Thread by @redcoast

Episode 4. I'm very tired but I don't think I can sleep until I finish.

They are talking to a woman in Atlanta, in the US. She's the second accuser, they call her K.

The first quote they have from her says "I never wanted any of the stuff he did to me, including the violent stuff, but I did consent to it."

Neil says they had a two-year consensual relationship and exchanged hundreds of emails for years afterwards, and none of the emails indicate a problem.

In 2003, K met Gaiman at a book signing when she was a high school senior, at age 18. She and her friends went to multiple signings and also exchanged emails with Neil.

Afterwards, in 2003 or 2004, they get an email that he's moving to Florida and invites them to meet up. So her friends group and Neil have dinner. Then they meet again for ice cream. She says they were "18 or 20" at the time

K and her friend are staying at his house for the night. He invites them to come to bed with them. They say no, and he accepts it and goes to bed.

The reason I get sucked back into this podcast is that they keep saying stupid stuff. The host lady says, "The age of consent in Florida is 18, so they're legal here." Like, where is the age of consent greater than 18? Any examples?!

I looked it up: "The highest unrestricted age of consent is 21, though this age of consent is only the case in Bahrain and the specific instance of females receiving anal sex in Hong Kong."

Anyway, K says she got more attention from Neil after she turned 20. They had long distance exchanges, he bought her a web came, after maybe 6 months they met in Orlando for sushi and had sex the first time.

The journalist tries to draw parallels between Scarlett and K. She says they are around the same age (true), that they were both "under his thumb" (doesn't seem true of K).

K said Neil said stuff like "You're so intelligent, you're so smart, I want to be with you." K said she felt like Neil was ashamed of her because he didn't talk about her publically. (He's still married at the time.)

K describes herself as insecure. She says she thought her relationship with a famous person was the only thing interesting about her and she was "willing to do whatever it took" to keep it

K said that he was "uninterested in his pleasure" and that they didn't have lube, so sex was very painful. I don't understand if it's supposed to be vaginal or anal sex. She also says she didn't tell him to stop or that it was painful.

Ok. The journalist says that he wanted to see if K's account lined up with Scarlett's. Part of their claim is that Scarlety and K never knew each other, never spoke. So they couldn't coordinate, right?

Then they play a recording of him saying to her, "So, Scarlett, there was one episode where she said she almost passed out from the pain of him penetrating her anally without any lube." He told K about Scarlett's accusations.

That's also not what Scarlett said in previous episodes, not seemingly anyway. K responds "That happened to me too although it didn't happen the first time." (So what did happen the first time?) "He was trying to coach me to just relax and the more I tensed up the more it hurt"

K said there was no choking, but "a belt" was used. And that both made him call him master. K said he liked hitting her in "that area," that she said "that hurts, maybe not so hard," but he'd say "I can tell she liked it"

K sounds much more believable in general than Scarlett, by the way. Just my opiniom, again.

So far I found her account believable, but they've already hinted at emails and other messages to come later.

Neil's statement is that this is subject "difficult to talk about" because it hinges on "very private matters," but that K found penetrative sex "difficult and uncomfortable" "because of his body" so he didn't press the issue.

I think that's what they said anyway. There's a number of medical conditions, like vaginismus, that makes penetration painful for women that could have been a factor here. Or maybe Neil has a huge dick.

That might explain why she wishes they had lube for their first vaginal intercourse.

She says she felt guilty that they weren't having enough sex and felt like he was disappointed of her and he "took advantage of that." She isn't alleging any nonconsensual sex.

They go to Cornwall together in a private cottage. She looks happy in the vacation photos. She says they were fighting, though. She said they were arguments and also "a lot of roughness."

Now we get to the allegations of non-consensually acts. She says she had a really bad UTI (been there!), he wanted to fool around, and she said okay but "you cannot put anything into my vagina or i will die."

"But he did it anyway." She talks about remembering exactly what she said in Cornwall and that she didn't necessarily tell him no other times but she definitely told him that in Cornwall.

She says they drove back to Heathrow, stopping multiple times so she could pee, which she says was doubly painful because of the intercourse as well as the UTI. I believe her.

They say Gaiman denies this specific accusation of non-consensual penetration and any unlawful behavior during the relationship.

They're talking to experts again. I want to hear about the contemporary messages and emails though. I'm skipping ahead.

Neil and K get into an argument in Orlando, something about her having an infected eye and not wanting to go to breakfast? Anyway, he breaks up with her, cancels the rest of their vacation book and gets a flight to Minneapolis.

K says she followed him, bought a plane ticket for the same flight he was on, and followed him on the plane begging him not to break up with her. (Wow.) She says he was "not having it," and she was kicked off the plane and had her ticket refunded .

She laughs talking about it, in that "It's funny now" kinda way. That was the end of their relationship.

They report an exchange between K and her friend where K says she's taking Xanax because "Neil says I need to control my temper."

The journalists say that K and Neil continued to exchange emails until 2022. K said she started to think differently about their relationship as she got older because she said 18 and 20yos "look like kids" to her now.

Neil Gaiman's reply is that they kept up a friendly correspondence and their emails had a flirtation tone. Now this is interesting. They have an email thread from like 2017.

Neil sends her a photo of David Tennant on the Good Omens set. Just a photo of him in costime. K says Neil knew she liked DT. She replies (paraphrasing) "If I look up cheap flights to England will you tell me what hotel to go to?"

"My poor neglected loins are looking up flights as we speak." Gaiman says he'll tell her where David Tennant is staying if she sends him pics "of her breasts and bottom".

I believe this is all in a very joking tone, from their description of the email. Another thread has her asking him for help with con tickets.

He offers help and then they discuss his new girlfriend and the reaction of Palmer to her. Neil shares pictures of her. The journalist tracked her down and she said everything between them was consensual.

She was pretty young as well, early 20s and stayed friends with him afterwards. She only had positive things to say about him.

It really sounds like they tracked down as many women as they could and all but K had only good things to say. The journalists are trying to establish a pattern of misconduct,but it sounds like as a pattern of good conduct.

I feel like they have run out of content as this point, they are repeating talking points of earlier points. There's still 6 minutes left.

Uggghhhhh okay they are just torturing me right now

This is like when you run out of things to say and still need another page for your essay

If this wasn't 1 am I might not be in agony im soery

They're repeating facts about the law of sexual assault, how prosecutors dont pursue cases with no evidence, "How do juries think about it? How do police? How do judges?" For like 15 minutes!

Anyway, that's the end of their series. I think they are pushing for Neil Gaiman to be put into English jail. That's what I got out of it.