Thread by @MForstater

This conversation between @BretWeinstein and @DouglasKMurray is interesting - both for the visitor-local conversation on what's happening in Portland (it's really bad) and for the liberal-conservative discussion

There is an interesting tension between Murray's individualist view about liberty & responsibility & Weinstein's evolutionary lens. Murray keeps rejecting "we" talk (we fucked up etc) & Weinstein makes the case for understanding history as emergent systems where there is "we"

There is a really interesting (to me) bit from 1:22 where Weinstein is talking about incarceration rates of black men and impact on the bargaining power of women in relationships, & then on children. Where Murray says but not all uncommitted dads are incarcerated...

He wants a direct link and if not the explanation must be of moral failure. Where Weinstein is talking about competition in the market for mates when there are fewer available men. It's interesting how neither liberals or conservatives like to think about populations like this.

I think it goes against moral intuitions.

Fundamentally (philosophically) why I reject the sex-is-a-spectrum-gender-is-social-construct thing is because in being biogically ungrounded it closes off our understanding of social systems as the product of evolution -sexual selection

It's interesting how Murray, a conservative, who gets markets, and the problem with gender ideology doesn't seem to get this. Or maybe he does somewhat in the course of the conversation. Which is why it's such a good conversation