Thread by @PantsuitPolitic

We're overdue for the hearings to start again. I'll not be able to capture as much this time but will still be here to offer as much as I can.

One thing to understand as we get into Morrison's testimony, which I'm sure will involve questions about his comments on Lt Col Vindman: the point of attaching a witnesses credibility is to suggest the witness might not be presenting correct facts.

Lt Col Vindman has testified to facts that have been corroborated by multiple witnesses, the WH call memo, and comments from the president and chief of staff. There is simply no reason to take these shots at him other than to try to deflect and distract.

Hearing has started

Schiff is laying out why these witnesses are here. I think that if Ds were only about spin and PR, these witnesses would not have been called. They are important to establishing a credible and complete factual record. I don't think this will make for good TV.

Nunes is emphasizing a "duly-elected" president. You know who else was duly elected? The Democratic majority in Congress. It is disrespectful to voters to talk about Democrats as though they aren't Representatives of actual Americans.

Nunes has now said that the president "alone" sets foreign policy not, he says derisively, an "inter agency process." I changed my party registration because this apparently now what Republicans stand for - a completely unchecked executive.

Morrison is providing an opening statement. He's here as a fact witness under subpoena. Would like to get this over with.

He doesn't know who the WB is. He respects his colleagues and isn't here to question their integrity. Continues to believe Ukraine is important to countering Russia. Feared that the 7/25 call would play poorly and his fears have been realized.

Says he understands the proceedings are important but wants the focus to return to Ukraine. Left his position for reasons other than theses issues.

Volker opening statement: I'm here voluntarily and remain committed to cooperation. Served under 5 presidents. Served as special envoy to Ukraine this time around on a volunteer part time basis.

Volker very concerned about his legacy here. Says he did not try to encourage an investigation into Biden and was not part of an irregular channel but the formal channel.

Volker says he identified and recommended Amb Taylor after Amb Yovanovitch was recalled.

Volker providing important details about Russian aggression in Ukraine.

Have to break away for about 15 min

Amb Volker says that at the time of the relevant actions, he understood the investigation press on Burisma to be totally about Burisma -- not about Biden. He says that he would have responded differently had he seen it in the light others were seeing it.

Morrison testifies about Dr. Hill warning him about the parallel process taking place as to Ukraine and issues like Burisma, which were noteworthy to him because he had never heard of it. Morrison said the call to him confirmed that "there's something here."

Morrison googled Burisma after hearing about it.

Morrison describes his concerns and steps post-July 25 call. He wanted to make sure that Eisenberg (legal counsel) reviewed the transcript - he was concerned about political consequences and his fears about the content leaking.

Amb Volker said he was viewing the public statements about corruption to be helpful in altering Trump's "attitude" about Ukraine. He doesn't want to call the statement as a "condition" to the WH meeting but it would have been helpful. "It's a nuance, I guess."

Goldman: President Zelensky did not get the Oval Office meeting?

Volker: Not yet

Goldman asks Morrison if Ukrainians were concerned about hold on security assistance.

Morrison: It was the first issue that President Zelensky raised with VP Pence. They were very interested. They talked about its importance to Ukraine and to the relationship.

Morrison: the VP represented that it was a priority for him and characterized Trump's concern for the state of corruption in Ukraine and the President's prioritization of getting Europeans to contribute more for security assistance.

Morrison says he reached out to Amb. Bolton for a secure phone call, who told him to "tell the lawyers."

Amb. Sondland told Morrison that he had spoken to President Trump and "there was no quid pro quo but President Zelensky had to make the statement"

Mr. Goldman has concluded his questioning. Schiff turns over to Nunes who says "TV ratings are way down. Don't take it personally. Whatever drug deal the democrats are cooking up...the American people aren't buying it."

Nunes asks if anyone at the WH asked either witnesses to bribe or extort anything from anyone at any time. Both witnesses say no.

Castor is now questioning the witnesses.

Castor asking Amb. Volker about how the Trump administration has strengthened America's support of
Ukraine.

(It is somewhat disorienting to track this hearing while also discussing Harry Potter with my 8-year-old)

(Four-year-old: can we watch something else!?!?)

Volker says the President had a concern ("I don't know if he actually believed it") that Ukrainians had provided damaging information about Manafort to the Hillary Clinton campaign

Morrison: The President was concerned that the United States seemed to bear the exclusive brunt of providing security assistance to Ukraine

Morrison hoped during 55 days that the aid was paused that Zelensky would be able to demonstrate his bona fides and subsequently get the president to lift the aid.

Castor talking about the new parliament, new cabinet, new prosecutor general in Ukraine. Morrison said Ukrainians were working through the night on reform efforts.

Amb. Volker is now talking about learning of the hold on security assistance and his immediate objection to the hold.

Amb Volker said he did not believe investigations were the cause of the hold for the aid.

What you really hear from Amb Volker is that he didn't see the divergence of purpose that Amb Taylor described.

He saw a President who had a negative attitude about Ukraine and saw himself as providing advice to Zelensky and working with others to try to demonstrate that the President could trust Ukraine and Zelensky.

Volker was "rather disappointed with the meeting as it transpired. It struck me as down in the weeds...and not the big picture and the bilateral relationship...Amb Sondland raised the possibility of investigations in a general way. I think all of us thought it was inappropriate"

Volker now describing the post-meeting meeting and says several small groups formed. "I remember having a conversation with Sec Perry and others about energy reform. I don't recall other conversations involving Burisma"

Amb Volker was not on the July 25 call and received readouts both from the US and Ukrainian sides. Had thought the call was important. The readouts from both sides were largely the same: good call, congratulatory, Zel reiterated his commitment to rooting out corruption

Volker saying that he felt that whatever rumors were out there about Ukraine- why not investigate them? And that Ukrainian authorities investigating Ukrainian citizens was appropriate.

Morrison says he want to legal post July 25 call because they didn't have representation on the call and his concerns about the content of the call leaking in "Washington's polarized political environment."

Morrison says he also thought it could negatively impact Ukrainian's perception and jeopardize bipartisan support for Ukraine. "I wanted access to be restricted"

Morrison describing the transcript being moved to the compartmented system as sort of an administrative misunderstanding/no nefarious intent.

Hold the phone: we have 2 women lawyers for the witnesses.

Morrison said he wishes Vindman had come to him first as a matter of practice and for "economy of efforts."

Castor asks if Volker was surprised by Amb. Taylor's testimony and characterization of Volker as being part of a separate track. Volker says he was -- thought that having support from various US officials was a positive thing.

Volker: If the concern is not us so much as Giuliani, not a channel at all because he's a private citizen and perhaps a useful barometer to understanding what might be helpful communication from Ukrainians.

They are taking a break. I'm honestly not sure what to make of this testimony. I'm trying to be open-minded, but I'm struggling with what feels like some inconsistencies in their testimony.

Goldman is questioning Volker again. Some follow-ups from prior testimony and honing into the details of particular conversations and meetings.

Goldman characterizes Volker as amending his testimony today to say that he subsequently learned about the President's interest in investigating Biden -- not just Ukrainians. Volker is threading a teeny tiny needle here, I think.

Goldman now showing Morrison an email from Sondland. Morrison said he wasn't sure that he had any understanding (email is from July 13 and he wasn't in the seat yet). Goldman doesn't find this credible because Dr. Hill had been explaining the situation to him.

Morrison said Dr. Hill coined the conversations about Amb Sondland "the Gordon Problem." Morrison sounds like he's saying that he basically ignored a lot of what Sondland was saying. "I was tracking that we needed to schedule a meeting" but not endorsing.

Goldman asking Volker about the "businessman analogy." Volker "I was repeating what Gordon Sondland had said to me to explain to Bill Taylor..."

Sondland and Giuliani are getting tossed under all the buses.

Volker says it wasn't clear to him that the investigations were the pay-up -- that is...difficult to believe.

Nunes is complaining about Schiff's "magical 15 minute" period of questioning. Schiff quotes chapter and verse of the House rule for that. Nunes acts like Republicans in the majority have never used procedural rules on the fly.

Nunes again refers to the process as a "drug deal" and talks about this process dragging into "prime time" and says he would like to be talking to the whistleblower. Split screen shows the clock ticking on as Nunes gripes.

Now Nunes says he has no more questions and yields to Castor, who says he'll try to be quick, and that would be lovely. Everyone here has to be exhausted.

I haven't seen reporting on this but Nunes co-opting "drug deal" feels like a direct instruction from the White House, or at least a direct replica of the White House playbook. Trump has historically taken terms that stick against him and started using them offensively.

Nunes asks to give the "magic minutes" to members. Schiff says the rules don't permit that and goes to 5 minute rounds.

Volker calls Sondland's mention of investigations "an eye-roll moment...this is not what we should be talking about."

Schiff highlighting that Volker is trying to thread that teeny tiny needle -- he sort of knew what was going on and sort of thought it was ok but also sort of thought it wasn't ok.

Volker doesn't think we should ask foreign governments to investigate American officials, the Vice President of the United States, or a political rival.

Morrison "as a hypothetical matter" does not think that's appropriate either. Schiff says this is not hypothetical: "Read the transcript." Morrison says he didn't think that's what the president was doing, but it was the first time he listened to a call and went to an NSC lawyer

Schiff presses Morrison on what the problem with the call leaking might be. "If it was a perfect call, would you have a concern about it leaking?" Morrison, "well, I would still have a concern about it leaking." (I think that's probably true).

Schiff asks if it would have been appropriate for President Trump to ask Zelensky to investigate John Kasich or Nancy Pelosi. Morrison "in those hypotheticals, no."

Rep. Turner (R) is up and says "our country is safer today because of the work of you two men."

Rep. Turner (R) asks Morrison about his background in the military. Then says "a lot of talk of people talking about their perceptions, their beliefs, their feelings even!" "A whole bunch of hearsay...the only thing that matters" is what POTUS said, what Ukrainians heard

Rep. Turner has Volker say that he never heard the linkage directly from POTUS or the Ukrainians and Turner says "you just took apart their whole case" and Volker smiles.

Rep. Turner asks Volker to explain how he (Volker) is part of the regular/formal channel, and he is explaining the special envoy role.

Volker says "Everything I heard from Giuliani I took to be his opinion."

Rep. Turner is reading testimony from Sondland to Morrison and asking if Morrison has info suggesting that Sondland lied. Morrison says no. Neither witness has reason to think anyone has perjured themselves "either in the secret dungeon testimony" or the public hearings

Rep. Turner asking Morrison if Trump demanded the investigations in the call, contrasting to Vindman, Morrison says no.

Rep. Turner probably landed more in his seven minutes than anyone else from the Republican side has.

Rep. Himes (D) says this is not about going after corruption but aiming corruption at the Vice President. Himes asks if Morrison heard the President mention Crowdstrike and the Bidens. Morrison "Yes"

Himes: did you hear President Trump use the word corruption?

Morrison: I don't believe he did.

Rep. Himes: why did you want to stay away from this "bucket of investigations?"

Morrison: that is what I was advised by Dr. Hill

Rep. Himes: "you strike me as a process guy and it's nagging at me" -- reference to the "Gordon Problem." "Seems like everyone in the room understood there was a huge problem here."

Morrison: I can't speak to that

Rep. Himes: what specifically in that call do you find unacceptable or troubling?

Amb Volker: it is the reference to Vice President Biden

Rep. Conaway (R) asking about the prosecutor Trump referred to and Zelensky's pushback that he will be hiring his own prosecutor to say that Zelensky was not afraid of Trump.

Rep. Conaway "I would like as a personal request" to put something in the record about absolute immunity. "I get upset every time you accuse me of wanting to out the WB...this is about leveling the playing field between the two teams." This is naked partisanship on display.

Schiff, expressionless, listens. Conaway continues and is now talking about the Dear Colleague letter from Pelosi about WB testimony. "You're defying the speaker in this regard."

Schiff "I'd be happy to enter into the record the whistleblower statute."

The soliloquy by Rep. Conaway falls right behind the character attacks on Lt. Col. Vindman as among today's most depressing moments.

Rep. Sewell (D) is up. Asking Amb Volker about his text messages with Giuliani "I think we have an opportunity to get you what you need." Volker says he meant contact with actual Ukrainian government officials.

Rep. Sewell is trying to draw out the distinction between investigating corruption generally, which is where Volker wants to be, and the specific investigations the President wanted.

Rep. Sewell "with all due respect, Amb Volker"..."I trust you understand that pressuring Ukraine to involve itself in US policy is just simply wrong."

Rep. Turner has yielded time to Rep. Jordan who is already talking loudly and fast.

Rep. Jordan is very wound up about the disrespect of calling Amb Volker the "irregular channel" and he's kind of winding Volker up, too.

The facial expressions from Volker during Jordan's rant are telling. Jordan is validating all of Volker's "look the other way, everything is fine" instincts that he seems to struggle with when being questioned by Democrats.

Wow, watching Volker respond to Jordan is really changing my interpretation of the hearing.

Rep Carson is now up and is showing Volker more of his text messages where he and Sondland are talking specifically about Burisma and the 2016 elections. Volker testifies that Giuliani said those components were necessary.

Rep. Wenstrup is up, and this seems like an appropriate time for me to sign off -- going to take care of my children. I'll read about the rest of this and stay in touch via Patreon and the podcast. Hope to see many of you on our Ask Us Anything tonight.

Thank you for being here. We love you for caring about our country and value being part of your thought process.