speaker: Barb Byrum, Ingham County clerk. Lansing is in Ingham County.

Byrum: You must certify these results. All 83 counties certified local results.

"Anything other than certification is an unlawful power grab"

Byrum: Your duties are ministerial and mandatory under Michigan law.

Says President Trump is pressuring elected officials to "bend to his will" and committee acts to undermine the election.

Byrum notes reports that one member (Shinkle) is considering voting against certifying election results.

"I find this shocking and disgusting."

Byrum by far most heated speaker so far. Likely not last heated speaker though.

Shinkle asks Byrum a question: Does board have the right to inquire into the election certification process of the county?

Byrum says the board has a duty to certify. Candidates can seek redress

Next speaker: Chris Swope, Lansing city clerk and president of the Michigan Association of Municipal Clerks.

Swope: We asked for additional time to process ballots from the state Legislature. They gave us 10 hours. That was less than we asked for and less than we needed

Swope: We have an audit process in Michigan. The Legislature determined that would happen after certification.

Other states have a pre-certification process. We do not.

Swope says Shinkle's wife, Mary, was a challenger in a Lansing absentee ballot counting board in March. Swope said they got along very well and he thought the process went smoothly.

Shinkle says he wanted to "summon" Detroit City Clerk Janice Winfrey to this meeting. Brater said Thomas and Baxter spoke on behalf of Detroit.

Shinkle: "Was she summoned to be here?"

Brater: "She was invited."

(The board doesn't have the authority to "summon" anyone)

Board Chair Jeannette Bradshaw calls a quick recess. She doesn't say why the recess was called.

But for now, we wait!

Quick recap: Board is discussing motion to certify state election results.

Needs a majority of votes (at least 3) to certify. Ex-MI elections director Chris Thomas, + many others, argue board has a legal obligation to certify.

Board member Shinkel does not appear convinced.

Okay, meeting is back underway.

Next speaker: Michigan Republican Party Chairwoman Laura Cox.

Cox and RNC head Ronna McDaniel have asked the board to delay the certification. freep.com/story/news/pol…

Cox says there are "too many numerical anomalies" to certify the election.

She argues vote will be certified and will of people upheld, but need to ensure the election process is fair.

Cox argues the election process is "stacked against Republicans."

Republicans control a majority of the Michigan state House and Senate. State lawmakers create election policy.

Cox says TCF Center stood out as spot with significant issues. Calls Democrat + Michigan Secretary of State antagonistic and disrespectful.

(Doesn't outline allegations of issues at TCF Center. Allegations of issues at TCF have been tossed out of court freep.com/story/news/loc…)

Cox repeats a slightly misleading stat about Detroit.

About 71% of absentee ballot precincts were out-of-balance this fall. Obviously lots of attention on AV votes, but when looking at all precincts, that % is below 30%

Shinkle asks Cox about Thomas' statements that the board doesn't have the power to order an audit.

Cox: We have the opportunity to request a meaningful review. We need to review the Wayne County results.

(Fwiw, Wayne Co. hasn't gone to a GOP presidential candidate since 1928)

Next speaker: Charles Spies, attorney for the campaign of John James, the GOP candidate for U.S. Senate.

James has already requested the board delay certification.

Spies: Democracy is not dying, and our position is not that this election should not be certified.

Our position is that the board should, perhaps even must, certify. But it should only do that when confident the results are accurate

Legal authorities we've at Freep have spoken with argue the board can't conduct an audit or independent review. MI SOS and others argue Michigan law only allows for an audit or review of certified results.

Spies: While state law requires you to meet today for purposes of canvassing, the law does not require the results be certified today.

This is true. The board has until Dec. 13 to certify the results.

Fwiw, James down ~94,000 votes in state. Trump is down ~154,000 votes in state.

While Spies + others keep asking for Wayne County audit, their allegations focus on Detroit.

There were 250K votes in Detroit, of which ~174K were AV.

*Very* unlikely any review changes results

Spies rightly notes many people, Dems and GOPers, were upset about election operations in August.

Spies also notes that more than 70% of absentee ballots were "out-of-balance" (number of ballots counted doesn't match number of ballots expected in that precinct)

It's worth noting: out-of-balance precincts happen all over the state and are common.

In Detroit, the number of ballots in question re: out-of-balance precincts is between 300 and 500 ballots. Not thousands, or tens of thousands, of ballots.

Van Langevelde: "There's nothing in the law that gives me the authority to request an audit as part of the certification process, correct?"

Spies: Nothing gives you that authority, but nothing says you can't.

Van Langevelde (an attorney): "We only have the powers and duties given to us by law, right?"

I've found nothing about an audit. I've found nothing about delaying certification.

"The law is pretty clear here. This board has such limited authority"

Spies says he's wrong

Van Langevelde: Law only lets us review returns. Not audit or a different review, or complaints of fraud.

Spies arguing Langevelde is misreading statute. Argues he has the ability to ascertain the results of the election, including taking more time to take "necessary actions."

Van Langevelde: There is nothing in the law that gives us the authority to do the things you've requested, correct?

Spies: No, that's wrong.

(A GOP board member arguing with Spies is not a good sign for James, Cox and GOP requests to delay certification)

Spies: If you think there's a problem with absentee precincts out of balance, and the results in front of you aren't accurate, then you have the ability and duty to look into those results.

Van Langevelde: "I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you on that."

This is a critical part of the meeting. Van Langevelde is outlining, repeatedly, how he reads the law concerning the duties of the Board of State Canvassers.

Clear that Van Langevelde does not believe board has the authority to delay or request an audit.

Ah, sounds like Detroit City Clerk Janice Winfrey is now here! She's speaking next.

Winfrey says she can't speak long.

"My charge is to administer the election process, ensure voters know when election day is, and to ensure they know where to go to vote on Election Day."

Winfrey: We went to great lengths and measures to recruit poll workers. We "extended training significantly."

"We allowed our poll workers at TCF to work in shifts, so they wouldn't be so tired...less mistakes were made, accordingly."

Winfrey: "We do all this so we can eliminate as much human error as possible. But as humans, we all make mistakes."

"Please raise your hands if you've never made a mistake?"

(Winfrey is pretty fired up as well)

Winfrey is done speaking. Board member Shinkle has a few questions.

Shinkle referencing Baxter comments about hiring GOP workers. Says he has a list of GOP people who did apply to work.

Winfrey says Baxter may be wrong. "We did have Republican poll workers. We did reach out"

Winfrey says many poll workers were turned away if they applied to late in the process.

Shinkle is trying to fact check Winfrey. He's citing anecdotal evidence that there were not enough Republican workers at TCF.

Winfrey is clearly upset that she was called in to speak today. Said she's trying to deal with a dire medical emergency in her household today.

Said the city hired a "significant number" of Republican poll workers.

Shinkle really hammering home on the idea that the city may not have hired enough GOP poll workers.

Worth noting: I haven't heard Shinkle make any correlation between a lack of GOP workers and voting or ballot misconduct, irregularities or wrongdoing.

Winfrey is done speaking. Next speaker is an attorney with the Joe Biden presidential campaign

Whoops, Biden attorney not speaking yet.

Up next: Monica Palmer, chair of the Wayne County Board of Canvassers.

Yes, that Monica Palmer freep.com/story/news/loc…

Shinkle asks Palmer a question. He said he saw Palmer's affidavit (she signed a statement trying to rescind her vote in favor of certifying the results. There's no legal way to do that).

Palmer says she changed vote in support because she was told there would be an audit

Palmer:"If I'd have been a little bit more on my feet and realized that audit could not be completed, I would not have voted for that certification."

Plamer says other board member told her Gov. Whitmer promised audit of Wayne County. (Not sure what authority Whitmer would have)

Shoot, sorry, Palmer, not Plamer. My error

Shinkle says he's received threats against himself and his family, before today's certification meeting.

Palmer says she's received text messages with graphic images of naked dead women and saying this would happen to her daughter.

Outlining really egregious messages.

Palmer: Public comments at the Wayne County meeting "threw me for a loop." She said she felt threatened by some of those comments.

Palmer and Shinkle having a conversation about poll lists in Detroit. Wrapping up, Shinkle said Palmer has been subject to our "new society" via threats.

Shinkle: "Whoever threatens the most thinks they're going to win."

Okay, now Mary Ellen Gurewitz (attorney for Michigan Democratic Party) now speaking.

Gurewitz: Trump and John James are trying to disenfranchise Detroit voters and voters across the state.

It's a little difficult to hear Gurewitz. Sounds like the board is trying to find a workaround, but it's going to take a minute

Gurewitz: It's widely realized that precincts are frequently out-of-balance.

Gurewitz argues Palmer's actions at the Wayne County board meeting shows she, and other Republicans, are unfairly singling out Detroit

Next speaker: Patrick Colbeck, former state lawmaker and Trump supporter.

Says he's review "almost 200" affidavits about Detroit. Implying there are widespread issues in the Democratic stronghold. The Trump campaign and others have not presented any evidence to support this.

Colbeck is focusing now on voting rolls and visible ethernet connections. Quite quickly, he's going through data that he shows undermines trust in elections.

His statements are slightly hard to follow.

He's speaking quickly because speakers are limited in how long they can speak.

Time now up. Shinkle asks Colbeck about the Dominion voting system.

This is a oft-touted focus of conspiracies and misinformation.

More fact-checks here freep.com/story/news/loc…

Shinkle asks Colbeck if he asked anyone about ethernet cables.

Colbeck upset, says he knows computers at TCF Center were connected to the internet. Not sure how he "knows" that, but he's decided staff were trying to subvert the election process.

He says he has a diagram

Board member Matuzak asks Colbeck if he's submitted evidence of any fraud to the Michigan attorney general. Colbeck says he gave his information to "attorneys."

Asked again if he's submitted anything to the AG, Colbeck again deflects. Sounds like he hasn't.

Okay, new speaker. State senator Laurie Pohutsky (@lpohutsky19): "There is a clear legal duty for the board to certify this election."

"I know this has been acrimonious, to say the least, but there is a job to be done today."

Next speaker, state Rep: @MariManoogian (Democrat): "I think it's imperative that we continue to set an example...that we can conduct a free and fair election in Michigan."

Says a "particular candidate" trying to sow chaos in the democratic process

Shinkle says @MariManoogian won an election that was "fairly close."

Manoogian says "it wasn't very close," notes she won by more than 10,000 votes.

Next up: state Rep. Rachel Hood, D- Grand Rapids (@RachelHood76).

Hood reiterates what other speakers have said, calls on the board to certify results.

Next speaker: City of Jackson Mayor Derek Dobies.

Dobies says he was a poll challenger at TCF Center in Detroit. He alleges GOP challengers harassed employees at TCF Center.

After Dobies finishes speaking, the board takes another recess.

We've gone on for about 2 hours and 45 minutes. Unclear how many additional speakers we've had.

Or, for that matter, if any speakers will change the minds of any of board members

Okay, meeting is back. Board chair Jeannette Bradshaw says there are 500 people (!!!) who want to speak.

She says they're going to try and give everyone 90 seconds to speak.

Get comfortable, everyone.

Bradshaw, to future speakers: Be respectful, or else we'll put you on mute.

Sounds like the next few speakers are not elected leaders or known advocates, but concerned and engaged voters.

Next up: Wendy Gronbeck of Douglas (a small West Michigan city).

"What you hold in your hands is trust of our elections, and that ripples across the world."

"It sometimes feels like officials are trying to tear up my ballot right in front of me."

I'm not going to tweet every speaker, but I'll provide the general gist from here on out.

We've had about 8 speakers. Board member Julie Matuzak chimes in. Sounds like she's going to ask for the board to vote.

Sounds like one more clerk is going to speak first, before board *may* entertain a vote.

Canton Township Clerk Michael Siegrist speaking now. Like essentially every other speaker, Siegrist calls on the board to certify results

Member Van Langevelde gives statement: Says state should investigative fraud.

"State law is clear we do not have the authority."

"This board must respect the authority entrusted to it, and follow the law as written. We must not try to exercise power we simply don't have."

Van Langevelde says he's going to support the motion. The board definitely has the votes to certify (as we expected at this point).

Shinkle now speaking. He's going through 2016 results, noting there were many questions about state results then as well.

Shinkle says results show Michigan has a problem conducting elections.

"There is no excuse for confusion and uncertainty that seems to follow every election in our state."

Shinkle now blasting the Michigan Secretary of State, Jocelyn Benson. Says she failed to do enough to ensure Detroit elections were conducted fairly and in a trustworthy way

Shinkle says he's calling on the Michigan Legislature to conduct an in-depth review of elections process in the state.

Fwiw, the state House and Senate have election committees. They met ~ 30 times in the two years ahead of the General Election this year.

Shinkle indicated, as expected, that he will note vote for certification.

Board member Julie Matuzak up next.

Says should be more time to process AV ballots, needs to be review of party challenger process and to get rid of limitations on recounting precincts.

"There are many things the Legislature, and only the Legislature, can do to fix this."

Matuzak says she's going to vote for the motion.

Breaking: The Michigan Board of State Canvassers vote to certify the state election results.

Three members voted in favor of certification. Norm Shinkle abstained.

Story: After more than 3 hour discussion, the Michigan Board of State Canvassers voted to certify state election results.

The routine move, at times in doubt, is the next step in ensuring president-elect Joe Biden earns the state's 16 electoral votes freep.com/story/news/pol…

Key quote from GOP member Aaron Van Langevelde:

"Our duty is to look at those certified results, look at the math, and then certify. The statute couldn't be more clear." freep.com/story/news/pol…

Comment from House Speaker Lee Chatfield. Chatfield says vote is "America at work," and says vote puts to rest "conspiracy theories" from Dems and "talking heads in the media."

Presumably referencing allegations related to his White House trip? freep.com/story/news/pol…

Another comment, this one from Michigan Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson: "Democracy has prevailed." freep.com/story/news/pol…

If you're so inclined, public comments are ongoing.

Speakers are thanking board for their vote while lambasting Shinkle/the idea that the board weighed not certifying...?

About 14,000 people still watching the livestream freep.com/story/news/pol…

After many, many speakers in support of certification, a self-identified Republican man speaking blasts the board for voting to support.

The speaker says he feels "disenfranchised" because he didn't get to speak before, likens board to Tammany Hall freep.com/story/news/pol…

And here's a statement from the Biden campaign in Michigan: freep.com/story/news/pol…

Not sure if mtg still going or tech issues.

But to recap: Board voted to certify. Democrats and many legal experts would say this was their only option.

Some in GOP will undoubtedly object. But certification starts the clock on recount/audit requests freep.com/story/news/pol…

Gov. Whitmer reacts to board certification:

"Now, it’s time to put this election behind us and come together as a state to defeat our common enemy: COVID-19" freep.com/story/news/pol…

Worth noting, given some topics discussed during parts of meeting: If the board did not vote to certify today, there *absolutely* would have been lawsuits that asked a court to compel certification. Likely would have succeeded, requiring board to certify freep.com/story/news/pol…

New statement, in from Trump campaign attorney @JennaEllisEsq: "Certification by state officials is simply a procedural step."

freep.com/story/news/pol…

UPDATE: 211 more people want to speak at the Board of State Canvassers meeting.

The board already voted.

Meeting started at 1 pm. freep.com/story/news/pol…

We've sped past the 5-hour mark here at the Board of State Canvassers meeting. Board members are signing certificates that go to candidates who've won races in the state freep.com/story/news/pol…

It's 7 pm. The Michigan Board of State Canvassers meeting started at 1 pm. They're still going, listening to people who wanted to address the board, even after the certification vote.

freep.com/story/news/pol…

Some speakers are thanking board for their vote and attacking Shinkle. Others, not as many but some, are either thanking Shinkle or agreeing w/allegations of misconduct in Detroit. (Still no proof of widespread fraud in Detroit or elsewhere in Michigan).

freep.com/story/news/loc…

It's 9 pm, 8 hours after start of the Michigan Board of State Canvassers and ~4 hours after certification.

Michiganders continue to address board; vast majority support certification and thank poll/election workers for their efforts across the state.
freep.com/story/news/pol…

It's 9:40. Michigan Board of State Canvassers Chair Jeannette Bradshaw says at the start of the mtg (at 1 pm) more than 700 people said they wanted to speak today.

Nearly nine-hours later...There are no more public speakers.

The meeting is adjourned.

freep.com/story/news/pol…

Looks like the state canvassers board meeting has nearly 250,000 views on YouTube...gotta be the most in board history right? freep.com/story/news/pol…