Thread by @UR_Ninja

Court begins now for Day 10 of trial in 'Sines v. Kessler', the federal civil lawsuit brought against organizers of the 'Unite The Right' rally by @IntegrityforUSA on behalf of survivors of the car attack & other violence the weekend of August 12, 2017: unicornriot.ninja/2021/unite-the…

This thread will become a list of all our live updates from today. Tweets from day 9 can be found below:

https://twitter.com/UR_Ninja/status/1456248447015653381?s=20

Chris Cantwell, a neo-nazi defendant representing himself, is continuing his cross-examination of alt-right leader Richard Spencer that began yesterday afternoon (Spencer, Cantwell's co-defendant, is also representing himself)

Cantwell pulls up the text where he said he was "willing to risk violence and incarceration for our cause..."

Cantwell asks Spencer: "are there many people who would break the law to hurt you?" Plaintiffs object, Judge Norman Moon sustains the objection

Cantwell: do you sometimes fear for your safety?

Spencer: Yes

Cantwell: why...?

Spencer: beginning in 2017, I attended the presidential inauguration.... I was giving an interview... and we were near a counter-protest.. and someone jumped out of the crowd and...punched me... throughout 2017 I received countless threats...

Cantwell: did some of those threats and attacks come from an identifiable group?

Spencer: the so-called antifa, yes

Cantwell: do you understand it to be a common antifa tactic to claim victimhood after attacking?

Plaintiffs: objection, leading

Judge Moon: that's leading...

Judge Moon: is your ultimate goal to prove your actions or his? He can explain why he did something but he cannot explain something you did... you can ask him anything about antifa that you and he experienced together?

Cantwell: do you think it at all odd that I discussed violence and incarceration in this discussiom with you?

Spencer: no... this was a very controversial...

Judge Moon: that's the answer...

Cantwell: Why?

Spencer: antifa was a very real thing... they would often use violent tactics or passive aggressive tactics...

Cantwell: I take it you understand risk, then?... when one is willing to risk something are the desire and the risked outcome usually opposite?

Plaintiffs: objection

Cantwell: so if someone is risking violence and incarceration does that mean that's what they're trying to accomplish?

Objection, sustained

Cantwell is asking Richard Spencer about the origins of the term alt-right - Cantwell asks Spencer if Paul Gottfried, who helped coin the term, was "Jewish" - "so you and a Jewish man coined the term alt-right?"

Judge Moon: let's move on... it's not worth the time it doesn't prove anything

Cantwell: do you see yourself as the leader of the alt-right?

Spencer: yes

Cantwell: did you get invited to events for the... mainstream right?

Spencer: no

Cantwell: did you want to mainstream the alt-right?

Spencer: yes that was my desire, to make it a mainstream movement?

Cantwell: do you think that violent crime is popular... that violent crime would be a good way to take the alt-right mainstream?... if you want the alt-right to be mainstream then why encourage supporters to take part in racially motivated violence?

Spencer: i was not doing that

Cantwell is talking about the Eliott Kline deposition now

Cantwell: was violent humor part of the alt-right?

Spencer: yes, it was juvenile... everyone wanted to be the "edgiest"... it was very "heavy metal"

Cantwell: have you studied the subject of rhetoric? What books have you read?

Spencer: pedantically lists off authors and topics

Cantwell: you ever watch GI Joe as a kid?

Spencer: I did

Cantwell: do you remember 'knowing is half the battle'?

Spencer...yes

Cantwell asks Spencer about the meaning of "hyperbole"

Cantwell asks Spencer about the term "zombie apocalypse", plaintiffs object, Judge Moon asks if that term came up in testimony. Cantwell asks Spencer if "RaHoWa" ("racial holy war") is a "real thing", Spencer says he thinks "a rock band coined that"..."it's obviously a metaphor"

Cantwell: its a purely fantastic fictional scenario... but I'll move on because now I've ruined the joke, thanks....

Cantwell: do you recall a Democratic campaign slogan about a Republican 'war on women?... what about the Ron Paul revolution?

Spencer: Yes, I was a part of the Ron Paul revolution...

Cantwell: while working to grow the alt-right, did you ever find yourself working with libertarians or former libertarians... did you come to understand the 'non-aggression principle'?

Spencer: yes, it's the idea that force is only justified in self-defense

Cantwell: was there any other political movement which served as a more fruitful recruiting ground for the alt-right than libertarianism...?

Spencer: not sure... many libertarians were inclined towards the alt-right

Cantwell: did this influence the way you discuss the use of force?

Spencer: perhaps to a small degree

Cantwell:... what is the difference between white supremacy and white nationalism?

Spencer:... something like the British empire could be considered white supremacists... I think white nationalism is probably a better catch-all term...

Cantwell: yesterday you said you were quoted as saying the ethnostate would come about through a 'geopolitical cataclysm' - what is an accelerationist?

Spencer: I think it's someone who wants to bring about a cataclysm faster

Cantwell: when Heimbach said you weren't part of the 'hard right' were you insulted?

Spencer: No

Cantwell: is it fair to say you see yourself in competition w accelerationists and the 'hard right'?

Spencer: yes, I want my own version of the alt-right to succeed

Cantwell: when did you and I first met?

Spencer: I think it was in Alexandria... or DC... summer 2017

Cantwell: was it fair to say you had known me by reputation previously?

Spencer: yes

Cantwell: before the DC rally do you remember a security briefing drawn up on a chalkboard?... Who did that?

Spencer: yes... I think it was Greg Conte

Cantwell: was Kurt there?

Spencer: not sure

Cantwell: was Defendant Kline there?

Spencer: yes

Cantwell: was there some concern for our safety going into that event?

Spencer: Yes

Cantwell: you described an afterparty after the DC event, was I there for very long?

Spencer: I don't recall your being there

Cantwell: at the event known as Cville 1.0 was I present, involved in the planning or at the afterparty?

Spencer: no...

Cantwell asks Spencer about the Cville 1.0 afterparty in May 2017

Cantwell: violence isn't just a theoretical exercise for you and me is it... you mentioned earlier you had been punched in the face... when you stated that 'we are entering into a world of political violence' was that interaction fresh in your mind...?

Spencer: yes

Cantwell asks Spencer about the shooting of House Rep. Steve Scalise in relation to comments about political violence.

Cantwell: do you believe that the threats to your safety would increase or decrease if you showed fear in public?

Spencer: that's a difficult question

Cantwell: following the Unite The Right rally you continued on a speaking tour... at some point did you call that tour off?

Spencer: yes

Cantwell: at some point did you call that tour off?

Spencer: yes.. the last event, it seemed like scuffles outside the event were overshadowing the event itself to the point that... at the last one, I was unable to speak...the conflicts made the speech irrelevant...

Cantwell: did you make a video about that where you said "antifa was winning because they were willing to go further than anyone else" - what did you mean by that?

Spencer: they escalated to the point where it's not a speech, it's not about Richard Spencer... it overshadowed me... it made me look bad... I started to have a kind of sick feeling about all of this where it wasn't leading anywhere good...

Cantwell: wasn't violence your desired outcome?.. Yesterday we heard you say you wanted to dominate the streets, why not just keep going?

Spender: when I said dominate the streets... I just meant to be out there, get our message out...

Cantwell: as of August 10, 2017 did you know me to have a reputation for harming innocent people?

Objection, overruled

Spencer: To be frank Mr. Cantwell you did have a bit of a reputation as a hothead

Cantwell: was it your impression that I had cultivated that reputation?

Spencer: I didn't know

Cantwell: as of August 10, 2017 were you aware of any act of violence attributed to any of my listeners?

Spencer: I had not heard of that no

Cantwell: yesterday you said you created a separate Discord server for alt-right leaders.. what role, if any, did I have in any of that?

Spencer: to be clear I had Eliot Kline create that and I don't think he actually did that... I never took part... your name did not come up

Cantwell: did you attend the leadership meeting at Mcintire Park on August 11?

Spencer: No

Cantwell: are you familiar with the website ItsGoingDown.org ?

Spencer: I'm familiar yes

Cantwell: are you familiar with a post they shared revealing our plans for the torch march?

Spencer: not with that post

Cantwell: were you aware of an instruction to cut the tiki torches to a shorter length than is sold in stores?

Spencer: no... I don't think I held a tiki torch [on August 11]

Chris Cantwell asks Richard Spencer about the route the torch march took from Nameless Field, Spencer describes speaking with Jason Kessler about what alleys to walk up etc

Cantwell: so you're saying that the route that we took, that was your idea?

Spencer: not the whole route, but... it's my recollection that I saw Kessler there and I was like, this would be a good way...

Cantwell: before you made that suggestion did you know of a planned route?

Spencer: no

Cantwell: were you up towards the front of the formation at the torch march?

Spencer: at the beginning... but things would sort of shift and change...

Cantwell: before we started marching, were you up towards the front?

Spencer: Yes

Cantwell: Did you hear defendant Kline giving people instructions at the front of that formation?

Spencer: I don't have strong memories of seeing him at all during the torch march

Cantwell: did you see me on UVA campus on the evening of August 11?

Spencer: I do remember seeing you

Cantwell: do you recall what you saw as you walked down the stairs towards the statue?

Spencer: its kind of vague

Cantwell: I'm showing you PX-2695, can we publish that to the jury

It's a photo of the "VA Students Act Against White Supremacy" banner being held by the Jefferson statue. Cantwell circles Emily Gorcenski in the photo, asks Spencer a bunch of questions about her, seems fixated

Cantwell is circling other people from the photo of the students at the torch rally, asking Spencer if he recognizes them, Spencer says no.

Cantwell: did you expect counter-protesters to be waiting for us at the statue?

Spencer: No...

Cantwell: the torch march was supposed to be a secret?

Spencer: yes

Cantwell: yesterday you were shown in a video where someone said "we need more people over here to block these guys off".. what would you have done if one of these counter-protesters said 'excuse me' and tried to walk past you?

Spencer: yes, I would have let them walk by...

Cantwell mentions PX-2117, the video from the torch rally at the statue that he was citing in his last Q. Says its a livestream from Augustus Invictus and he wants to add the whole video to evidence

Bloch (plaintiffs): there is an objection on this issue

Sidebar happening now

Spencer stretches his arms back behind his head and yawns on the witness stand

sidebar is done

Cantwell: was the decision to circle the monument made before or after we saw circled the counter-protesters?

Spencer: after... it was... spontaneous

Cantwell: before we went to the statue the plan was to be around the statue?

Spencer: yes.. I don't know of any real specific details.. it was just an organic movement... but going to the statue generally... [was the plan]

Cantwell: did you punch, kick, pepper spray or otherwise attempt to inflict pain on anyone that night?

Spencer: No

Cantwell: did you personally witness any alt-right attendee attack any innocent students that night?

Spencer: ...no

Cantwell: did you become aware at some point that I was arrested for my role that night?

Spencer: no

Cantwell: you weren't aware that I had been arrested??

Spencer: ...I wasn't paying that much attention to you...

Cantwell: was I involved in the National Policy Institute.. or other organizations...?

Spencer: I would say you were involved in the Radical Agenda podcast...

Cantwell: please tell the jury what role I played in developing your plans for August 11

Spencer: none

Cantwell: do you recall me sending you a text telling you to install Signal?

Spencer: i don't really recall that

Cantwell: did you at some point install the app?

Spencer: at some point I did install the Signal app, yes

Cantwell: are you familiar with how it works?

Spencer: ...yes

Cantwell: in your experience does that app auto-delete messages without you telling it to?

Spencer: no.. I did not use that function

Cantwell: could your concern with your "public image" be described as "optics"?

Spencer: yes

Cantwell asks Spencer about the term "agree and amplify" and media strategy...

Cantwell: based on what you know about jails and prisons do you think you'd like to spend a lot of time in one?

Spencer: no

Cantwell: On August 11-12 did you hide your face from any cameras?

Spencer: no

Cantwell is asking Spencer about the phrase "nationalism for all people", and Marcus Garvey, black nationalism etc

Cantwell: yesterday we saw a video of you talking about Wes Bellamy... we also saw a text from somebody to you suggesting we should embrace black nationalists as some sort of PR strategy... was the text message the reason you made that video?

Spencer: no

Cantwell: have you ever knowingly acted at the behest of any government agency, foreign or domestic?

Spencer: no

Cantwell: have you ever read Mein Kampf?

Spencer: no

...

Cantwell: no further questions

Edward Rebrook, defense counsel for Jeff Schoep and the National Socialist Movement, is phoning in to cross-examine Richard Spencer.

Rebrook: was Jeff Schoep involved with you in your planning for the Unite The Right rally?

Spencer: no

Rebrook: could you recognize Jeff Schoep if you saw him?

Spencer: no

Rebrook: no further Qs

Judge Moon: Mr. Spencer, since you represent yourself you have the right to cross-examine yourself...

Spencer: as tantalizing as it is to have a conversation with myself I will wait to testify

Michael Bloch says he has re-direct for Spencer but wants to play a video exhibit and needs 5 mins to pull up a video for it

Judge Moon calls a 20 min recess starting now

Something that came up in Cantwell's cross of Spencer were texts shown yesterday where alt-right activists approached Spencer after Unite The Right pitching an "alliance" with "black nationalists" as "plausible deniability" for PR after the car attack:

https://twitter.com/UR_Ninja/status/1456352710131916802?s=20

The text about the "plausible deniability" scheme was sent by Maryland alt-right activist Colton Merwin (who claimed to have been working on a documentary about Unite The Right) on behalf of himself and Jamie Troutman, another racist alt-right member in Richard Spencer's orbit.

Both were present in the 'Charlottesville 2.0' Discord chat that we leaked after Unite The Right.

Leaked discord chats from Colton Merwin ('Herrenvolk - MD'): discordleaks.unicornriot.ninja/discord/search…

leaked discord chats from Jamie Troutman ('AltRightVa'): discordleaks.unicornriot.ninja/discord/user/1…

Court is resuming after the break now, we're gonna try segmenting our live tweets into sections between court breaks, so the new tweets pick up here:

https://twitter.com/UR_Ninja/status/1456631754308014085?s=20

Part 3 of Sines v. Kessler live tweets from today (Friday, November 5 after the lunch break) begins here:

https://twitter.com/UR_Ninja/status/1456675798652375042?s=20