Thread by @theBuoyantMan

Something even I used to be guilty of:

We don't want to pay for anything that will help us move forward to our goal of making riches in the market.

Even someone else's hours of effort, we want for free.

But we want to make lots and lots of money with the ideas they give freely

I call this the poverty mindset.

We don't pay because we think we can't afford to pay.

We may really not be in a position to afford to pay.

Long long back, that was the case with me.

Then I reached the stage where "I can't afford this, so I ll just learn from free resources"

So, I started doing things the hard way - learning from youtube, twitter, forums, documentations, etc.

That way I got better at learning things myself.

Also, I reached a stage where I could say if someone was bullshitting with pricing.

Some people sell a basic options course that you can find with complete structure on youtube for free, and charge 50,000 for that.

I learnt to call b.s on that very early on.

But then, that's the way they price it. They value their time at that price. So I learnt that too.

No matter how the pricing feels to us, it feels reasonable to the person who is setting the price.

And everything is a commodity. So, if we aren't comfortable about the way something is priced, we should just avoid it and move on.

That's what I started doing too, last year.

And, after running the python backtesting course, and getting to see some outrageous requests, I have understood this from the other side also.

I remember in december one guy who got an MBA from ISB for 30+ lakhs commented that I should price my course at <500 rupees.

I laughed at the irony. A guy has to invest at least 500 hours of his time and more than that through effort.

And the cost is 1 rupee per hour?

Even McDonalds pays better. I'd rather be flipping burgers.

Like this, there were many requests.

"I am very passionate about the markets. But I can't afford your course. Can you take me into your course for free?"

"I am jobless right now. I want to make money in the market. Can you give me your course for free?"

"I have lost so much money in the market. So I can't afford your course. Is there any way you can make a discount for me? 50% or more discount would be great."

These are the kind of requests I have been getting.

One thing I should mention - I totally appreciate the honesty.

These guys have what it takes to be successful in the market.

In their head - they are like "We can ask. If he says no, it's fine. If he says yes, the course will help us advance in the process of making money from market."

They are measuring risk reward superbly.

But, the approach stems from a lack mindset.

How is this reasonable?

You expect to make millions from the market, using someone's expertise. But you want that person to share it for free, or give it at a discount from an already discounted price.

I had this mindset long back in my first phase in markets.

That's when I thought information in YouTube or Twitter could bring some edge, and that freely available materials will lead to me making millions.

One out of 1000 such materials might. But finding that one is hard.

Then, that mindset changed.

Either we pay tuition to markets by consciously experimenting under controlled risk.

Or we pay tuition to markets by being dumbasses following strategies and methods on youtube and twitter.

I have done both.

It's funny when we expect to learn the secrets to winning in the market for free, without paying any tuition fee, and make money.

Nowhere in the world, in no field, will this happen. We will always pay something - in money, time, or something else, to get better at something.

The earlier we realise this, the better.

People with this mindset, tend to lose more in the losses they make in the market. (I used to too).

Whatever money they make in a good run, they lose in few mistakes.

The money that comes, goes quickly too. It doesn't stay.

Trust me when I say this, the mindset arises from the way we have been conditioned since childhood, growing up in middle class.

Middle class mindset will help us avoid getting poor. But will prevent us from getting rich and wealthy.

Coz, the wealthy don't think this way.

The wealthy are the way they are because they know that there's a price for everything.

And, they are good at understanding the value of something compared to the price.

When someone takes my course, they don't have any immediate results in monetary reward.

The most immediate result is they'll know if what they are trading is truly worthy of trading.

The next result is they will stop losing money trading unworthy strategies.

For most people, this isn't attractive.

"It prevents me from losing money stupidly? Why do I want that? Tell me if I take your course, if I'll be able to recover the 20 lakhs I have lost in last 5 years, within 1 year. I'll pay immediately."

Yes, this was a real conversation.

I can't honestly in good faith tell those people that the course will help them with that. So, I usually turn down such requests.

But it baffles me every time, even today there was an unrealistic request from a good samaritan.

How do I deal with these?

What I have understood is that, stock market, as a place, is riddled with people making super-unrealistic promises, and on the other side, complete unfiltered idiots who believe those claims.

A week back, there was this guy who approached me on telegram.

He sent me a tradingview page from a user named banknifty_ambani or something. That guy claimed 80%+ win rate, 2.5 RR, and that his strategy will make over 25-30% every month. Another strategy that will double your money every month.

The part that stood out:

The guy who created that tradingview indicator, and called himself banknifty_ambani or something, said that he was a **20 year old medical student** and that he was selling this **because he doesn't have money and that he's raising money**.

People like @shyamsek @Prashanth_Krish @WeekendInvestng etc., who have been in the markets for over 20 years say that delivering returns in the range of 25% per annum consistently is difficult.

And there's this guy who's 20 year old, claiming his strategy doubles money monthly.

And, this guy who messaged me, legit believed it.

He asked me to tell him if he can trade it.

I told him that the strategy looks suspect, and that it's unrealistic, asked him if he backtested personally.

He said he backtested it for a week.

FOR A FRICKING WEEK. 🤣😂

I was surprised because I was speaking to him under the assumption he was one of my first batch participants. Truly surprised that after all the lessons, the guy hasn't learnt anything.

Then he said that he wasn't part of the first batch, and that he just randomly messaged me.

And, he was considering paying 20,000 rupees for that indicator on tradingview, for a year.

The guy who created it has deleted his profile and vanished (and he made it clear he'd do so in a week).

And, this guy who approached me was most likely well educated.

How are very educated people lacking the basic common sense in the financial markets?

This is very much beyond me.

I mean, how do they do reasoning in their head?

Greed is the only thing after love that blinds men.

If someone says their strategy will double our capital in a year, selling options at 2x leverage on top of the 5x leverage the exchange gives - totaling 10x leverage, we believe.

We don't ask "what could go wrong with that!"

It's because of the hordes of scammy, but very clever people who sell these shitty things and bail off - that the ones who are trying to do something good get caught with unrealistic expectations.

To be a scammer - you only need to be cleverer than the dumbest person.

And, that's what they do.

Most people look up to a couple of youtube channels in trading lessons. But one of them actually earns mostly through their course and their youtube channel revenue.

Their actual trading revenue/profits form only 20% of their total income.

Nothing wrong with that. But when they don't practice what they teach/preach, how do you expect to be successful with their youtube materials?

This has been a long rant covering different aspects of this lack mindset in markets.

But really. Give it a thought. You'd save a lot of money by assuming everyone is a scammer, and just learning things yourself with free resources and approaching market with discipline.

But if you want to change your fortunes in the market, first change your mindset towards money.

Money is what you pay. Value is what you get.

You should have the basic common sense to perceive the value someone is offering, and know whether it's priced right or not.

How do you do that?

You use something called the NET PRESENT VALUE.

Seriously. Go learn it. Read about it. Then, calculate the potential cashflow through what you're paying for, for the next 10 years, and calculate NPV.

If that NPV is much higher than what you're paying for, you should go for it, if you can afford it.

Otherwise, it's not worth it.

Use your brain, acquire some common sense, and use it.