Thread by @Fact_Fem

📣#GRRBill FINAL VOTE TODAY

Duncan-Glancy (Lab): "Disproportionate barriers for transpeople... Recognised concerns exist on impact on women & single-sex spaces... we've listened to concerns & sought the best possible evidence"

Barriers are in place for a reason - safeguarding.

Cole-Hamilton (LD): VAWG huge importance to him.
"Clear that no provision around changes in #GRRBill create new or additional threat to women. Making it easier to obtain a GRC does not change who can or is likely to access Single-Sex Spaces."
🤔Clipped for posterity... we'll see.

CH: "No SS or protected space currently requires the presentation of GRC/BC for entry. Neither are seen as valid ID. Trained staff undertake dynamic risk assessment as to whether it is appropriate to grant admission to that person. That goes for prisons as well." #GRRBILL #KPSS

CH continues... "In the many countries that have gone before us, there is no evidential base of the abuse of the GRC system in those countries by predatory men. Nor have those countries sought to repeal that legislation."
E.g. Ireland - no GRC has ever been revoked #GRRBill

CH states that the delay has allowed "hate and heat" to enter the debate. (He did not specify what he meant by this or where this hate/heat ha scome from or towards who).
Aware that many Lib Dems do not support it. #GRRBill

Move to open debate
Joe FitzPatrick (SNP): "Existing process upsetting/invasive... many choose not to apply due to concerns about onerous process... concerned about costs/evidence & worried about having to out themselves to panel of docs/lawyers that never met them" #GRRBill

JF: Quotes Vic Valentine (Scottish Trans Alliance): States that gender dysphoria "pathologising and stigmatising" and existing process is "unnecessarily traumatising for trans people".

Kaukab Stewart (SNP): "Kinder system... enjoy their life as whole authentic self" #GRRBill

FitzPatrick really going for the emotional argument here...
Retells of the "trauma that the panel had to listen to". One told him: "Like being given a life sentence without committing a crime... it would allow me just to be normal, which is all we ever wanted." #GRRBill

Lennon continues with the personal emotional stories... interjects with another from a trans-identified male: Wants to "stop being the target of a manufactured culture war". Mentions being able to get married

I'm not sure why marriage is being brought up. #GRRBill

Fitzpatrick getting emotional as he quotes Victor Madrigal-Borloz: There is no such thing as trans rights, or gay rights, or lesbian rights. There are human rights... This #GRRBill will remove unnecessary barriers."

Was there discussion about impact on lesbians...

Brian Whittle (Con):
"Those expressing concerns have found themselves ostracised, castigated and condemned for having them. From the very start FM said she would listen to those with concerns, but words/actions suggest she has selective hearing." #GRRBill 😅

Karen Adam (SNP): "We ARE the majority. I know as a woman I'd feel an injustice at my rights being debated without representation. That is why I've ensured transpeople's voices have been heard throughout debate from the start."

But women's voices have been excluded... #GRRBill

Adam goes onto to tell story of a friend who is a trans-identified female. Experience ECT. Transitioned at age 60 years. Has urged MSPs to watch their YouTube videos #GRRBill

Adam goes on to say "Transpeople have long existed. They're not a product of society, mental health problems or neurodiverse conditions."
Mentions "international best practice" - I will add this term has no agreed definition in public health
Talks about being progressive #GRRBill

Paul O'Kane (Lab): Comments on wider debate which is "too toxic/angry with a lack of space to find respectful disagreement."
Dismayed that some contributions "fall short of basic standards of respect that should be afforded to some of the most marginalised in society..." #GRRBill

"Watching some of these contributions will have been hard for transpeople who have seen their lives discussed & poured over."

I wonder how Paul think women with concerns have felt throughout? #GRRBill

O'Kane: "As a gay man I have also found some of that and the rhetoric of the wider debate reminiscent of things that I have had to listen to all of my life and find deeply offensive."

Does O'Kane realise that many of the people with concerns are lesbian, gay & bisexual? #GRRBill

My observations... A lot of appeals to emotion so far. Mostly mentions of trans-ID people and difficulties for them. Concerns me that Lab/SNP/LD don't appear to have reflected on the impact on women or girls etc. Despite some very good speeches about it this week #GRRBill

Liam Kerr (Con) - Asks why supports #GRRBill when significant amendments fell & "his own (Lab) colleagues believe to be so flawed"
Am. 127 (Baillie) - EA10 continues to apply even with GRC.
Am. 130 (Baillie) - Act won't prevent provision of single-sex services (Sch.3 of EA10).

O'Kane - doesn't think changes have been insignificant.
Returns to comment on Gillian Martin's amendment which passed.
Presume he means Amd.40 - Existing police powers to assess risk of those applying for GRC ("certain offenders")... #GRRBill

O'Kane's misrepresentation of women's concerns:

"Want to reiterate once again for the avoidance of doubt that ScotLab are of view there is absolutely no link at all between sexual predators and the trans community. I think it's important to put that on the record." #GRRBill

O'Kane repeats further appeals to emotion and conflation with LGB rights and experiences of homophobia etc. #GRRBill

Pam Gosal (Con):
"I have heard, seen & felt first hand the impact #GRRBill is already having on women. As I've said many times, good legislation is about balance. No legislation should curb the rights of one group to the enjoyment of others. But this bill does exactly that." 👏

Thank you @PamGosalMSP for reiterating the impact of #GRRBill on women and girls.
"It cannot be at the expense of women and girls, vulnerable individuals and children who require the protection of the law. These rights are now imperial, on the cusp of being eroded in Scotland."

@PamGosalMSP She continues...
"Gov asked where's the evidence? Women raising concerns not enough? UN Rapporteur VAWG concerns not enough? As far as ScotGov concerned, clearly not... Concerns raised about safety of women/children were [not] going to be taken into consideration." #GRRBill

Maggie Chapman (Grn) - "Mostly I want to thank transpeople who have put up with delay, abuse, loss and grief. Today is for you"
Chapman goes on to describe "increasingly toxic environment" and "unshakable allies".
States that many of concerns irrelevant to #GRRBill

Chapman: Demedicalisation is key principle of #GRRBill
"There is no place for conspiracy theories of Big Pharma, child mutilation. They are not only so bitterly ironic in context of trans healthcare... but also false in outline & detail. Deliberately to mislead & muddy waters."

Some absolutely corkers from Maggie Chapman coming up!!
"Sex is not, as some would like to imagine, binary & immutable. That is why as soon as possible ScotGreens are determined to see comprehensive gender recognition for NB people in Scotland. You are not forgotten" #GRRBill

Chapman: "Under 16, for whom formal gender recognition would both be appropriate/beneficial. I will continue to work for this for trans children everywhere."
Her #GRRBill Amd. not supported - removal of waiting times & limiting revocation of GRC.
"International Best Practice"™️🙄

Chapman:
"#GRRBill now includes provision that I can only describe as dog whistles... both create & legitimise the context of hate/fear in which transpeople are obliged to live... "

Next quote DEEPLY concerns me!

Chapman: 😳
"Every time a marginalised group are close to rights the same story is told... the need to protect women & children, especially girls, from some new & insidious threat. It has never been true... We will look back at this moral panic with deep regret." #GRRBill

Chapman is denying scenarios relating to women's concerns #GRRBill - "girls are indeed vulnerable to attack, as transwomen know better than most."
Society is "built on self-identification". There is a "spectrum of trans myths" - toxic/untrue.
"The great feminist Judith Butler" 🤣

Chapman reads from anon letter from someone realising their mum is a "TERF". "Scaremongering myths"

Lots of appeals to emotion from Chapman and dismal of women's concerns, safeguarding and protections... unsurprisingly. #GRRBill
And yes, I have video clips! Moving on...

Michelle Thomson (SNP): Mentions personal affect on her but will discuss more broadly.
"I fear #GRRBill has missed an opportunity... [could be] more respectful for the rights of women. Instead the bill has created battle grounds where didn't need to exist."

Thomson outline need to take people along on a "collective journey" due to a "failure to respect a wide variety of view and failure to listen".
Thinks concerns of women have not been "treated seriously enough". Mentions EA10, safe spaces for women etc. #GRRBill

Thomson: Concerns highlight a "less than perfect approach to the entirety of #GRRBill & when this occurs it undermines trust in the perception of us. All of us legislating fairly & effectively."
States that small minorities have been "afforded significantly too much influence."

Thomson: "All need to be aware of the motivation of those who seek to influence us."
Argues "dark art of the Whips" was wrong. Should have been matter of conscience.
Argues there will be "regrettably unintended consequences & court action". Won't vote in favour of #GRRBill

Roz McCall (Con) asks Daniel Johnson (Lab) about Lady Haldane's ruling. McCall understands ruling as "male bodied man with a GRC is a woman, not a transwoman. How do you then take the safe-space issue?" #GRRBill

Johnson: "Rights are nothing if people don't understand what those rights are."
But will still be supporting #GRRBill

Tess White (Con) says been "inundated with emails from people who are deeply worried". Describes women & girls being "victimised".
"Not about a competition of rights. It is about creating the right conditions for the coexisting of those rights. #GRRBill simply does not do that."

"Shattered my confidence in ourdemocratic institutions. Women's orgs were an after thought prior to the introduction of #GRRBill."
SNPS rebels "should be applauded" 👏
White hitting hard at SNP's who did not rebel in favour of women/girls' protections.

Emma Roddick (Lab) - "I am cisgender."
Has lost sleep due to being told the debate is "respectful" but doesn't think it is. "Blatant transphobia. Calling transwomen men and denying that anyone can be non-binary"
"Managing to say horrible things in a polite tone." #GRRBill

Roddick mentions being a survivor. Says she understands being scared of men. Argues that those with concerns are scaremongering and not "a fair representation of what #GRRBill does."

Using appeal to emotion (again) - "trans kids"
Boy who wanted to be a girl when a child. "We should rally around them."
"This debate should've been a small one one afternoon."
Mentions ending conversion therapy and "recognising non-binary identities" #GRRBill

Greene and Baillie - Will speed through as realise #GRRBill has already been voted on.
Baillie (Lab) - thinks ScotGov could've provided more assurance & clarity over concerns for women/girls.
Admonishes filibustering from the Tories. Says would rather debate the substance of bill

Rachael Hamilton (Con) - with her beautiful suffragette scarf! Bringing up Lady Haldane's judgement again and why she brought a manuscript amendment.
Baillie says the EA10 provision still do apply regardless of #GRRBill

Findlay (Con) - "Ramifications on other parts of the UK... will #GRRBill turn Scotland into a magnet for sexual predators (quoting previous minister)."
What impacts will it have on police, prisons and NHS #KPSS
"Obscene aspects is that it opens the door to predatory men."

Findlay reiterates the misinterpretation about concerns of predatory men #GRRBill
Process for sex-offenders will be open to interpretation & too complex. Will place burdens on police.
Shocked ScotGov voted against Thomson amd. - to stop those charged with rape from applying GRC.

Robison also using appeal to emotion - reiterates contributions about personal/anon stories.
Mentions Michelle Thomson (but doesn't give same emotional weight to her testimony this week)

"Internationally recognised best human rights practices" 🙄 #GRRBill

Robison reminds everyone that Spain passed stage 1 for similar #GRRBill for 16yo & older.
From other countries says "No evidence of negative impact for others"
Shouts from the gallery:
"Lies! There has been a negative impact. But nobody is taking any notice! Nobody will listen!"

Robison continues... "As a women, I know what a woman is and I know the challenges faced by women in society." 🙄

Reiterates "No evidence of a negative impact for others" and evidence from Victor Madrigal-Borloz.
Hopes they can "unite and tackle transphobia"
#GRRBill

FINAL VOTE
Shouts of 'Yes' from chamber.

Motion 7312 (Shona Robison) on Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill
Yes 86
No 39

*#GRRBill is passed*
Claps & cheers in chamber & gallery.

Women shouting "Shame on you" from gallery.
Depressing day for women's rights 😔

Thankyou @AshtenRegan @MichelleThomson @RBFMaguire @Rachael2Win @PamGosalMSP @SueJWebber @TessWhite4NE @pauline4glasgow @clairebakermsp @FergusEwingSNP @JohnMasonMSP Kenneth Gibson @RussellFindlay1 @BrianWhittle @JeremyRBalfour @RealStephenKerr @GrahamSMSP @michaeljmarra #GRRBill

@AshtenRegan @MichelleThomson @RBFMaguire @Rachael2Win @PamGosalMSP @SueJWebber @TessWhite4NE @pauline4glasgow @clairebakermsp @FergusEwingSNP @JohnMasonMSP @RussellFindlay1 @BrianWhittle @JeremyRBalfour @RealStephenKerr @GrahamSMSP @michaeljmarra Huge thanks to all MSPs who listened to the concerns of women, spoke fearlessly/passionately on rights and protections for women/girls, and those who tabled amendments to strengthen those protections and to clarify the Equality Act 2010 exemptions for single-sex spaces #GRRBill

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