Thread by @SCynic1

@JW3London hosting @Baddiel & @YehudisFletcher discussing whether Jewish differences between Charedim & others Jews are reconcilable.
DB tells us he disparages religion generally & practices affecting health in lockdown are fair game for public criticism. #reconcilabledifferences

YF doesn’t accept flouting lockdown as a religious position but a cultural one, not driven by Jewish values. Nor are Jews - including Charedim - responsible for bigotry against them.
Charedim are diverse. People in positions of power push positions
#reconcilabledifferences

Charedim are “othered” by Jews as well as non-Jews. That can be unconscious.
DB - there can be unconscious antisemitism but there are no non-malicious antisemites. But religious dictat is stupid. The people aren’t idiots but the practices are.

DB has been asked to see if Charedi community can be reached via vaccination. The feeling was “Having the Chief Rabbi to do it is like having the Pope”. Not listening is stupid.
YF not explaining da’at torah: your Rabbi can give you advice. This has been grotesquely expanded to

include things like operations (or vaccines). That is stupidity.
But the Jewish community has abandoned the Charedim to the racism of low expectations. Practices are winked at as somehow “authentic” without being challenged [wow]. That leaves the vulnerable, vulnerable.

DB attacks on the internal gun organised religion holds to your head.
@HCGQC (Chair) asks if it’s possible to let go.
YF says yes, but not everyone likes it. But she isn’t as unique as people think. There are now discussions within the community.
DB says how can it change?

YF: we have to educate the community.
HG asks who IS a Charedi Jews?
YF: heritage, good Jewish education, little secular education. You can say it’s an ideology but there are plenty of non-frum Charedim.
DB: Jewishness is elusive. I left practice behind when I left school. But

the identity is multiform. I acknowledge religion - I’m going to a zoom Seder - but it’s not because of God. It’s because of who I am though I don’t believe in God. Complicated.
It doesn’t give me a moral sense although I like truth. And I think that came elsewhere.

YF: that matches Charedi views - it’s a way of life & your entire social system. It’s a v communal life. Leaving that is a huge leap.
HG: don’t Charedim “other” us?
YF: yes & it justifies adherence. But I reject that narrative - my beliefs aren’t threatened by other thinking.

DB: that’s part & parcel of being religious. I feel patronised occasionally.
I was once asked to light the menorah, said I was an atheist, & he said “so am I”. He expected me to say yes so I said no.
YF: there are atheist Charedim as well. It’s cultural, not fuelled by religion.

DB: I like doubt.
YF: they may not admit to it but they have it.
DB: I don’t respect blind belief - I don’t condemn it. I’ve sympathy for obedience but no intellectual respect.
YF: no one is owed engagement but people can still be respected. Everyone can set their own boundaries.

I don’t respect everyone. Human rights abuses are utterly condemned & the framework that upholds them is rejected. Even if I respect individuals. Visibility can be a curse.

YF: NHS England don’t understand the community. We’re at a boiling point but it began years ago and no one in the wider community did anything. Now we’re expected to about turn in the middle of a pandemic.
DB: I’ve learned about complexity. I don’t think I have anything to learn

from religion though.
YF: we can learn from entrepreneurial men and women fighting strictures now virtually redundant elsewhere. Treat us an individuals.
HG: a big thank you.
And I agree. This has been an optimistic & enlightening event.