@Lennie333@ESICM this is because otherwise we will need large "n" and long time for trials.
e.g., anti-hypertensives - you dont want to test one drug at one dose. you want to test a range of doses and a range of duration.
third-thing : we struggle to find a end-point especially in critical care
@Lennie333@ESICM huge effort doing RCT but we use "mortality" yes/no as a very binary endpoint. For patient, length of stay, quality of life after d/c important end points beyond survival.
in RCT, we cant learn whilst the trials are still running. in classic RCT.
A bit like going on holiday in 90. You look at map and you set destination. Close your eyes and open when ya reach there. No change midway through etc
what can we do ?
- make a really big trouble "more pts" e.g., ANZAC's Rox trial
- do Metaanalysis
- or harmonize trials
- or core outcome sets (so trials are comparable)
- or smarter statistics
OR
PLATFORM TRIAL . It is not a "scary thing" newer form of RCT. #adaptivetrials
Here if ya compare these in a traditional format it will take a long time and cost.
What we are interested is not a treatment A vs. treatment B. That is useful but an inferior question to "what is the optimal treatment" for this patient?
so you need "patient", "domain", "intervention", "regimen".
Domain is effectively "area of treatment".
If the probability of treatment 2 is superior than 1, you dont stop a trial, you re-assign next recruits in comparison so it evaluates against 2. if it is inferior, you can stop that particular domain for randomisation. see next image for graphical representation
Of course one need to talk about "Bayesian " approach . see graphics above.
Essentially it updates based on posterior probability.
This sounds fancy but we do it everyday when we cross the road.
-- So adaptive platform trials are great BUT
- adaptive platform cost a lot of time to set up for making sure model behaves well
- adaptive platform trial need simulation to test out the model
Long setup time, high start up cost, pre-trial simulations, practical hurdles,
and all of this means NEED MORE FUNDING which is usually for 5-year slot. Adaptive platform trials help address heterogeneity o treatment effects ,lose ineffective therapies @ESICM#datascience#ai#ml#icudata #adaptiveplatformtrial
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Mariangela PELLEGRINI
Uppsala- Sweden
"Do we Need a biological definition of ARDS"
- Berlin definition has NO Diffuse alveolar damage .
- the Berlin defn does not capture well
Frohlich - different definitions specificity of 0.63, 0.42, 0.31 even! #ventilation#ards#LIVES2022
ARDS - new definition or phenotypes by @GicoBellani refreshing with Kigali definition of ARDS - useful not just low resource but during pandemic in supposedly high income settings and only draw back is no PEEp requirement #ards#ventilation#LIVES2022@ESICM
@GicoBellani@ESICM Resolved versus confirmed ARDS
- prospectively applying Berlin definition did work but if ya wait 24 hrs and re-measure P/F ratio, you end up stratifying much better.
- Better separation of groups
NEXT Speaker : VA ecmo for which patients?
Alain COMBES
Severe cardiogenic shock has different phenotypes 1. medical cardiogenic shock(AMI, end stage dilated CM, myocarditis, septic shock) 2. Post cardiotomy refractory CS (post CABG) #LIVES2022 @ESICM#ecmo#resuscitation#ALS
@ESICM 2022 what do the guidelines say
- ESC recommends short term MCS should be considred in cardiogenic shock.
IABP may be considered but not routinely recommended in post MI #LIVES2022