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हिरण्यरेता Profile picture
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18 Apr, 39 tweets, 9 min read
Indians never did tropical(सायन) astronomy. Since Stellarium is a planetarium simulator that runs on tropical(सायन) movement of the zodiac, this date is meaningless.
Read carefully what you wrote.

"That Indicates that Mayasura wrote suryasiddhanta WHEN ALL THE PLANETS WERE AT CONJUNCTION IN ARIES."

Is the region of Aries same for tropical (सायन) vs sidereal (निरयन ) movement of the zodiac in the sky?
1/2
Per Surya-Siddhanta's model (निरयन model) of the movement of the point of equinoxes, the region of Aries will be the same after 7200 years but per Stellarium's model (सायन) model it will be 100° away assuming 1° every 72-year precession rate.
2/2
So "Little Oak" in you comes out. 🤣
Science & "believe" don't go together. You shouldn't be "believing" in science (otherwise you become a member of the cult of Scientology, a variation of Abrahmism with god replaced by Science ) but understanding it. 1/
There are two things to be aware of.
1) Your "modern ....26000 years... every 72 years" is just a model/theory, not an undisputed scientific fact like Newton's Laws. So get down your high horse of being "scientific" and start understanding the science involved here.2/
2) Dating a text using some astronomical star/planet combination mentioned in it is nothing more than a simple junior high school level Time(T in years) =Distance (D, in Radians)/Speed of the planet/star(S in radians/Year) problem. 3/
But you will get a wrong estimate of T if that D is wrongly referenced/measured. And members, like you, of the "Oak School of logical reasoning and Scientific acumen" do exactly the same when they take a position of the planet mentioned in a text following sidereal astronomy 4/
and try to measure T using a tool based on the tropical movement of the zodiac.

It's like someone taking two points in the space defined in terms of their polar coordinates and calculating distance between two points using the distance formula of Cartesian coordinates. 5/
That's how stupid, ignorant, and unscientific all these "logical reasoning and scientific acumen" types are. The #SadReality of the so-called Hindu Renaissance lead by Protestant Hindus ranging from Arya Samajis to Savarkarite School of Rationality. 6/6
You all are the same ie Protestant Hindus. See this line you wrote.

"you don't BELIEVE IN MODERN SCIENCE THEORY of precession of the equinoxes of 26000 years and shift in 1° every 72 years?"
I didn't abuse but stated a fact ie a believer in Science.🤣
1/
Don't Shia-Sunni or Catholics and Protestants fight? But do they stop being Muslim or Christians just because they fight with each other? Same is the case with you Protestant Hindus. Be it Arya Samjis, or Savarkarite Rationalists, Brahmos or Steppe Tambrahams.
2/2
As far as the goal of archeoastronomy is concerned ie accurately determining the date of an event in past using star/planet combinations mentioned in past, the accuracy of measurement is not an issue.

Let me explain it through a thought experiment.
1/
Suppose you have two clocks, the first one is an extremely accurate (low PPM in terms of accuracy and stability) atomic clock and the second is a crappy clock (high PPM) running off some cheap $1 crystal.
2/
Now, a person starts the two clocks at the same time and starts recording the ticks of the two clocks over time.
Obviously due to the difference in the PPM of the two clocks the ticks of the clocks won't align.
3/
Let us assume that the person runs the two clocks for say two days (48 hours) continuously while recording the ticks. Now, at the end of his experiment, suppose that person wants to go back in time to say nth tick (starting from the beginning) of the crappy clock
4/
and find out its location (in terms of time) from the endpoint ie 48th hour.
Which clock tick record should he use to go back, the crappy clock one or the atomic clock one?

I guess you know the answer ie crappy clock one.
5/
Now replace the crappy clock with Surya-Siddhanta (for the sake of discussion) and the atomic clock with the present-era planetarium simulators using the planet and star ephemeris provided by NASA.
6/
The short summary is that "To accurately go back in time your method will have to be as much full of errors as the method using which the events of past were recorded".

7/7
You can believe whatever you want but if you use it in Scientological sense to mock and refute a logical and scientific argument then you will be reminded of the reality.
1/3
My original argument was that to make use of the Time=Distance/Speed formula, all three variables involved must be from the same coordinate system ie a frame of reference common to all 3.
To counter it I was asked about my belief which was irrelevant. 2/3
Again, the same nonsense is being repeated here ie tangential irrelevant argument. I am not asking you to believe anything.

"But believing in an ancient text that assumes a geocentric universe = somehow better than "modern" celestial model?"

3/3
"But instead of outright rejecting it, you could explain why you disagree with it."

The issue is not which model (ie 26K year period circular movement of the point of the equinox of modern science or 7.2K years trepidation period of SS) is true.
1/
The fact is that astronomical events(star/planet combinations) in Indian texts are recorded following Surya-Siddhanta's 7.2K years trepidation period model of the movement of equinoxes. So (as explained here ) one will have to follow
2/
the model of Surya-Siddhanta, not because of belief in tradition/Hinduism etc but because of the requirement of the scientific method, to accurately date the events of past mentioned in Sanskrit texts.
3/
But the mere mention of the word Surya-Siddhanta kicks in subconscious Scientological instincts among these Protestant Hindus and they start accusing you of bringing in astrology or not being scientific without having any idea of the issue involved.
4/4
I am quoting Vinay Jha for the pure unadulterated (with Padre Indologist BS) Vedic (Trad Brahmin) position regarding Jyotisha Siddhantas.

"18 ārsha siddhāntas by gods or rishis are mentioned in ancient Indian literature, but few of them have survived. 1/
Many of them are referred to by ancient authors, but the original works have not survived, mainly because they were not needed in later eras because an updated version of ārshaa siddhānta had arrived.

2/
Prof Whitney regards five of these archaic siddhantas to be sourced to some "revelation on the part of some superhuman being" :
Brahma, Surya, Soma, Brihaspati, and Nārada Siddhāntas. Except Brihaspati Siddhānta which has been lost, all the remaining four have been published. 3/
Surya Siddhānta

It is most popular and easily available archaic siddhānta prescribed in Siddhānta-Jyotisha curriculum of Sanskrit universities in India. Its mathematical terms are same as in Soma Siddhānta, Brahma Siddhānta, Nārada Siddhānta. 4/
Why So Many Siddhāntas ?

Thus, the conclusion is very clear : all the archaic ārsha siddhāntas, as far as the available records show, were identical as far as the basic mathematics and theory of siddhānta is concerned. Then, what was the difference ? 5/
The difference lies in beeja corrections which are additions or substractions of few degrees in mean positions of planets, as verse-9 in first chapter on Mean Planets in Surya Siddhānta says : 6/
"This is the very same original text-book (shāstram) which the Sun of old promulgated : only by reason of the revolution ('changes') of the Ages ('yugas'), there is here a difference of times ('kālabheda') . 7/
Traditional commentators of Surya Siddhānta like Ranganātha (1509 AD) as well as Burgess himself concluded that here Surya Siddhānta admits that all previous siddhāntas were exactly same excepting in one respect : 8/
beeja corrections in Mean positions of planets (because this verse appears in Mean Position chapter , and actual tradition of India also gives all beeja corrections only in Mean positions, never in True Positions or other elements). 9/
Hence, at the beginning of Srishti (Creation), the value of beeja was zero and there was no difference between Brahma-siddhānta and Surya-siddhānta at that time. 10/
Differences arose in later eras when value of beeja became appreciable and needed to be updated. 17 major updation took place after the Brahma Siddhānta. 11/
That is why there were 18 ārsha siddhāntas, of whom only the original Brahma Siddhānta and the last Surya Siddhānta were preserved correctly, others had no reason to being preserved. 12/
There is no theoretical difference between Brahma Siddhānta and Surya Siddhānta, except in the fact that the former has no beeja correction because it was correct for beginning of the Creation, 13/
while Surya Siddhānta has "Kālabheda" and must include the beeja corrections for present era."
14/14
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हिरण्यरेता Profile picture
19 Apr
If a Savarna really understands (ie by Buddhi developing an understanding of Siddhantas in Gita and Upanishads, not merely quoting a line or shloka from here and there) Varna is by birth, he will stop being an Asur/Aatatyin to Varnas below him or her.
1/
As Vashishtha Ji says, it comes straight from the viewpoint of keeping Varna order intact.

सोचिअ बिप्र जो बेद बिहीना। तजि निज धरमु बिषय लयलीना॥
सोचिअ नृपति जो नीति न जाना। जेहि न प्रजा प्रिय प्रान समाना॥2॥
2/
भावार्थ:-सोच उस ब्राह्मण का करना चाहिए, जो वेद नहीं जानता और जो अपना धर्म छोड़कर विषय भोग में ही लीन रहता है। उस राजा का सोच करना चाहिए, जो नीति नहीं जानता और जिसको प्रजा प्राणों के समान प्यारी नहीं है॥
3/3
Read 4 tweets
हिरण्यरेता Profile picture
19 Apr
These 5 shlokas of Gita to understand the experience of Prapancha (Universe) and the transition of Drashta from one to another (ie birth and death).

The following two states Drashta/Cognizer not affect by and stays the same during birth & death.
1/
न जायते म्रियते वा कदाचिन्
नायं भूत्वा भविता वा न भूयः ।
अजो नित्यः शाश्वतोऽयं पुराणो
न हन्यते हन्यमाने शरीरे ॥ २-२०॥

वासांसि जीर्णानि यथा विहाय
नवानि गृह्णाति नरोऽपराणि ।
तथा शरीराणि विहाय जीर्णा-
न्यन्यानि संयाति नवानि देही ॥ २-२२॥
2/
This explaining the mechanism of the perception ie how one experiences the Prapancha (Universe).
इन्द्रियाणि पराण्याहुरिन्द्रियेभ्यः परं मनः ।
मनसस्तु परा बुद्धिर्यो बुद्धेः परतस्तु सः ॥ ३-४२॥
3/
Read 6 tweets
हिरण्यरेता Profile picture
19 Apr
This FB post by Vinay Jha.

"मीडिया अपने राजनैतिक पक्षपात के अनुसार रिपोर्टिंग करती है । भारत में अभी भारत में कोरोना का प्रकोप अभी कैसा चल रहा है इसका सबसे स्पष्ट सूचकाङ्क है पिछले सात दिनों में नये संक्रमित व्यक्तियों का दैनिक औसत तथा
1/ Image
प्रति एक लाख जनसंख्या में वह दैनिक औसत जो संलग्न सारिणी में अन्तिम दो कॉलम हैं । पहले दो कॉलम हैं कुल संक्रमित व्यक्ति，तथा प्रति एक लाख जनसंख्या में कुल संक्रमित व्यक्ति । स्रोत है न्यूयॉर्क टाइम्स ।
2/
अन्तिम कॉलम (प्रति एक लाख जनसंख्या में पिछले एक सप्ताह के दैनिक औसत) के अनुसार सारिणी है । लाल रेखा है प्रति एक लाख जनसंख्या में पिछले एक सप्ताह का राष्ट्रीय दैनिक औसत ।
3/
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हिरण्यरेता Profile picture
15 Apr
It took me almost 15 years to get an inkling of what's "अविद्या" in Vedanta. It was the result of listening following spoken by Swami Akhandananda Ji in the context of Aagam Parakaran of Mandukya Karika. Just in case someone interested.
1/
"अच्छा जी, यह अविद्या कहाँसे आयी? तो वेदान्ती लोग कहते हैं कि,

"अविद्यास्तीत्यविद्यायामेवासित्वा प्रकल्प्यते।
ब्रह्मदृष्ट्या त्वविद्येयं न कथञ्चन विद्यते॥" ~ (पंचदशी)

अविद्यामें बैठकर ही अविद्याकी कल्पना की जाती है।
2/
ब्रह्म-दृष्टिसे तो अविद्या न थी, न है, न होगी। ब्रह्म दृष्टिसे तो अविद्यमान ही है यह। परन्तु,अविद्यमान होनेपर भी मनुष्यको जो "अज्ञोऽहं" यह अनुभूति होती है, इस अनुभूतिके बलपर अविद्याकी कल्पना करनी पड़ती है।
3/
Read 21 tweets
हिरण्यरेता Profile picture
14 Apr
" “हिन्दू नववर्ष” कहना अनुचित है । “हिन्दू” शब्द अवैदिक है । सनातनी वा वैदिक नववर्ष कह सकते हैं । उससे भी बेहतर है केवल “नववर्ष” कहना, क्योंकि यह एकमात्र वैज्ञानिक एवं प्राकृतिक एवं दिव्य एवं अनादि एवं शाश्वत नववर्ष है,
1/
अन्य सब तो चाण्डालवर्ष वा म्लेच्छवर्ष वा व्रात्यवर्ष आदि हैं जो आर्यों द्वारा समाज से बहिष्कृत संस्कारहीन लोगों ने आरम्भ किये — उन सबमें सर्वाधिक भ्रष्ट एवं अवैज्ञानिक है ईसाई कैलेण्डर ।
2/
केवल वैदिक नववर्ष के अनुसार धार्मिक अनुष्ठानों का फल मिलता है। वैदिक कालमान नौ प्रकार के होते हैं,जिनमें संक्रान्ति वाले वर्ष एवं मासों का फल देश पर घटित होता है,यद्यपि व्यक्तियों को भी उस काल के जप−तप का फल मिलता है,जबकि धार्मिक कर्मों का वर्ष चैत्र शुक्लादि से आरम्भ होता है।3/
Read 22 tweets
हिरण्यरेता Profile picture
14 Apr
The same question applies to all the scientific theories of cosmology eg the Big Bang. They are nothing but imagination as by their own admission these theories deny the presence of any form of intelligence/consciousness at the start.
It's very simple. Between अहम् (Drashta) and इदम् (Drishya) there is never a state when अहम् is not present ie अहम् (Drashta) is experienced even when इदम् (Drishya) is not experienced ie during deep sleep.

Vidyaranaya Swami has answered this question in his Panchdashi.

किसी वस्तु के ज्ञान न होने का ज्ञान (तम अथवा अज्ञान) ही सुषुप्ति का विषय अथवा दृश्य है।

Read 5 tweets

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