Thread by @OpenParlyZw

IF I ALLOW PEOPLE TO MARRY WITHOUT LOBOLA I WILL CEASE TO BE A TONGA TRIBE CHIEF

HON. SEN. CHIEF SIANSALI: Thank you for protecting me and allowing me to highlight my own thinking.

CHIEF SIANSALI: Madam Chair, the discourse that I am bringing in the discourse that has been debated already is that I as Chief Siansali coming from Binga district and Tonga in tribe will cease to be a chief if I allow parties to marry without lobola being paid.

CHIEF SIANSALI: It is my duty as a chief to make sure that lobola is paid and if this law being mooted will allow people in my area, which I may say my people, to marry under the customary law, which means the Tonga custom; you cannot talk about it without roora,

CHIEF SIANSALI: unless if we give it another name, not to say customary marriage. As long as it is a customary marriage which when applied in my chiefdom we will be talking about the Tonga customs, then it cannot be a marriage without roora.

CHIEF SIANSALI: So we have to think on either to amend as mooted or to change the name of marriage at all because if it is customary marriage then it has to be within the customs or those parties marrying which according to the Tonga customs lobola is key standing on number one

CHIEF SIANSALI: and that is the only thing that gives it a taste of it being a marriage under the Tonga customs. Like I said before, our thinking should dwell much in the African thinking.

CHIEF SIANSALI: Our thinking should dwell much in the Zimbabwean thinking as diverse as we are in tribes, but one unique thing that I am happy about Zimbabwe lobola is across uncontested. Another thing I would highlight, Madam Chair, is that we have got choices in these marriages

CHIEF SIANSALI: If there are any people that do not want to pay lobola, they can choose other marriages that dont demand that. Moreso, I will rest assure you that everyone that marries under civil marriage will still pay lobola even though it doesnt compel them to do so. Why?

MINISTER ZIYAMBI: Thank you Chair. I think the contribution was more or less the same. Hon. Chair, he just wanted to assert the chief but the contribution, even what Chief Charumbira said that you have a choice he repeated, what Chief Nechombo said, it is more or less the same.

MINISTER ZIYAMBI: For progress sake I think Hon. Chief Nechombo, if you can repeat what you said. I do not think you mentioned the guardian because remember, whatever we are going to do, we must also satisfy the requirements of the Constitution.

MINISTER ZIYAMBI: So if you can put forward the amendment that you are proposing and we move forward. I agree with the chief.

MINISTER ZIYAMBI: Perhaps if we had that thinking we were supposed to just leave customary law marriage and civil marriage just like that but the thinking that was there was let us have one amalgamated marriage law.

MINISTER ZIYAMBI: Maybe the thinking here is not the same but for progress - and then we will see going forward whether that would be acceptable.
Like I said, it is not personal about me. I like what the other chief said.

MINISTER ZIYAMBI: I also know that I was reminded that there are a lot that know about ‘shall’ and ‘may’. I was simply trying to explain, not saying that I am the only one here. No, it is not like that, but for progress let us accept and proceed.

MINISTER ZIYAMBI: Maybe the thinking was perhaps we should not have tampered with the Customary Marriages Act in the first place. We should have left it like that, save to ensure that we align.

MINISTER ZIYAMBI: So if he can tell us the way he wants it couched and we proceed and amend clause 16 to give effect to that.

HON. SEN. CHIEF CHARUMBIRA: Thank you Minister. We are relatives. We are united and when we debate, we debate as relatives.

CHIEF CHARUMBIRA: We propose the amendment & we are also proposing a new clause 16(5). The current Clause 16(5) must become Clause 16(6) in terms of what we are proposing. Without repeating, Clause 16 (2) is meant to remove the option or aspect of lobola and it reads as follows:

CHIEF CHARUMBIRA: “A marriage officer in a customary law marriage ‘shall’ or ‘must’, whichever word you want to use; remove the ‘may’ put to either of the parties. I do not know if both was removed.

CHIEF CHARUMBIRA: It should be to the parties to a proposed marriage or to the witnesses, any questions relevant to the identity and conjugal status of the parties to the proposed marriage and to the agreement relating to the roora.

CHIEF CHARUMBIRA: We are saying ‘if any’ should be removed and the existence of impediments to the marriage.

HON. ZIYAMBI: Hon. Chair, these are very good amendments but we need to couch them in a manner that will translate appropriately into legislation.

MINISTER ZIYAMBI: Can we report progress then perhaps we can meet and either we extract from the current customary marriage and see how we can couch it or they can get somebody to do it and then we discuss it before we proceed with the Committee Stage.

MINISTER ZIYAMBI: Otherwise, we will run the risk of rushing it and it will not come up the way that you would have wanted. I thank you.

CHIEF NGUNGUMBANE: On a point of order. I would like to find out from Minister whether when we meet again& looking at these proposals, do we leave out other clauses that we have not looked at?

HON. ZIYAMBI: We will look at everything that we have not covered. If we sit&agree.

CHIEF CHARUMBIRA: With your permission Hon. Chair, the approach should be to have an opportunity with the Minister to look at the whole Bill even the other clauses that we have not debated because we still have two or three proposed amendments that we have not discussed.

CHIEF CHARUMBIRA: It is better that we look at the whole Bill.

House resumed.

Progress reported.