@Autisticcat2 Potentially, I fully accept that one could argue that there would be a different culture & society if autistic persons were 98% of the population.
@Autisticcat2 For one I think social model of disability would be fully practiced, with universal design incorporated into as many things as possible.
@Autisticcat2 One could also argue that autistic "logic", sense of fairness, strong sense of right and wrong, would create a much more socially just society and culture.
@Autisticcat2 At the same time it is possible for many persons to experience strong emotions, to be emotionally invested in things, one only has to look at debates around retaining Asperger's as a dx, or those viewing PDA as an ASD.
@Autisticcat2 Why I mention the above point is that it can be relatively easy to control society, to change culture, if they have resources and power to do so.
@Autisticcat2 I think the point you are getting to is more pertinent to a separate thought experiment of mine on "Milton's Syndrome", named in honour of @milton_damian
"What would happen if the autistic population proposed its own subtype?"
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian A reason for keeping the "world" basically the same in this thought experiment is too highlight how autism is culturally constructed and the injustices that autistic persons often face due to non-autistic social communications issues & their own RRBIs.
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian I am partly suggesting this thought experiment as a bit fun, I was not proposing in necessarily following the logic all the way through.
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian There is also an argument that if one deviates too much from the real world with such a thought experiment, how applicable is this scenario to the real world?
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian Also if one did start arguing that a 98% autistic majority creates a "better", more socially just society, culture etc. One could then argue that autistic people are superior to non-autistic people, maybe we should do eugenics on non-autistic person?
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian Taking this thought experiment that far, is a potential "can of worms" and creating debates I do not think are particularly helpful or comfortable to engage in.
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian The main reason why I think social model & Universal Design could be widely practiced in a 98% autistic majority is that most/ all of the diversity in needs of the current autistic population would need to be catered for and supported on a much larger scale.
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian Now considering how much money and resources is supposedly consumes now, that would be an order magnitude or two higher, with a 98% autistic majority, so barriers to leading a "normal" life would need to be systemically removed.
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian Which requires properly implementing the social model of disability and practices like universal design.
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian One could also argue that the human population, would look different due to how many autistic persons are LGBTQ. There would probably be entire different and progressive outlooks on the topic of gender, in a 98% autistic majority.
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian The more one considers what a 98% autistic majority might look like, doing more world building. The more one could argue it is not representative of today's world.
More I reflect on it, the more interesting and "nice" place this world sounds.
@Autisticcat2@milton_damian Yes, I think you point that some things are pathologised in mental health today, would not be pathologised in a 98% autistic majority, is probably valid.
"Instead, we argue for much-needed research to establish what interventions are most effective
for problematic demand avoidance in autism spectrum disorder." (O'Nions et al. 2018). thelancet.com/journals/lanch…
Term "problematic" demand avoidance is a HUGE problem
It is an issue due to the subjective nature in what is a problem, dependent on person's views, and the nature of the situation at any given time etc etc.
What is "problematic demand avoidance" in autism, is likely to be different for different stakeholders. I suspect many autistic persons would view certain dogmatic positions by some non-autistic stakeholders to be a "problem".
Autistics have joked about non-autistics being the ones with a mental disorder, or who have ToM (autistic) deficits, or RRBIs, such as overwhelmingly pathologising autistic features.
Has anyone joked that such actions, like always interpreting autistic features as deficits/ something wrong, could be viewed as meeting the definition for "autos"; non-autistics become removed from social interaction with those who are neurodivergent?
That effectively autistic persons can joke that non-autistic persons are also autistic, due to their RRBIs and issues with social interactions, including ToM & Empathy deficits?
I am getting the impression that O'Nions arguments for viewing social demand avoidance in PDA as "strategic" are contradicted by her early work".
O'Nions is partly trying to argue that PDA social demand avoidance behaviours are not the same as "sophisticated" behaviours of those with callous-unemotional traits. (O'Nions and Eaton, 2020).
In their previous work, they viewed PDA social demand avoidance to be manipulative in nature. See O'Nions et al, 2014 and 2015. This matters as O'Nions helped to develop two tools that view PDA social demand avoidance to be manipulative.
Fun fact. 10 clinicians (many highly specialised autism specialists) who consulted on developing EDA-Q, suggested adding question that assess for communication issues. These two questions failed to make it into the "validated" version of the EDA-Q.
"Has difficulty reading body language, facial expression"
&
"Slow to process or respond to questions/ comments"
It is ironic that persons that viewed PDA as an ASD, often from autism specialist settings, suggested questions that would potentially be indicative of autism for the EDA-Q and these questions are not in the final 26 item tool.
The Richard Soppitt book chapter is interesting, there are some issues with it. I will probably do a full lists of pros/ cons with the piece in the next few days.
Need to check his version of the original 15 PDA DISCO questions by Wing & Gould.
Unsure they align to what Gillberg et al (2015), or other information I have on the topic. For one, he seems to be conflating passive early history with speech delay questions, which were either in full DISCO/ removed.
The PDA literature contradicts itself over if there were 17/ 15 original PDA DISCO questions.