Thread by @alysanmati

Kalen Schlatter's trial for the first-degree murder of Tess Richey is continuing this morning with a Crown witness, E.S. His identity is under a publication ban. Here is my story from the last day of evidence last week.

thestar.com/news/gta/2020/…

"I'm a criminal. I steal shit," he said, when asked by the Crown how he supports himself -- the second question. He is 48.

Crown: How long have you been a criminal?
ES: "Pretty much my whole life."
Crown: Do you have a criminal record?
ES: "A huge criminal record"

The record, which starts in 1992, includes impaired driving, giving a fake name to police, mischief, theft, break and enter, dangerous driving, possession of stolen property, "probably escaping from custody." He robbed businesses, but "would not" break into someone's home.

We are at 1996. More driving offences, more break and enters. Then there is a break to 2008. He stopped being a criminal because he had a kid. But "having a normal job is pretty boring."

Back to more break and enters, thefts, failing to stop for police, fail to comply with court orders, dangerous operation of vehicle. This goes on till 2019. "It sounds like me," he said when asked if this is all accurate. He has never gone to trial on these charges. He pleads out

"I do my time like a man," he said. "Every time they arrested me they were right."

He said he has never testified before a jury before. He was in custody previously and testified at a prelim about something he'd been told in custody.

He got a more lenient sentence on his charges at that time because of his testimony in that case.

In 2017 he was in custody at the Toronto South Detention Centre with various individuals. There were many lockdowns so not much to do. Talked about why they were in jail.

He shared a cell with Schlatter at Toronto South. He was in protective custody in March and April 2018.

He first met Schlatter when he came on the range. He was having issues, older guys like to beat up younger guys. There was spare bunk in his cell in protective custody.

He said he felt bad for Schlatter. He said he had many conversations with him about why Schlatter was in custody.

He said Schlatter seemed at first "scared, happy to be in a cell where he felt safe."

Their first conversations were about what to watch on tv, what was for dinner. Over the next few weeks they spoke about what he did, and "I'm sure I told him what I did."

Crown: What the first piece Mr. Schlatter gave you

ES: "He met a girl at a bar....and ended up killing her." It was at the Crews and Tangos drag bar. He was unfamiliar with this bar.

ES: Schlatter said he'd been to the bar before. "He said he was there. Met Tess Richey and her friend....went out front, had a hot dog."

ES had seen on the news briefly after Schlatter got to jail that he'd been arrested for Tess Richey's murder. But didn't know more than that.

ES: "I seen his Facebook picture on the news," he said. But he then says maybe someone told him because "I don't watch the news!"

Back to what Schlatter told him: "He was outside with them at the hot dog stand, had some hot dogs...Tess went to the bank took out some money... friend went home."

"They walk into alley," he said. And then he said either "to fuck" or "they fucked" "in a stairwell and he killed her." He used a scarf that he tied around her neck."

ES: They walked into the alley, went to the stairwell where they were "doing their thing." He was high on MDMA, edibles and drinking. He wanted to keep going, she wanted to stop because she was on her period.

ES: "He just lost control and he was choking her and he tied a scarf around her neck, she was on the ground. It excited him. He was past the point of no control. He ejaculated on her. Afterwards, when he pulled the scarf off, she was dead."

He took a chain and money from her

ES: He said he went home. Took his clothes off. He said the cops searched his house but they didn't take the dark green jacket he was wearing because it was at the bottom of his laundry hamper. He was worried there was DNA on it.

ES: He told his lawyer that I invited him into my cell. He came from his lawyer "virtually in tears" and said "I hope you are not a cop." That offended ES. Then Schlatter said: "I hope to god you are not a cop. If you are, I'm fucked."

ES: This is because he'd learned that there had been two undercover officers in the cells with him at another time.

He said the police showed him a video of him and Tess by the hot dog stand. Was also told there was video of the two going into the alley, and him leaving alone.

ES: He told the cops he didn't need to see the video, that it was him. But after his lawyer visit, he was upset because she showed him stills from the video and it just showed two blurry figures. So he admitted it for nothing.

ES said he amused by this. "I was helping him brainstorm ways to take back the confession." He said Schlatter was workshopping alibis. For ex: she was suicidal when I left and hung herself, and her mother interfered with the body because she was Catholic and opposed to suicide.

ES: Or, he said, someone else could have came along and killed her.

ES adds, that someone else could have robbed her and killed her.

ES: Schlatter said they went into the stairwell to make out and have sex. But they didnt have sex.

Crown is asking him to go over it again.

ES: "Didn't we just go over this ten minutes ago?"

ES: She said she didn't want to have sex because she was on her period. "He was too worked up, started choking her. Tied a scarf around her neck. Jerked off on her." Took her chain and money from purse. Walked halfway home and then took an Uber the rest of the way.

Crown: What was his response to her staying stop.
ES: He said he was on MDMA and edibles and drinking. "That was the reason he did it."
Crown asked what he meant by "worked up."
ES: "I'm pretty sure everyone in this courtroom know what that means....SEXUALLY AROUSED."

ES tell the Crown: "You are freaking me out a little bit."

ES: "I'm a criminal. I don't like being a rat."
Crown: Did your relationship change?
ES: Talking about Schlatter, he said. You cry every night because you don't want to go to jail and you miss your mommy. But you show "no remorse for a dead girl you just met."

ES said he told police about what Schlatter told him but "for the record, only because of the particular crime. I don't normally do this."

ES has previously said there are things you don't do, like kill children.

ES gave a statement to police -- specifically the officer-in- charge Det. Ted Lioumanis.

Crown: When first talked to police did you ask for anything? Deal or consideration?

ES: No.

ES said he has never gotten any deal or consideration for his evidence.

I think he said "just a headache"

The Crown has a letter dated Nov. 2019. The letter is from the Crown and outlines that ES gave a sworn statement. ES said he did not wish for his lawyer to be informed of the statement he gave. The letter says he may be called as a witness for the prosecution.

The Crown has not and will not provide any consideration in any form whatsoever for his testimony should he be called as a witness, the letter says.

ES: "Nobody has given me nothing. I am here to help this family and the dead girl, that's it."

ES: This happened over a year ago so dont have a 100 per cent clear recollection.

Crown: Would you like to refresh your memory from statement?

ES: Yes.

Crown: it is an audio statement. Crown asks to break early so he can go through it.

Back at 1:30

Cross has started now after a brief recap of his evidence.

Lydia Riva asks him about officers who came to take his DNA. He doesn't recall a conversation in which he said he was working on something with an officer. "I'm in jail quite often" he says.

He said he is "not a computer" and can't remember everything word for word.

Defence asks if this means he has a bad memory.

No, he said. Just that he and Schlatter were cellies for a while and Schlatter didn't use all the same words.

He said he is surprised that the trial is taking so long. "The wheels of justice move slow."

He knows the trial has taken a long time, because he came to the first day (along with the other witnesses.)

He doesn't watch the news/have cable, he said. He watches Netflix.

"I hate myself for testifying," he said. "But someone has to, man."

"I'm the biggest asshole you've ever met," he said. "But I don't kill women, I don't kill children."

He does have one domestic conviction. We were together for 15 years and "shit happens," he said.

"I'm old, I've done a lot of crime. I probably had the one domestic," he said. But he doesn't recall exactly. He said it was a "simple domestic" and she did have any injuries. The defence lawyer presses him on what he did. "Are you saying she deserved it?"

He said it was an assault. He pushed his partner and her son apart. He plead guilty to it to get out sooner -- ten days rather than 2.5 months.

He said he "doesn't get bail much any more." But right now he is on a promise to appear on charges of break and enter.

Defence asks if he told the police that he was a witness in a murder trial, wonders why he was released on bail.

Crown objects, says there is no "good faith basis" for the q.

Riva says there is The judge tells her not to make speeches to the jury. "Don't reject notions from me"

He says he was released by the police into the custody of another police force to deal with outstanding charges there.

"If you are trying to make me look bad you don't have to, I'm a rotten person," he said. "I'm here to tell the truth man"

The defence asks which business he has said he robbed. He says he doesn't want to answer questions about his outstanding charges. She asks if he is guilty.

"I choose the right to remain silent," he said. Hasn't talked to his lawyer though he will likely plead.

Defence asks the judge to direct him to answer. The judge says no, warns her again about speeches to the jury.

Says she can make submissions at the break.

Defence asks if what he did is "petty." He said he has probably hurt people.

But he doesn't take people into an alley and kill them.

"I remembered this because it was important," he said in response to a question about why he doesn't recall all the details about his own past crimes.

Defence asks if he has sold medication to other inmates in jail. He says no. He sometimes sells candy or other canteen shit.

He spent 50-something days in the cell with Schlatter, he said.

Defence asks which bank Schlatter said Richey went to. He doesn't know. She took out $60, he said Schlatter told him.

He doesn't know where the alley and stairwell is. "I never saw a floor plan." He said Schlatter told him he was familiar with the alley.

Defence asks whether Schlatter used his hands, and then a scarf to choke her.

ES repeats the same thing he said before.

Defence: Where did he get the scarf?

ES: If I was a mind-reader, I'd know. Doesn't know where he got the scarf.

Defence: Why did he take the necklace?

ES: Don't know

Defence: Why did he take the money?

ES: For cab fare to get home.

Defence: Did he need the money

ES: Not sure if he told me that

He said Schlatter didn't say anything about how Richey's body was left.

He says Schlatter said both necklace and chain.

Defence is going through the statement ES gives to the detective. Suggests ES only uses word chain after the detective used it. Called it necklace before.

ES: "Everyone in the English-speaking world knows a chain and a necklace is the same thing."

He says he doesn't know where the defence is going with this "petty" stuff. "It's really not that big a deal."

Defence: In the security videos she wasn't wearing a necklace or chain, are you aware?

ES: Well there you go then. Notes he didn't say Schlatter ripped it off her neck.

Defence suggests there is evidence from her sister that Richey didn't wear a chain. Crown says that's not in evidence yet.

ES says he feels sorry for Kalen if this is the best his defence lawyer has got.

Defence asks him if he has ripped a necklace off someone in the past.

He says there was something about a chain when he was 20, it involved a woman and selling the chain for drugs.

"If you are trying to make me look like a criminal, I'll save you the time, I am a criminal."

Defence has pointed him to a point in his statement where he said they went into the stairwell and Schlatter knew he was "going to do it."

Defence: By do it do you mean kill her?

ES: No, that he was going to have sex with her

Back to talking about his record.

"I grew up in the ghetto. I was committing crimes when I was a little kid," he said.

Defence asks how many break and enters he has done. He can't remember.

"How many times have you been in court?" he says.

"Honestly I don't like working at all," he said, when she raised that he found a job boring.

She says he's saying he is a bad person, piece of garbage but what you see is what you get.

"I don't know if I'm a piece of garbage but I'm a pretty big asshole."

Defence suggests he is manipulative. That he puts on an act to get what he wants.

He said he is here and people can believe what they want. "I don't give a shit," he said. Says it is hard for him to be here.

Defence: You said Schlatter was obnoxious, cocky, arrogant, that he should do time. That if he was his kid he'd euthanize him.

ES: Yes.

They are now talking about how ES has committed crimes his kid, who he says is also "an asshole."

*committed crimes with his kid (as in partnership).

We are now seeing a letter he sent to Schlatter in July 2018. The defence lawyer is reading it. It starts "Hey Kalen, how's it going."

"I was supposed to get out on May 23rd," but he's back in prison. "They have to let me out sooner or later right."

He talks about the inmates who owe him money. "What a bunch of turds."

"Take care, write back."

ES said the money was owed because he had a "store" and sold chocolate bars.

He also lent money.

Defence: If you are such an asshole why are you lending them money?

ES: I like other assholes

ES said he writing to him because he was trying to see if Schlatter knew if he was testifying against him. He was worried he'd end up back at the South and didn't want to get shanked. "I could get killed for coming here to testify against him."

He said if Schlatter didn't reply he'd figure he knew.

Defence asks why he is so friendly in the letter

ES said sending a letter saying "hey asshole" wouldn't have worked.

Defence: You are saying my client confessed to a sex crime.

ES: "I like to think of him as more of a woman-killer." But a sex offender sure.

Defence reads more of the letter. "There are no sex offenders or pedophiles" here, he said.

ES says it's nice to eat a table without people who did "more fucked up shit" than what he did.

Defence: You see Schlatter as a meal ticket. That down the road there is a benefit

ES: Not unless you give me something.

Defence says there are other people involved in the justice system than the Crown.

Crown objects, no good faith basis for the question. Judge allows it.

ES: Sure.

Defence: Like the police. They can decide whether to lay a charge.

Defence: You get arrested a lot. You know they make decisions about who to charge and who not to charge

ES: If you say so.

Defence: And it's the judge who makes the sentencing decision. And if you help out in a homicide case, your lawyer can mention it to the judge.

Crown objects. She says her position is the position of all Crowns in the province. Judge says that's not the question.

ES: Anything can happen. I haven't asked for anything and they haven't offered anything.

Defence: You requested that your lawyer talk to the lead detective in the Richey case so your lawyer could use it work out a deal. This was June 2018.

ES: They said they couldn't do anything.

Defence: You were told the detective was going to tell another Crown that you were giving evidence in a murder trial.

ES: I don't know. Says his lawyer is also an asshole. Probably hoped he could help but I didn't get help.

ES: And I am still here testify. I am obviously doing it for another reason "for the dead girl and her family."

ES: It's got to be "beer-o-clock" soon, are we getting a break soon.

Judge says there will be a break in a bit.

Defence asks him about the other time he testified.

ES said he got reduced time.

Defence said he got bail as well.

Crown said that's not true

ES says the defence is a liar and that she is "lazy." She is being "aggressive with me" and I can't be aggressive with her.

The case was one where he said a murder suspect confessed to him. Defence said he wanted to trade that information for bail.

ES agreed and said that case was "more efficient." He got reduced time. He said bail would not have helped him bc he was serving time.

Defence: You were cross-examined in that preliminary inquiry?

ES: I don't want to remember that shit. Could have happened but don't recall.

Defence: You said Schlatter is "not a very bright kid".

ES: At 20 no one is bright but especially not when you kill someone. And then you confess to someone.

Defence: You said the same thing in the other case. Also said in that case that he ran things by you. Like Schlatter

Defence: You are saying some of the same things in both cases.

ES: Would you like an explanation?

Defence: You have the same pattern of making things up to get a benefit

ES: How could I possibly make this up? A magic genie on my shoulder.

Defence: You know what disclosure is? The evidence against a person. Accused persons know the allegations. Schlatter told you he was at this bar and met Richey. But never told you he murdered Tess Richey.

ES: Doubt that, with the speed of these courts, he even had disclosure yet

ES says his experience with more minor charges is that disclosure takes a couple of months.

We are taking a break.

We are back and the defence is referring to the statement to police ES gave in that previous murder investigation.

In it, he said he'd like a little help with bail.

ES agrees he said that.

Defence said at the prelim he said he was giving evidence out of concern for the person he died.

ES: "It was one gang banger killing another... wasn't that important to my heart and soul." But like most people here, I don't like people who kill people.

ES: In this case, as the letter makes clear, I am not getting consideration.

Defence: In the last case, his sentence went from 2 years to 9 months.

ES: There were more things going on than the consideration for testifying.

Defence: "You have 15 break and enters on your record."

ES: "Is that all?"

Defence suggests his testimony in that past murder has helped him avoid prison time.

ES: Criminal record dates back a long time before that testimony.

Defence is asking ES how he has hurt people over the years.

ES says there have been car accidents, insurance, fenderbenders, that one domestic. Says haven't physically hurt someone. "But again massive record." Has caused financial damage.

Defence says there are 75 convictions on his record

ES: Thought it was more but okay.

Defence: I'm only asking about the things for which you were caught. Haven't really slowed down, she says. Still committing crimes in your forties.

ES: Will probably commit more in my fifties

Defence asks about when he lied to police and gave them his friend's name.

ES says he doesn't dispute any of this.

He is increasingly annoyed and grumbling.

Now she is asking about an obstruct justice charge from 2012. Suggests it was lying about his name. In cross at the other case, he said he doesn't recall but doubts it.

ES now: "I drank like a motherfucker and did lots of drugs." He said he admits lying to the cops "millions of times, maybe more."

Defence is reading out the agreed facts of that case. ES was in a car. When someone asked him what he was doing. He got out with a large screwdriver. There was pursuit. He gave a fake name. Appeared drunk.

ES re the fake name: I did that alot.

Defence: The guy whose name you used got in trouble, was arrested in Alberta.

ES: Yeah, I've known him since I was six. We are criminals. I had his permission to use his name. I had a copy of his driver's licence I used for years.

ES said he has helped this guy out too. He gave him a place to live for four years. Got people to help bail him out. "I hate most people but I do love that guy." He told him when he gave the police his name. He recently helped him not live on the streets as an addict.

Defence: You are trying to present yourself as being someone of good moral character.

ES: I don't think so.

Defence: You were interrupted stealing parts for a car by two men in 1995. They chased you. You got into another car. One of the guys reached into the window to turn the car off.

ES: "It didn't work out so well for him"

Defence: You ran over his foot and dragged him

ES: The car was already moving. I plead guilty. I did my time.

Defence: You dragged a person and ran him over.

ES: Yeah.

Defence: You were on bail at the time for dangerous driving and were not to be driving.

ES: "Sometimes accidents happen."

Defence: You breached the bail.

ES: I steal. I lie. I'm a bad guy.

Defence: You have no respect for court orders. You are willing to lie to police.

ES: If it wasn't for people like me you/they wouldn't have a job.

ES says he is bored and that Schlatter told him what he told him.

There is a young man in court laughing out loud when ES makes snarky comments. Wondering if it is his son.

Defence: Are you currently addicted to drugs?

ES: No

Defence: When did you stop?

ES: When I went to jail last summer. Was using crack, coke. Lot of booze. Doesn't like to do drugs in jail.

We are now talking about him robbing a ice cream store. He threw a brick through the window of the store.

ES: "It was a hot summer night" (He said he stole cash not ice cream).

CORRECTION: He stole cash AND ice cream.

ES: It was only $2000, I was disappointed.

ES: I lie to police. I lie to women. I lie to friends. Wishes he wasn't here right now because it is "annoying the shit out me."

Defence: You didn't say anything before about doing this for Richey's family.

ES: You want me to give you my opinion?

Judge: No, we don't want that

Courtroom: laughs.

Defence: You are here for yourself, not for Richey's family.

ES: I very rarely try to do the right thing. I rarely do.

Defence: Did the police tell you that Schlatter robbed Richey of $60, or that it was at one point their theory that the killer robbed her.

ES: No your client told me.

Defence: Detective asked you why are you telling us this. And you said he showed no remorse for killing her. Nothing about doing it for the family.

ES: That's why I am here now.

Defence: But you did call the detective to try and get him help.

ES: Yes. But that was 14 months down the line and they said no.

ES: I can see why this trial is taking so long.

Judge asks him not to make comments.

Defence is going through the facts of the domestic assault he was convicted of.

ES says he plead out to avoid getting more time. "I hit a girl I was living with....I regret it. Maybe that's why I'm here today... maybe I'm so remorseful."

Defence is reading from the facts: He grabbed the woman by throat and started choke her. Then he slapped her and maybe punched her in the back of the head. The woman did not to call police bc he'd just gotten out of jail. But also didn't want him in the home.

Also used a chair to hit the stove and flipped a fridge. ES said at the time there is more to it than that. "More or less there are always two sides" he said at the time.

Defence now: Do you agree you choked and punched and slapped your romantic partner?

ES: The difference between me and your client is that she'll be here tomorrow and you can ask her yourself.

ES: I plead to it, so I did it.

Defence: So why are you saying it didn't happen that way.

ES: I was partially guilty. I don't choke people, I don't punch people. Ask her tomorrow.

ES, getting more annoyed: I did it. I choked punched and slapped my wife. He said he said whatever got him out of jail faster.

Defence: You'll say whatever it takes to get out of jail faster.

ES: When it comes to pleading absolutely. I just said it.

ES: But with this case, I'm not getting anything. I'm here.

And we are now breaking for the day.