Thread by @AlisonBlunt

1) Orland Bishop, 'In the framework of our, say, sense-making of reality, as we know it now, we've inherited the liberal arts and sciences that define scopes of knowledge that did not exist as principles in the intellect; they existed as principles in nature.'

2) 'So nature had sacred geometry. It had rhythm. It had sounds, tones. It had its forms that say geometries.
We've took all of that out of nature and created culture. So culture is our creation. And it originated in the observational fields of the visible...'

3) ...'and invisible realities that it begins then a conversation with us. And now it's a school of intelligence that people go and learn ‘how to do’ engineering, but nature does it.'

4) 'And so there's nothing that we are replicating that is already not in the purest of state in the ecology of nature. But in the ecology of human consciousness, just as you were saying, how would we interact if nature reveals all these mysteries to us?'

5) 'So that's the ceremonial order. In what ways do we go to the source and interact with that, bring the experience into self consciousness, and then interact with that to create society? And human society is not given as part of nature. We create that.'

6) 'And so there's a place in all of this where we have to ask, ‘What is the human being’s reason for...?’

Charles Eisenstein, 'The question maybe is how intentionally we create it, or what we're expressing from within ourselves through that creation, ...' ..

7) ..'because there's certainly a lot of aspects of society that I wish that I could uncreate, or that seemed to have been created without conscious intent. Things that are very ugly and horrible.'

8) 'So what has to happen now for this human creation to become what my heart believes to be possible? I am not the only one who experiences the current time to be a critical time. Maybe everybody's always thought that their time is special.'

9) 'But I have a strong intuition that something is supposed to happen. Right now. That something can happen.'

'What needs to happen right now for this creative force to be other than it has been?'

10) 'I'm speaking from the part of me that just thinks that everything is wrong. And I know that all of the wrongness is a necessary part of an initiatory process for humanity. I know all that. But I want to be actually more specific.'

11) 'What should humanity, and we as humans, direct our attention toward right now in these times?'

Orland Bishop, 'Rediscover the power of the word.
We have made our word ‘nature’ corruptible. We don't mean what we say anymore. And we don't take into consideration ..' ..

12) ..'that there's a consequence in creating a shadow around something that is supposed to express fruitfulness. Reveal the nature of the “I” that is supposed to carry the greatest power in the world, which is to alter futures.'

13) 'And if the fundamental thing that makes me human is corruptible, there is no hope for the world. Word is not just what I speak; it is the process of me holding the integrity of responsibility for thinking, feeling, and will.' ..

14) ..'That's the word— the capacity to give the human being access to the laws of creation . And if I can't enter into that agreement with integrity, then I'm going to receive powers without love. I'm going to receive ideas without beauty.'

15) 'And I'm gonna engage with willful acts without love for anything or anyone because I'm vacant—my ‘I’ is not here for the world. It’s here for myself. And I can be in myself and not be in the world.' ..

16) ..'Human beings can extract themselves from responsibility to anything that is real in the world.'

Charles Eisenstein, 'And this is happening through a dissociation of the realm of symbol—which is a human realm—from the realm of all of our other capacities and being.' ..

17) ..'So there's this split—the more that it widens, the more we create inhumanity through the powers that make us human because of this disconnect.'

18) 'Orland Bishop, 'Exactly. And there are other entities that can exploit that vacancy of consciousness—impulses that we will call corruptible impulses.'

Extract from a recorded conversation between Orland Bishop and Charles Eisenstein in early 2020.

19) Charles Eisenstein, 'So just circling back to the power of word. The two questions are: it's almost like we don't want this power until we're ready for it, lest we use it unconsciously to create things that we don't actually want.' ..

20) ..'We want our felt desire to be aligned with the soul’s purpose before we wield this power.'

Orland Bishop, 'It’s a careful space for me to make the distinction of what is prophetic and what is prediction.'

21) 'Prophecy holds for me the understanding of co-creation with primordial forces—forces that are actually at the source of nature itself, not culture. Prophecy does not start in culture; it starts deeply within nature, so, deeply within the cosmos itself.'

22) 'The primordial laws that give rise to probability fields, when the conditions of the collective consciousness, is most true for that.
What we have seen, what you’ve referenced in terms of the Nazis or even the Feds, originates in culture.' ..

23) ..'And it's more towards the manipulation of an unconscious agreement—of unconscious prejudice—how to exploit that. And in fact, the ones who bring those ideas to the culture are themselves being exploited, because you can observe their unconsciousness of the idea itself.'

24) 'Because it's not originating in freedom; it's originating in a compulsion. There's no prophecy that's compulsive.'

Charles Eisenstein, 'But there's still a power of word that's being engaged here.'

Orland Bishop, 'Well, the word that is already corrupted- ..' ..

25) ..'the word that is already from a level of sense perception that has separated that human being from the responsibility of love in the world—they're not acting out of love, truth, goodness, and beauty.' ..

26) ..'These are qualities that are connected to the primordial instinct of creation, that protects the human being from falling into self-interest at the level in which they can accumulate so much power and will it without love.

Prophecy requires love; ..' ..

27) ..'it requires transparency of service of something greater than self-empowerment. What we see in the prediction of futures depends on, or utilises, people's own consciousness because you know behaviour.' ..

28) ..'We are already in an economic behavior of needing these people to tell us what happens next. It's predictable that people are paying attention to their words as the source of some reality.'

Charles Eisenstein, 'Right. Predictability depends on some kind of automaticity.'

29) ..'Otherwise, if somebody is truly in a creative place, then it's not predictable.'

30) 'Orland Bishop, 'They will be more transparent that there are more risks than they're saying, because we know that. But the behavior is that people want the economy to be better—that is our aspiration.
Are we really willing to work for it to be real, ..' ..

31) ..'according to higher ideals? No. Why? Because the feds could make and alter what we depend on is the currency to be where it should be to make sure the behavior follows the prediction. And so, again, market forces are not part of nature.' ..

32) ..'The market forces are actually human beings’ design to support where behavior gets expressed.'

Charles Eisenstein, 'I'm interested in this topic of the power of word, which you could say is the uniquely human power—it's what humans have brought that's new to this world.'

33) 'So any fulfilment of our humanity has something to do with the way that we wield symbol, which is, you know, you could say that it's not part of nature. Or you could say that it's the latest outgrowth of nature—utilising ourselves as the newest part of nature.' ..

34) ..'That's not an important distinction, but what's important is, to me, this power of word.
And so maybe I was using prophecy in a different sense than then you were. I like the way that you conceive it as—and I don't want to reduce it too much—but ..' ..

35) ..' as the power of word that is opened by love to its true potential.'

Orland Bishop, 'Yes, yes, yes.'

Extract from a recorded conversation between Charles Eisenstein and Orland Bishop
charleseisenstein.org/program/conver…

36) Charles Eisenstein, 'You know, I go around writing books and giving speeches and things like that—having conversations. And the through line of it all is the phrase I like to use—’The more beautiful world our hearts know is possible.’ ..

37) 'And I will say, you know that it's possible. I’ll point to the truth of that: you know that it's possible. And that knowledge sits side-by-side with all of the doubts and all of the despair, all of the lived experience in which your yearning for that has been crushed.'

38) 'All the times where it looked like life was about to blossom and it was betrayed—all of those things are there. And at the same time, the knowledge that it is possible, also is there. And possible in the sense that we can create it; possible in the sense ..'

39) ..'that there is a path from here to there.
And I'm aware as I say this, that by saying it, it becomes true—by virtue of my having said it. And as I was saying before, I'm not making it up. But it is a truth that requires word to be true.' ..

40) ..'And the reason that it is true is because...Why? Because I've seen it?
And I'm not saying that I'm connected to the truth of that every time I have a conversation. Sometimes I also am in the territory of despair and I don't believe my own words.'

41) ..'And yeah, I said that, but you know, I can enter a dark place as well.'

Orland Bishop, 'You remember when it came to you? When that title of the book came to you?'

Charles Eisenstein, 'I do remember when it came to me.'

Orland Bishop, 'What was happening then?'

42) Charles Eisenstein, 'I wrote it as the dedication to The Ascent of Humanity, which was a book I wrote 2004, 2005, in that time. Yes, I dedicated it to ‘the more beautiful world our hearts tell us is possible’.'

43) Orland Bishop, 'And did it feel like, to you, the world was a thing or being in our time?

Charles Eisenstein, 'There was a being.'

Orland Bishop, 'Anyone who perceives beauty perceives being. Even in the word—the word doesn't point to a thing.' ..

44) ..'Beauty is not a thing; it's a process when which my feelings are connected to a certain kind of illumination—of a presence of some kind—that supports me to interact with my life forces.
It's access to life at a level in which the blood takes up something all the way ..' ..

45) ..'to the level of the heart and utilises it to alchemize or bring me out of my past, is what beauty does. I forget my past. I forgive my past. I trust the future.
Yeah, it can be uncertain if it is beautiful; because what fills me is that future.' ..

46) ..'And in a way, language orients, and why we love poets, because they put language back into the life realm—the imaginal realm. We love philosophy that gives the spirit an orientation to stretch ideas into possibilities.'

47) Charles Eisenstein, 'I'm remembering now...it was the feeling of redemption. That was the feeling when I wrote that sentence. It was, ‘It's all worth it.’ Yeah'

48) Orland Bishop, 'I was meditating with that phrase, your title of your book, a few weeks ago. And I found that to be true. That, if contemplated at the level in which we ask the words to show us where it's intending us to go, everything is redeemed.' ..

49) ..'The world is forgiven; it's like there is no way we can say, ‘Let that old world die and then just create a beautiful one.’ There's no creating a beautiful one—this one has to be taken back from all the losses, all the betrayals, all the hate.'

50) 'And you give us that space to contemplate. Because that is the world that is instilled in the human beings’ feelings—we want to feel that relationship. And one can contemplate it and go there, the way that you did.'

51) 'So when I say you dedicated it, because I remember the phrase well, and The Ascent of Humanity [charleseisenstein.org/books/ascent-o…], this being helped you write the book from the level of the ascending will, which is aspiration. How can we aspire?' ..

52) ..'Because we don't leave the world when we ascend—we actually incarnate our spirit when we ascend. The spirit comes into the world; the beauty comes into the world—it comes into our life again.
So you've created for us a framework to interact with the processes..' ..

53) ..'that give the human being back the creative act— this is how I've read it—and understand that ascension, critically, is cognition—being engaged with at the level in which creation can return.'

54) Charles Eisenstein, 'Right, and it is about a return. I mean, the book is divided into the Age of Separation and the Age of Reunion, which is a return. And the title was actually semi-ironic.' ..

55) ..'Because in critiquing the kind of Ascension that leaves Earth behind—the Tower of Babel...to build a tower to the heavens & leave materiality behind—it's more of a redemption of, an incorporation of materiality, & a union of the spirit & matter, & not escape into spirit.'

56) 'And on the political plane, I express it by saying that in this revolution nobody is left behind. It's not that we kick out all of the deplorables and all of the unenlightened people and make a better world with the people who are enlightened and who get it and who are..'

57) 'conscious or whatever. But, in fact, what we need to complete the revolution is precisely those who we would cast out of it; otherwise, it cannot be complete. There'll always be something missing if we reject any part of it and just leave it behind.'
charleseisenstein.org/program/conver…