Tim Thurley Profile picture
Sep 28, 2022 22 tweets 10 min read Read on X
The Order in Council has again raised the question of what constitutes a “variant” of a prohibited firearm. I filed an ATIP and got some answers, along with many more questions. Thread, with extracts throughout.🧵
Firearms classification includes two broad categories: firearms classified by characteristic, and firearms classified by name. Those assigned by name include the AR-15. By design, it would be a non-restricted (NR) firearm; by name, first restricted and then prohibited.
Variants act to classify the rest of the “family” of firearms. This makes some sense. Renaming a firearm alone shouldn’t be sufficient to change its legal classification.

But how do we know what a variant is? Where is the line?
That line has been blurry, and resulted in some very weird cases. The most famous is the @MossbergCorp Blaze 47. The Blaze is NR. The Blaze 47 - exact same gun, different appearance - is a prohibited AK-47 variant under Former Prohibited Weapons Order, No. 13.
This is naturally confusing and controversial. How can the exact same gun with the same internals, same calibre, and same function be simultaneously NR and prohibited depending on how it looks?

Variants are also a current issue in a court case with the ATRS Modern Sporter #OIC.
My #ATIP to the @rcmpgrcpolice brought a little bit of clarity to this. Sort of. But not really.

First, as many expected based on inconsistency of classifications, there's no functional definition of variant, even internally. It is an individual determination, based on:
Does the design match? The RCMP uses the example of substituting wood for steel. That's fair. It also uses the example of changing the action to substitute a different calibre, which can be a fairly consequential change to the design, but alright.
Is the variant somehow defined in law? This is mostly out of the hands of the RCMP too, but I will be interested to see how broadly the courts allow the Canadian government to define a variant.
Purpose of firearm. This also makes some sense. A firearm designed solely as a trainer for another firearm is probably going to simulate that firearm to an extent, and we can generously assume the government might intend to incorporate it in the regulations.
The same family is also a reasonable way to define a variant, but the RCMP internal document proceeds to hedge this in such broad language that this becomes meaningless after the first sentence.
Now it gets wild. Advertising, depiction by the press, and depiction by the manufacturer.

These have nothing to do with how a firearm functions. Finding an advertisement, or a press article, that links a firearm to a prohibited firearm can contribute to a "variant" definition.
Note that this is not limited to a manufacturer's technical description of a firearm, but also how they advertise it or how the press depicts it. Have a gun that is nothing like a prohibited firearm, but is poorly advertised or reported on? Good luck!
Historical significance. Again, nothing to do with the function or even appearance, and everything to do with later sales or linkages. As a recovering history major you bet I'll be filing more requests here.
Interchangeable parts. These sometimes imply some functional similarities, but not necessarily. The description does not lend us insight into what level of interchangeability is necessary.
And appearance. I'll just let you read this yourselves.
Still confused? Good. Here is your continuum of variants:
A few key takeaways:

1) This confirms what many long suspected: there is no clear formula or definition for determining a variant.

2) Elements unrelated to function, internal design or even calibre, like appearance, ads, and history, matter to the result.
3) Even after reading the internal rules, a manufacturer, owner, or importer is nowhere closer to understanding a potential classification. This opens the system to arbitrary rule, something we should try to avoid when implementing law.
Even a technician reading these rules could end up with a wildly different classification than another technician. This demands definition in written or case law, and I sincerely hope we get that from ongoing court cases.
Oh and @mattgurney, can't believe I forgot you.

• • •

Missing some Tweet in this thread? You can try to force a refresh
 

Keep Current with Tim Thurley

Tim Thurley Profile picture

Stay in touch and get notified when new unrolls are available from this author!

Read all threads

This Thread may be Removed Anytime!

PDF

Twitter may remove this content at anytime! Save it as PDF for later use!

Try unrolling a thread yourself!

how to unroll video
  1. Follow @ThreadReaderApp to mention us!

  2. From a Twitter thread mention us with a keyword "unroll"
@threadreaderapp unroll

Practice here first or read more on our help page!

More from @timthurley

Mar 30, 2023
The firearm proposals here are far worse than I expected, and with less basis in evidence.

Worth noting before I delve into details that the three largest mass casualty homicide events since C-68 have been, in order:

1) Illegal, smuggled firearms
2) Mass stabbing
3) Vehicle
None of the new gun control recommendations would have had any impact on any of these attacks.

There are some egregious inaccuracies, such as: saying he had "...semi-auto firearms rather
than ordinary hunting rifles or shotguns."

Semi-auto guns are 'ordinary' guns for hunting.
They rely almost entirely on reports by researchers who are not neutral and often do not pretend to be. The most moderate voice is R. B. Brown. The Australian report is heavily slanted. The Commission doesn't sincerely engage with Canadian research on firearm legislation.
Read 17 tweets
Mar 28, 2023
The co-Chair of Doctors for Protection from Guns wrote a letter to the editor of the National Post about my article today.

It's laden with inaccurate depictions of my article and position and, in my personal view, contains few solid rebuttals.
There is absolutely a problem with violence.

There is also a massive problem with the solutions they suggest: sweeping bans and massive expenditures which will not save lives and will not make Canada safer, misdirecting us from spending energy on solutions which can work. Image
My article suggests a large number of actions that can be taken and are backed by evidence. That is not the position of someone who is dismissing or denying a problem, but the position of someone working in good faith to solve it.
Read 9 tweets
Jan 24, 2023
My working theory on this is that the Liberal Party sought to campaign against the USA using gun lobby groups as a domestic proxy.

That's been a consistent and safe Liberal political strategy. Guns are just a useful tool to achieve it.
Domestic gun lobby groups are pretty tiny and not very wealthy. Despite Trudeau's rhetoric on the power of the gun lobby, the Liberals know this. That's why they thought it was safe to run against those groups, and why the Liberals pump up that conflict in their rhetoric.
This is also why the AR-15 ban was pretty safe political territory at first. It's widely associated in the public imagination with mass shootings in the United States, and was a powerful image to connect to your opponents even though that's not a valid association in Canada.
Read 10 tweets
Jan 23, 2023
Regularly receive questions on why I discuss Indigenous-specific issues when it comes to firearms so often when #BillC21 impacts most lawful firearm owners in Canada for no additional public safety benefit.

It's a good question. I'd like to go into some of the reasons:
First, the government has a specific duty to consult and accommodate Indigenous peoples in areas that adversely impact established Indigenous legal rights. Hunting is a well-established Indigenous right. #C21 adversely impacts it by prohibiting important tools.
The #Liberal government makes a grand theatre of respecting #Indigenous rights but regularly fails to follow through. This is one such instance. The government failed to hold a single meeting specific to the central issue of #C21 (the ban) with Indigenous groups.
Read 11 tweets
Sep 28, 2022
Afraid @TopeOriola is wrong here. I've been a critic of police politicization in the past, but this isn't that. Gov has the right to set policing priorities.

Plus, the whole point of the damn program is to take legal guns away from the law-abiding. globalnews.ca/news/9160552/a…
That's the government's stated intent. It doesn't need to be a blanket ban of guns to meet that definition. It can be limited and still do that.

Not going to get into the further flaws: the buyback doesn't change mag caps, the ban targets literal hunting rifles, but damn.
If the government decided to ban every single firearm but the Mauser 98 and her variants, it would be ridiculous to say the government isn't attempting to take guns from legal owners because they haven't banned *everything* yet.
Read 4 tweets
Sep 27, 2022
This is a dangerous conflation of two unrelated issues from a reporter. Minister isn't directing the RCMP not to seize crime guns, such as those seized in the road rage incident. The direction is to avoid participating in the so-called buyback. That's not the same thing at all.
Participation in the firearm confiscation program by police and the seizure of firearms upon license revocation or illegal activity by police are entirely different activities. One will proceed without the other. To conflate them misleads the public. @GlobalCalgary
The latter is directed at those who have broken the law, and will continue. The former is directed only at those who haven't and is a spectacular waste of public money. @shandro is quite right to direct police resources accordingly if he also sees it this way.
Read 4 tweets

Did Thread Reader help you today?

Support us! We are indie developers!


This site is made by just two indie developers on a laptop doing marketing, support and development! Read more about the story.

Become a Premium Member ($3/month or $30/year) and get exclusive features!

Become Premium

Don't want to be a Premium member but still want to support us?

Make a small donation by buying us coffee ($5) or help with server cost ($10)

Donate via Paypal

Or Donate anonymously using crypto!

Ethereum

0xfe58350B80634f60Fa6Dc149a72b4DFbc17D341E copy

Bitcoin

3ATGMxNzCUFzxpMCHL5sWSt4DVtS8UqXpi copy

Thank you for your support!

Follow Us!

:(