Thread by @meksmith

It's a very early morning at #yyccc where council's special meeting with CPS and police commission is on today. Here's what's up for discussion, among other things: calgaryherald.com/news/local-new…

Mayor Nenshi is kicking off the meeting. A reminder that part of what prompted this meeting with CPS was the three-day systemic racism public hearing at #yyccc: calgaryherald.com/news/local-new…

Err, meanwhile:

https://twitter.com/KayceeMaduYEG/status/1304053521533169664?s=20

Nenshi is outlining some info about how police oversight in Calgary works — #yyccc doesn't oversee the cops, they're responsible to the Calgary Police Commission. So council will bringing forward citizen questions and concerns but they can't be "overly directive."

CPS Chief Mark Neufeld, police commission chair Bonita Croft and commissioner Marilyn North Peigan are here to present today. Other CPS/commission members are on the phone. #yyccc

Commission chair Croft says there's been a "sea change" in society's "willingness" to discuss systemic racism in institutions. #yyccc

Croft notes that CPS has been focusing on diversity and equity internally, and that has been "far too narrow," CPS needs to work on its external relationships with communities of colour. #yyccc

Commissioner Marilyn North Peigan speaking now. She's a member of Piikani Nation and she's been on police commission since 2017. She says police commission will be engaging an anti-racism expert to develop an inclusivity strategy. #yyccc

North Peigan says commission expects CPS to take action to "embed anti-racism into the core of the organization ... doing the same things better is no longer enough." #yyccc

North Peigan says commission is "raising our standards" when it comes to transparent reporting from CPS. Very interested in hearing more details on that... #yyccc

North Peigan says she inherited a legacy of intergenerational trauma just like Canada inherited a legacy of systemic racism, and reform and change must start now. #yyccc

Commission chair Croft says preliminary results from a survey the commission did this year showed Black and Indigenous people in Calgary have the lowest trust in CPS. #yyccc

CPS Chief Mark Neufeld is presenting now. He references the three-day systemic racism hearing and how BIPOC people reported being targeted by police. "Historically, policing has represented a threat to the safety of Black, Indigenous, mixed race and people of colour." #yyccc

Chief Neufeld: "This is not about a few bad apples. ... it's the compounding impact" of systemic racism." #yyccc

Neufeld says CPS agrees that police are not the best first responders for mental health or addictions crises. The job has been given to cops because they are a service that operates 24/7. #yyccc

Neufeld speaking about CPS commitment to report on race-based data, both in terms of police interactions with the public and internally. #yyccc

CPS is also promising to conduct an independent review of the school resource officer program, as BIPOC students have said having police in school does not make them feel safe. I was really surprised to see the scope of Calgary's SRO program:

Neufeld says there is a difference between carding and "street checks," which is what CPS does. He says carding is random and street checks are done when officers have a "legitimate, police-related reason" to gather someone's information. #yyccc

Neufeld: "We agree with the community when they say that the police should not be investigating the police." He says that reform needs to come through reforming the police act, but CPS is also moving to put civilians in charge of key internal discipline roles. #yyccc

Neufeld: "Systemic racism is not new but the conversations we've had recently are unprecedented. ... We must act, and match the courage of all those who have spoken." #yyccc

Neufeld is done presenting and Mayor Nenshi says he and #yyccc will have "tough questions" as "there are a number of things I'm disturbed by." But he says the "vulnerability and acceptance of things that are not working" Neufeld and Croft showed today is "historic."

Nenshi: "I've never heard a police chief talk like that before and I've been in this business a while ... I think your statement is historic, it is meaningful, and it is going to make a difference to a lot of people." #yyccc

Coun. Jyoti Gondek: "This is not about defunding versus defending the police. This is about ensuring police treat everyone with the dignity and respect they deserve." #yyccc

Gondek says recommendations from existing inquiries have already made it clear that the complaints process needs reform, and to accomplish that, the Police Act must be reformed. #yyccc

Gondek addressing Madu's letter from this morning that says he doesn't support defunding police. She notes that the provincial government in fact made budget changes last year that resulted in a $13 million budget shortfall for CPS. #yyccc

Nenshi chimes in: "Only ones defunding the police were the province." Background on that situation: calgaryherald.com/news/local-new… #yyccc

Coun. Jeromy Farkas speaking now, says he has asked the police to find cost savings in the past, like other city services, and they've delivered. "I do not at all support these calls to dismantle and abolish police. ... Our agenda must be to refine and define the police." #yyccc

Farkas says he disagrees with the statement in the CPS report that the foundation from which policing was created is racist. He also says that the report says this issue isn't "about bad apples" but addressing the issue should be about stopping bad apples. #yyccc

Farkas says he "applauds" the direction of the CPS report but he thinks more should be said about progress that has already been made. #yyccc

Farkas: "I do not believe our police service is a racist organization." #yyccc

Coun. Sean Chu speaking now. He's a former CPS officer. "Is there racist behaviour within CPS? Of course there is. I've been on the receiving end of it. ... Is there systematic racism within the CPS? Absolutely not. I do not believe it." #yyccc

Chu asks Chief Neufeld why the report doesn't include any mention of diversity resources at CPS. #yyccc

Neufeld says he agrees that CPS officers overall are not racist but the point is that there's systemic racism within societal institutions, including within police. #yyccc

Chu: "I believe this report is totally one-sided." He says there should be more about what CPS is doing well. Neufeld said the report didn't focus on that because he wanted to address issues, didn't want to appear to be "tooting our own horn" in the wake of concerns. #yyccc

Coun. Evan Woolley points out that #yyccc unanimously acknowledged systemic racism exists in Calgary institutions, including CPS.

Coun. Gian-Carlo Carra says the discussion from Coun. Farkas and Chu is taking things "in the wrong direction" and it's important to remember that #yyccc has agreed that systemic racism exists, including within the police.

Chief Neufeld says he doesn't believe CPS is a racist organization, as in the individuals within it, by and large, aren't racist. But he "stands by" the idea that there is systemic racism embedded within policing. #yyccc

Carra is asking what the "status" is of discussions on defunding the police at CPS and police commission, says police must address it "head on." #yyccc

Woolley is up next — he asks for Neufeld to give examples of how systemic racism has shown itself at CPS. Neufeld says systemic racism, but he pointed to a policy they recently found where you can't volunteer for CPS unless you've lived in Canada for three years. #yyccc

Neufeld said there are also people who get stopped, ticketed for minor infractions because they're somewhere police frequent due to it being a "high-crime area" and people might be subject to extra scrutiny and surveillance. #yyccc

Neufeld says police need to look at data to see if certain groups are being disproportionately stopped by police, it can't just come down to individual people and officers. #yyccc

Woolley says the CPS report mentions the killing of George Floyd multiple times, but he wonders about cases of police brutality in Calgary, including Godfred Addai-Nyamekye: calgaryherald.com/entertainment/… #yyccc

Woolley references Neufeld's swearing in, how he said at the time that the majority of police calls have nothing to do with crime — Neufeld says he's been calling for a long time for resources to get better resources than police for those calls. #yyccc

Neufeld: "We're certainly committed to working on alternatives that would reduce the demand on police." But he says if funding is allocated to other services, that needs to cut the demand, because police taking a cut but trying to fill the gap would be "untenable." #yyccc

Woolley is asking about details on budget submission deadlines and what info CPS will be giving to #yyccc before this fall's budget adjustments. That takes place in November.

Today's mute button mistake: Mr. "proper use of the mute button is an exercise in good citizenship" himself, Coun. Carra. #yyccc

Coun. Ward Sutherland says he's disappointed to see people "paint everyone with the brush" of American police services. It's different in Canada, and particularly Calgary, he says, because of citizen oversight of the police. #yyccc

Sutherland says "a lot of criminals" use the police complaints process to drag out their own court proceedings. I'm not sure what the evidence for that is, he's referencing his past experience sitting on police commission. #yyccc

Sutherland says no one is talking about the "elephant in the room," which is that police officers are facing escalating danger to their safety/lives in the field. Says "there are drugs that make people violent, and no one talks about that." #yyccc

Coun. Shane Keating, whose pandemic hair is quite the sight at this point, is speaking now:

Keating says the CPS school resource officer program "needs to evolve." He was a teacher and principal before joining #yyccc.

Keating says he thinks the idea of defunding police is more about finding more efficient ways to respond to certain issues, looking for a better way to do things. #yyccc

Keating says it's important to deal with individuals who are causing problems as well as look at the institution overall and how it's perpetuating a racist system. #yyccc

Coun. Druh Farrell asks about concerns that have been raised with police wearing symbols that represent "extremist" views — there was a case of this in Toronto recently:

https://twitter.com/BenSpurr/status/1303415539201695745?s=20

Neufeld: "Some of the stuff I've seen, the Punisher stuff ... I'm not aware of any situations like that here in Calgary at all, but we wouldn't allow that and we would take action against that." #yyccc

Commissioner North Peigan is speaking again. She says it's obvious at this level that there isn't consensus on what systemic/institutional racism means, and that has to be something police commission defines for themselves internally. #yyccc

North Peigan: "If we can't even get these minimal definitions down, how can we move forward?" She says she's "disappointed" to see the discrepancies at this level, and she's "shaking my head at some of these comments." #yyccc

Coun. Jeff Davison asks about how CPS/police commission wants to see future success measured. North Peigan says they must go back to the root causes of inequality, speak with communities and renew that relationship instead of just assuming what they need. #yyccc

Davison asks Neufeld how many mental-health calls police would be needed at anyway if a mental health worker was responding to them. Neufeld says that's a "million-dollar question," it can be tough to assess what is a mental-health call based on initial info. #yyccc

Discussion of the promised school resource officer program review — there aren't details of how long that will take, but Neufeld confirms that CPS won't be looking to suspend it this year, for this budget cycle. #yyccc

This meeting was supposed to have a "hard stop" at noon but if you've ever experienced #yyccc before you know that rarely means much. We're still plowing through #yyccc questions for Neufeld, then there's going to be a closed-session discussion.

Mayor Nenshi is speaking now. "This is hard and complicated. Slogans don't help on any side." He says he has a lot of questions... let's see if this wraps up by 1, when another committee meeting is supposed to start. #yyccc

Nenshi says if he's walking down the street and getting stopped all the time, the difference between carding and "street checks" is pretty irrelevant — he's asking Neufeld to further define what he says the difference is. #yyccc

Neufeld says street checks are a valuable tool for policing. He says an officer stopping someone in an area where they're investigating break and enters might seem "totally innocuous" to them but people being stopped perceive that differently. #yyccc

Nenshi says he's never been stopped on the street by police in Calgary but he knows many Black and Indigenous people who experience it all the time, to the point that they factor it into the time it will take them to get somewhere if they go out. #yyccc

Nenshi asks Marilyn North Peigan: "Are things getting better?"
North Peigan says "It's an uphill battle" and people in leadership positions are the biggest challenge for creating meaningful change. #yyccc

Ok there was just a little break to convene another committee that this meeting is now running into. It's recessed while this meeting finished.
I've been in the #yyccc media booth since 8 a.m. and I still haven't eaten lunch lol

Nenshi is referencing the Above the Law documentary again. He brings up the case of Godfred Addai-Nyamekye who was dropped off in a construction zone in the middle of winter by CPS. Nenshi asks: "Do we do starlight tours?" Neufeld says he doesn't believe it occurs in Calgary.

Neufeld says the practice of "starlight tours" is completely inappropriate and he would not tolerate it within CPS. #yyccc

Nenshi says despite Neufeld's statement, "nonetheless this happened to Mr. Addai." He asks what disciplinary action was taken against the three officers involved in that case — the two who dropped him off and Trevor Lindsay, who responded to a 911 call and beat Addai. #yyccc

Neufeld: "Since I've come and since we've constituted the new executive, we're extremely engaged in professional standards. I'm told that wasn't the case in the past." Neufeld has only been chief since last year, and the Addai-Nyamekye case is from 2013. #yyccc

Neufeld says there's a "trend" where investigations into complaints/discipline are started quite a long time after the incident in question, and that needs to be fixed. #yyccc

Neufeld says the Arkinstall inquiry illustrates the shortfalls in use-of-force investigations and complaints. Background on that: calgaryherald.com/news/local-new… #yyccc

The #yyccc feed is breaking up while Neufeld is answering Nenshi's questions, this is fine and great and I'm not screaming

Nenshi asks about recruitment, whether CPS should think about hiring differently and professionalize it more through something like requiring criminology or social work degrees. Neufeld says that could put limits on diverse populations they're trying to recruit. #yyccc

Neufeld adds CPS is looking at doing something like having a program that involves an initial diploma and then a broader degree that leads them to a career of policing. #yyccc

Nenshi asks what the police's proposed budget reallocation would look like. Neufeld says he doesn't want the process to be "paternalistic" in a way that CPS is assessing what will work, what's good/bad. But he's not sure how exactly that process will go. #yyccc

Neufeld says they'd like to look at different models for addressing "reallocation" and other crisis response. #yyccc

Nenshi asks the chief what the hardest part of moving ahead with change will be. Neufeld says a big challenge is the work CPS is still doing in terms of transforming the service, capacity is always a challenge. #yyccc

Neufeld: "I'm really surprised that some of this stuff is landing the way that it is. We don't have agreement inside and outside the organization. ... I'm surprised by quibbling about definitions instead of saying what work we want to do." #yyccc

#yyccc going into closed session now, we'll see how long that takes, but this meeting is already way, way over time.

#yyccc is out of closed session, I think this meeting may actually be about to wrap up.

Coun. Chu is speaking again. "This ideology of defund the police is designed to destabilize our safety." References videos of "riots, looting." #yyccc

Coun. Woolley says he thinks the CPS report is "thoughtful," and he thinks it's significant that it discusses how racism can look different, including in a "refusal to really learn." #yyccc

Woolley says council needs to be thoughtful about "bad apples" with a gun and a badge. He also says it's important to discuss the budget, since people at the July public hearing talked about how their tax dollars are going to a police service that they're afraid of. #yyccc

Woolley: "This is not a fad that is going to go away. What happened is we're bearing deep wounds in the community. ... We have to keep pushing." #yyccc

Coun. Sean Chu and Joe Magliocca just voted against receiving the CPS report for information. And the meeting is done. #yyccc

Some days you spend 7 hours listening to a #yyccc meeting and then you try to piece everything together with your scrambled brain for several more hours and still end up with something that barely scratches the surface of all the issues, but here you go: calgaryherald.com/news/local-new…