Thread by @MollyMcKew

Will live tweet Zuck hearing here.

In opening, Thune crushed Zuck. Cannot remember the last time I heard a Republican so adamant re regulation.

Feinstein now reminding everyone that she may be the oldest sitting Senator, but she is one of the smartest on this new tech /1

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(Zuckerberg looks like he is having a nightmare about showing up for college on finals day having never been to class) /2

Feinstein also says: Cambridge Analytica accessed private/direct messages on Facebook. She also says CA worked for the Internet research agency. Which is a huge announcement of true. /3

Zuck seems to have memorized his whole opening statement. Which is a serious window into his brain. /4

Zuck statement consistent w written. very focused on Cambridge Analytica and Kogan; says they lied to FB. (This focus is a bit of a diversion).

Also saying data scraped was all "public" anyway.

/5

Grassley: how many instances where user data transferred to 3rd parties?

Zuck: tens of thousands of apps. Will do full audit. Ban offenders. Trying to avoid discussing past activity.
(Whoever did the training did a good job.) /6

Grassley insists on a full list/accounting being provided to the senate.

Goes on to be quite critical re how FB explains data policy to users. Asks why.

Zuck answers question sideways. "Long privacy policies are confusing. [no one will read it]" /8

Nelson: are you suggesting users should have to pay not to have data scraped for advertising?

Zuck: "maybe people don't like ads, but people really don't like ads that aren't relevant". 🙄 With no ads, need another business model. /9

Zuck: " we think offering an ad connected service is most in-line with" FB values.
Looks pissed. Says its up to everyone what they post and share on FB. (This is a bad approach) /10

Nelson: re 2015 CA info, why didn't you notify users. Don't you have an ethical obligation?

Zuck: CA said they didn't used, deleted. We considered closed case. (Sorry, America!)
/11

Thune says FB has a long history of apologizing for mistakes only when caught. Damn.

Zuck "philosophical shift underway" blah blah #zufferingzuckotash

Thune, profound -- "there's a fine line between legitimate political discourse and hate speech, particularly when you're relying on AI and other tools to do the [initial assessment]"

Zuck: we kind of suck at hate speech bc nuanced language, but we're great at counterterrorism

Zuck: FB slow at identifying new info ops from Russia in 2016. Right around time of 2016 elex.

**Oh yeah? What about what was reported to you on Ukraine? Countless examples from 2013 onward

Zuck: "this is an arms race"
It's going to get worse.

"Large networks of fake accounts like the Russians have"

** someone please follow up on this

270 pages/disinfo news org targeting Russians and neighboring countries connected to IRA.

** reminder: sh*t the Kremlin does to West, it does to Russians first

Feinstein: why not ban CA in 2015?

Zuck: ca wasn't advertiser or pages

**uhh. Yes they were. You weren't looking in the right place. They didn't have a CA logo.

Hatch: (shorter) [users are dumb] (Carrying lots of water for tech industry here)

Zuck: you own your content, can control it, remove it, who it goes to

** except when you let it all get scraped by outside parties. Plus FB keeps content even after you delete it

Cantwell asking if Palantir (Thiel) taught CA; scraped data.

Zuck: not sure

Cantwell: did FB employees work w CA on trump campaign to refine targeting?

Zuck: not sure. We were in the Trump campaign

Cantwell: "total information awareness" -- 2003, laid groundwork here...

... Aren't all tech companies basically going to be abused when they rely on data?

Zuck: whatsapp collects little info, shouldn't have same issues. Don't know palantir.

Cantwell: lots of people interested in these data targeted campaigns. Didn't you discuss these internally?

"You have the talent, but do you have the will to solve the problem?"

Should US apply EU privacy standards?

Zuck: evasive. Some of it, not all "right" for US

Wicker: do you collect call/message data from android phones?

Zuck: FB messenger asks you to opt-in to syncing this history

Wicker: what about minors?

Zuck: don't know

Wicker: does FB track your activity when you aren't logged in?

**YES IT DOES

Zuck: evasion.

Zuckerberg says Facebook employees have been interviewed by Mueller, are working with investigation. (Specifies not sure re subpoenas)

Zuck: in future,
Identity and location of pages will be verified by Facebook.

Leahy: 6 months ago I asked you re hate speech targeting rohinga. Including death threats. UN blames FB for playing role in genocide.

Zuck. Working on it... Trying to increase language skills

... Will focus on taking down pages, not specific content

Graham: reads devastating quote from Boz on connecting people more important than outcome

Zuck: I disagreed. We like to express different opinions internally.

Biggest FB competitors? Google/Apple/ Amazon/Microsoft

Graham: there isn't really a FB alternative is there? Isn't it a monopoly?

Zuck: "doesn't seem like it to me"

Graham: why should we let you self-regulate?

Zuck: there needs to be the "right" regulation. Not necessarily European model.

Graham: FB TOS -- hundreds of pages. How can consumers understand this?

Zuck: we have a responsibility to communicate this effectively [evades on needing to do better. Repeats canned talkers again]

Whoever has "dorm room" on their Zuck bingo card is totally going to win

Btw I find it really improbable that Zuck isn't familiar with Palantir. It is a major competitor in data world

Klobuchar: CA -- were 87 million concentrated in any states?

Zuck: don't know

126 mil saw IRA content -- same as CA data pool?

Investigating. Entirely possible there may be a connection there.

Does Russia have CA data?

No specific knowledge of that

***be sure to check Emerdata for the data.

Z: will support rule that notifies users of data breach w/I 72 hours. FB will support honest ads act

Blunt: "days where Facebook friends seems a little misstated." Ha
On data collection: cross device tracking?

Uhhhhh yes.

Plus offline data?

Will follow up

Why complicated? Do you track devices that aren't logged in to FB?

Not sure ...

***this is completely evasion

**FB does track devices that aren't logged in. This is broadly known.

Do people give permission to track specific devices?

In general, FB not collecting data from other apps you use.

*** IN GENERAL

Always this way?

My understanding is blah blah

"would you be comfortable sharing the name of the hotel you stayed in last night?"

Uhhhhh no.

Well played, dick durbin

**Zuck keeps emphasizing users have "control" via "sharing" -- and this is completely evasive

Durbin: "messenger kids" for ages 6-12. [zuck drinks water nervously ]
Negative impact on kids. Are you collecting data on kids?

Zuck; feedback from parents that want to connect with kids but have control. No apps for that. So we built. App collects minimum data. But...

... We do collect the message to send it

Should adults be able to delete data collected on them as kids?

Have to set up new account at age 13. "Start over"

Why is FB lobbying against Illinois biometric data privacy? (Cut off)

Cornyn reminds motto was "move fast and break things" 🔥🔥🔥🔥

Other bingo words:
responsibility
Tools

Zuck: "I agree that we are responsible for content"
Huge
But says possible because AI.

**beware the AI answer to everything. Look what algorithms have done so far

Zuck: we don't sell data to advertisers

** of course not you keep it internally. It's much more valuable that way if FB controls the targeting. Keep in mind that just made FB responsible for malicious targeting.

Blumenthal: you said Kogan deceived FB. Here's the terms of service Kogan provided. He said he would sell them. 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Who at FB should have known?

Zuck [flustered-]

Blumenthal: doesn't this violate FTC order?

[team behind Zuck looks really nervous]

In answer, Zuck implies he knew about this issue earlier.

Oops

Blumenthal: nice apology tour, but internal concerns were raised, you ignored.

*wish you had taken that break now huh?

**sometimes all I can think of is the wildling kids from mad max beyond thunderdome and their use of the term "wordstuff" to describe nonsense

**as Cruz questions, let's remember he was a major beneficiary of your stolen scraped data via mercer/CA support.

** Cruz going off re FB bias and conservative repression. Again, let's remember the team working for him was targeting America with coercive psychological content.

**Cruz reaching for FoxNews headlines tonight. Far right message: the conspiracy is against YOU.

Zuck answers Cruz well on keeping diverse discourse on platform.

I promise you FoxNews is already making clips of Cruz asserting liberal bias against whatever

** observation from first half. Some Senators realize other Senators have an advantage in their campaigns from data support, and they aren't happy about it.

Hatch grabs Zuck on way back in, says something as a long aside. Hmm. That looks not great.

Zuck offers correction. Didn't ban CA in 2015, said not on platform. But they were. And we didn't ban them. So. Oooooops.

Whitehouse: has Kogan been banned?

Zuck: we are preventing him from building more apps.

CA had to certify data deleted -- how?

They certified in a contract they deleted the data.

CA banned? Who? What about new company w same people?

SCL/AggregateIQ also banned.

... But personal accounts/execs not banned.

Bingo word:
"You get to choose what you share"

Issue ads content will have to be verified identity -- what about shell corporations/beneficial owners?

Valid govt ID plus location. But shell corps would be able to evade location issue

*** keep in mind Russia tried to verify accounts with false identity docs

Lee also asks re thumb on scale of content

Zuck points out have to defend people from bullying.
Two types of data. Stuff you share. Zuck says you can delete it when you want [not from their archive you can't]
Claims you can also control data collected from ads. Not really true

Zuck says no data collected from whatsapp message content.

Just leaving it here

Says again that it's up to you what you post.

** it is not true that "you have complete control" over your data. This is more maxian wordstuff.

Fischer's question isn't clear but her idea is right --
Facebook keeps saying "control" to make people feel better but really the platform is collecting whatever it wants.

Zuck not understanding what it being asked. His use of word control is totally not precise.

Coons picks up control point. Reminds ad targeting is concerning. Let Russians target people w racist/anti-immigrant etc views.
Cites range of coercive ads. And problematic: Aka Facebook allows racial exclusion from real estate ads etc.

Zuck: we will rely on AI to police content.

** aaaahh.

Sasse: can you define hate speech? [goes into conservative argument re no free speech on campuses]

Zuck: AI will create a lot of questions about role of companies in society.

No joke.

Sasse: do you hire consultants to figure out how to keep people engaged/addicted to platform?

Uhhhhhh. No?

"We don't sell information"

Flake asks what FB is doing to keep govts from going after opposition parties. Good question.

Zuck repeats answers from earlier plus -- bingo term -- news literacy (so no answer)
Then, AI again. 🦄

Flake: do Russia and China have scraped data? Who else?

Zuck: don't know

"Assume a number of countries are trying to abuse our system"

Interesting pivot by Hirono to how US ICE will profile visa applicants using online/social media data. Asks if FB will help?

Not proactively. We cooperate w law enforcement if imminent harm, or with specific requests

Hirono asks if predictive profiling possible. Zuck evades.

**Wasted question without follow up on fact that this is the backend of the ads platform

Sullivan has to remind Zuck to have a rah rah America moment because he misses the softball. Is Facebook too powerful?

Zuck calls Chinese companies "strategic and technological threat". 🔥

Alas Sullivan does not allow him to finish this answer.

Zuck keeps talking about "elections around the world" in 2018.

**How about we talk about what happened in Kenya last year? In how many elections did Facebook embed employees? With what governments does it cooperate?

The longer this goes on, the more you can see Zuck prep. He has set pieces memorized. He isn't very flexible on replies.

"We believe we are in compliance"
🎈🎈

Unless someone brings me a cocktail I'm going to become increasingly reliant on emojis.

I hate emojis.

Zuck starts another rehearsed set piece. God he really did do campaign style debate prep.

Heller: how long do you keep user data after they delete their account?

Zuck: uhhhh. I don't know

** the answer is it is never deleted from the internal system

Limits on data govt can access. I agree. But CA can just have it?

People can sign into apps and give data

🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

Heller: do you believe your company is more responsible with this data than the government would be?

Zuck. Yes.

That is a good statement to get on record.

His argument is based on this nonsensical "control" idea by users.

Peters: does Facebook use audio to gather data passively?

Zuck: no. (Calls it a conspiracy)

Cocktail time.

Back,
Now Tillis, another beneficiary of Cambridge Analytica, is trying to say this was nothing new, blames Obama.

**Hey all you Cambridge Analytica clients, the issue is tools tactics narrative package.

Tillis defends Facebook. Again calls users dummies (basically). Yeah. Wouldn't want to turn off the Cambridge Analytica pipeline.

**these are not the defenders you want

Kamala Harris points out answers on a range of data collection/storage questions have been unsatisfactory. When did FB decide not to contact the 87 million users who were scraped?

Zuck: don't remember a conversation about not informing users. Not sure re others.

Zuck: now it looks like a mistake, but [thought we had covered our asses by asking CA to delete data]

Harris: how much revenue did FB make from foreign propaganda?

Zuck: not sure

Kennedy: [we know you are smart/innovative. Please fix it/stop pretending you don't know what we mean, re privacy & propaganda]
"Your privacy agreement sucks... You want it written in English"

Zuck again says users have complete control to data. This is such a misuse of English

Control control control.
Zuck. This is not the right word. Stop.
Now this should be a drinking game.

Control + dorm room

I'm teaching my cat to make a Manhattan. If I had Facebook it would post me a YouTube video on cat bartenders.

Baldwin: data is just "in the system". Can it be hacked/breached?

Zuck: sure. And we would have duty to inform users.

Baldwin: did Kogan sell data to anyone else?

🔥🔥🔥🔥Zuck: yes. He sold it to other firms. Don't have names handy.

** for real?

Political ad transparency measures sound positive. Targeting will be available for review.

Set piece 5 --
Developer platform --
Reloads to consume time.

FB has identified risks to their business including less time on platform + less effective as targeting as users opt out. How can you balance this with "wellbeing"?

Zuck: building community and user wellbeing actually do help the platform.

Will you adjust business model to enhance privacy/wellbeing?

Zuck: yes.

What if we incentivize with financial penalties for breaches? (Compares FB with equifax, smart)

Zuck: this has hurt our social mission

**but your stock price is rising during this hearing

Zuck: if you delete your account we delete data from systems, but anywhere you shared it to, it still exists.

Set piece 3 -- doing the audit 😴

** ask more questions re the auctions.

Gardner asks again re deleting accounts. How long do the "backup copies" last?

Zuck: uhhhh.

Gardner: but all backups get wiped?

Zuck: if we say we're going to delete your data, we need to do that.

Gardner: and you do?

Zuck; (shrug)

Gardner: do you really think users understand that you can watch what articles they are reading (based on share buttons for content)?

Zuck: but we have to see it to share it?

Gardner: have you ever removed a page based on a government request?

Zuck; yes

** which governments?

Zuck:
Foreign interference has come from issue ads, not political ads. This is what Russia does.

What if your scraped data is now stored in other countries? Like Russia. Or wherever. Then what? You can never get it back. Right?

Zuck: we'll know once we get in there

** you know you can't track this all down.

Tester: I'm not making any money on it. Feels like you own the data.

**yes

Zuck: what we mean is you can control it on Facebook. You give us a license to use it.

DRINK

Zuck: we have to see all the content or we can't make the platform work.

** Here's the real issue. Our data is new labor. Right now lots of people are making money by getting you to give it to them for free. This shouldn't be how this works. It's a contributing factor to the growing, insane wealth gap. Our data makes AI work, for example.

**This is about to change and they all know it. This is the Triangle Shirtwaste Factor of this century.