Thread by @SVPhillimore

About to start. I am glad we are - at last - able to have these conversations. There is nothing dangerous or unsatisfying about being closer to the truth.

https://twitter.com/genspect/status/1502677537608155141

People from all over the world are joining the webinar. Simultaneous Spanish translation. Not only is detrans a huge part of the trans narrative, they are much maligned. Now 26k on sub Reddit.

Stella was told that detransitioners were ‘vanishingly small’ part of the community. Very important that we hear their voices. The detransitioners created this day.

Helena @lacroicsz talking about ‘fandom’ and gender identity. Online communities devoted to content inspired by media or celebrities. Stumbled on Tumblr.

Lots of other teenage girls - huge part of my life until I was 18. A creative hub. Encourages obsession.

Always plugged in to an alternative reality - unrestrained fantasy with access to thousands of others who share similar niche interests, creates an echo chamber.

‘Whittling down social experience to only those who are very similar’

Key demographic of ‘fandom’ are teenage girls: key personality traits, emotionally intense, creative, obsessive, introverted, intelligent.

Becomes a way to explore romance and sexuality while being distant from it - turn to ‘shipping’, fantasies about relationships. Behind their peers in terms of age appropriate relationships.

Helena theorises - Fantasy relationship with male character and dislike of his real world attachments, male/female relationship thus causes stress. Insecure about her body.

Intersection with fandom and gender identity - vast majority of girls are identifying as some kind of trans. Social Justice worldview is prominent in fandom. 'Cishets' seen as oppressors.

LGBT spectrum is elevated in the communities. Girls experience relationship fantasies between two males and develop aversion to female/male relationships. Groups of young girls all identifying as trans together - so easy to blur lines of identity.

Key points - young girls engaging in fantasies, celebrating males, being told being a boy is better and exciting and means they can avoid insecurities about male/female relationships. 24/7 exposure, no checks or balances.

Stella - what do people need to know about detransitioners? Sinead - many people here because of regret, but that isn't the only reason. Most common reason, realising gender dysphoria related to other issues, health concerns, identifying internalised homophobia and misogyny.

Also transphobia and social difficulties. It's not just about ending the medical process but returning to your previous identity. Internal mental process is huge and can rule your life. Letting go of adopted mindset where I believed I wasn't a woman.

Core of detransition is a recognition of reality. My reality was a was a female butch lesbian. All those things I ran from, never addressed nor dealt with those issues.

Carol @SourPatches2077 - kept taking hormones for a year even though I knew I had made a mistake. My therapist didn’t want to talk about It.

Grace @HormoneHangover understands why Sinead and Carol keep taking the hormones - so much cognitive dissonance already. Extremely painful to have realisation dawn. An ‘o fuck’ moment of undeniability. Devastating.

Stella - is there anything you can say? Sinead - they need a therapist who will listen to them and not suggest it is transphobia. Never once did I experience discrimination until I detransitioned and it was my therapist who treated me poorly.

Therapist claimed not to know what de transition was - a kick in the stomach. Thank goodness I had good friends and family.

Carol - advises to avoid therapists. I was told by one that transition excellent and she was transitioning a 4 year old. I broke down. Devastating. Try to find other detransitioners. Will give more help than therapists - supportive ones are hard to find.

Helena agrees about bad experience with therapists. Had a bad reaction to testosterone and made me a danger to myself. Hospitalised. Every MH professional, none of them mentioned testosterone might be issue

Helena was simply given Vials of testosterone and injected herself. No supervision. Sinead had same experience. Told to just use half vial - she wanted to be a man quicker. Offered higher doses.

No safeguarding, no care, no medical questions, no nothing.

Helena didn’t even get blood work. Simply given testosterone at planned parenthood. ‘You seem so sure’ - here’s a massive dose of testosterone. Carol had identical experience. No follow up after one phone call.

Carol had vaginal atrophy - planned parenthood had never heard of it. Helena and Sinead were not told about this.

Grace - we feel institutional betrayal. No assessments offered. Not following WPATH. These providers are ideologically captured and offer no mental health support. Carol - no money involved in MH support.

Sinead - can you remember their faces when you express doubts? I haven’t met anyone not captured.

Stella - this is a broken system. Not serving or looking after people.

Carol - biggest takeaway for regret. Transition and detransition will be most traumatic thing they have experienced. This has to be understood. Breast reconstruction won’t ‘fix’ it.

Doesn’t mean you won’t heal and be happier but you will carry it for the rest of your life.

Sinead - I would go back and talk about preventative treatment. So many people have transitioned who shouldn’t have.

How dare you hand out cross sex hormones and double mastectomies to girls with trauma like it’s nothing. Affirmation is disgusting and it has to change.

Helena - doctors are concretising transitory obsessions. Told All our problems stem from being assigned the wrong gender. They would have grown out of this or overcome it.

Now insight into autism from Allie - 48% of Tavistock patients were autistic.

Allie is 22 and on testosterone gel just before her 19th birthday. On it for a year and half before detransitioning in lockdown. She is autistic but not diagnosed until aged 20.

Never met a male detransitioner - seems to be women who go down the rabbit hole. Cambridge University study says trans people three times more likely to be neuro divergent.

Was very tomboyish child, raised in very masculine environment. Didn’t have female friends. A lot of social rules for female friendships - male friendships felt easier. Autism makes it a struggle to deal with social cues.

Tired of not fitting in with girls. Easier to copy male behaviour.

Thought I am not supposed to be a girl. Thought I had a ‘male brain’. That got into my head. I was 11-12 years old.

Discovered the internet. Discovered those who believe they were ‘born wrong’. This is the answer to my struggle - I was meant to be a boy.

I was groomed online and seriously sexually abused. Parents got divorced. Attempted to suppress desire to be male for 2 years.

Aged 18 decided that I needed to go through transition. The idea that ‘trans joy’ will save you from feeling outcast. Autistic people are obsessive - can manifest as introspection and over thinking.

No exploratory therapy. I went though Gender GP. Contacted in March, got hormones in June. Paid £300 and had 30 min consultation. I knew what to say to get hormones. Never diagnosed with Gender dysphoria. No discussion of MH or trauma. Did not contact my GP.

I look back and think - what the hell?!?! For the first year I was over the moon, felt I fit in with male group. Went to university, first time away from home. Had bad MH episode.

Suicide attempt at 20 and referred to a social worker. Told him exactly how I felt. He was first person who uttered word ‘autism’.

A lot of my ‘dysphoria’ was because I struggled to fit in with girls. Realised this was huge element of autism. I thought - holy shit! This was the turning point. I am a woman who struggled to relate to women.

May 2021 was last time I took testosterone.

I don’t regret that I transitioned. Would have wondered entire life if it was the answer - now I know it wasn’t. But also I wish parents had helped earlier.

And now Carol @SourPatches2077 will talk about butch lesbians. Sinead asks question - did you think you should be a man because you were attracted to women?

Carol - me being butch was more of a factor. Came from how I looked and had to move through the world. Disdain. Death by a thousand cuts.

For younger women their same sex attraction seems to be big part. Lack of visible lesbian role models.

Parents wouldn’t let her wear boys clothes or have short hair. Told she didn’t walk like a girl. Would get bullied at school. Can’t make connections with men or heterosexual women.

Unless butch lesbians find a community to ground us, we really get lost.

Sinead - how does it feel to be a lesbian and be told your same sex attraction makes you a disgusting bigot?
Carol - it’s one of the most disturbing things. I could not go to a gay pride with a sign saying lesbians don’t like dick.

Clothes and hair don’t make what you want to have sex with. It involves bodies. How do people have sex! An oestrogen flaccid dick is not a pussy.

Also a dildo is not the same thing as a penis. Lesbians always being asked this.

I have to go now. Huge thanks to those who have spoken tonight. Now, others have to listen.