Big tech also starting to feel the pain of location-based pay.
"So I got an offer from Google. It's a 60% paycut from what I'm making right now, working remote, as a senior engineer. Never thought I'd say this to Google: but sorry, no."
- an eng in a Central EU Google location
Big tech opening offices in smaller cities is based on the assumption that their brand can pull people in for cheaper. They also buy salary data that is outdated, as are their bands.
The Google-caliber engineers living in these locations already work for US companies: remote.
A lot of this depends on the local leader for Big Tech offices.
If they hire someone who is not familiar with the market, this is what happens. Google will have to either adjust their local bands at this location by *a lot*. Or... keep hiring in London / Zurich.
By the way, as Facebook will open 7 new EU locations, hiring 10,000 engineers the next 5 years, this will happen to them as well.
Solid sr engineers working remotely won't accept local, lower FB offers... unless FB follows a different strategy to this.
“The brand attracts tons of prev passive candidates. Many are underpaid on the local market already. A base offer is a 2x bump for them. We’re filling positions ahead of schedule. Yes we don’t compete w remote.” - a local recruiter
It’s another reminder on what works for Google or Facebook or any big tech… don’t copy blindly if you’re not them.
Not their hiring process, not their (local) compensation strategy.
And yes, startups can compete and win on talent vs even Google, locally. Just choose your game.
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It’s never been a harder time to get a job as an entry-level engineer, despite the hot market for seniors. Here is some advice on this: blog.pragmaticengineer.com/advice-for-tec…
However, even years ago, only 25% of enrolments in my wife’s bootcamp “made it” as developers with a job.
Bootcamps *will* keep selling the dream, and try to make a profit/living.
However, the sad reality is that its not easy to get a high-paying job in a few months through a shortcut. Most people will fail doing so.
Your support network matters just as much as the bootcamp.
London used to be the tech hub of Europe before Brexit (VC investment, # of tech positions, big tech presence etc). I lived/worked there for 5 years and it was great.
Still a good place... but Brexit is making EU engineers explore options outside the UK like this, one at a time:
As someone who has seen London tech at its prime, I think one of the biggest misses of the current UK government is not doing more to "retain" the London tech hub.
Dublin, Amsterdam, Barcelona, Berlin and other EU "hubs" are slowly, but surely pulling London EU folks away.
My response to "what is your take on choosing the next city?" was this:
FAANG (Facebook, Apple, Amazon, Netflix, Google) came about purely with regards to total compensation. ~2014 onwards these companies paid the most TC, in a large part thanks to large stock grants & stock 📈.
There are still few places you can make so much with so little risk.
There are plenty of places where as an eng you could outperform total compensation packages of FANG: most notably recently IPO’d companies (eg Doordash, Robolox, Coinbase, Robinhood etc) or when joining companies with good timing (eg Snap).
You had to take more risks for these.
I also feel FAANG is overhyped especially for new grads who desperately want to get in and somehow this naming fuels it’s own “myth”.
Professional growth-wise there are so many comparable places - with less competition to get in, similar cultures and compensation.
I'd also add that when you observe things in tech that *you* think don't make sense - e.g. hiring, promos etc - this is an opportunity to ask "why?" and dig deeper.
Tech is full of companies who keep optimizing their way of working, even it doesn't make sense from the outside.
"Hiring is broken!" - say people looking for jobs. "Companies don't know what they're doing" - many cry.
But hiring is full of tradeoffs, and from the view of the company and hiring manager, it often works well enough from their point of view.
Tech is a place where it’s realistic for many to start a company and do things the way they want to do it.
I’ve found this is the point many founders have “aha!” moments, when they learn about the constraints that have led to many “doesn’t make sense” practices from the outside.
For context: it was very, very hard for a senior engineer to break the €100K “glass ceiling” in Berlin. Companies like Zalando/similar ones pay €85K/yr in salary. No equity.
Doordash just doubled this.
Source: people saying thanks for this early tip who accepted DD offers.
Glad this person paid attention - and so are they.
When you’re early and few people know about some companies, and you suspect it’s a company with a larger than usual compensation package: it’s easier to get an offer than when everyone already knows about them.
With Amazon announcing they will allow remote work*
*with and only with approvals from L7/L8
Let me share how I’ve observed lots of long-tenured engineers & EMs leave Amazon recently. A hot market where Amazon caliber talent can get a lot more probably doesn’t help either.
Note that this for the US. In EU, Amazon still pays well (well… most companies don’t) and the infamous Amazon “PIP culture” is not present, thanks to strict employee protections.
Amazon has mastered paying for the least overall amount of cash for the type of world-class engineers they need (people building at scale), optimising the math for maximum tenure.
Basically, they are being the cheapest among the higher paying companies. This also bites them now.