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#DisclosuresTribunal will resume at 10.30am today - with Supt Dave Taylor contiuing to be cross-examined
#DisclosuresTribunal Mícheál Ó Higgins, SC, for the gardaí, has resumed cross-examining Supt Taylor
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H asks re: sex abuse allegation he says he was to whisper about to journalists, etc, "was the purpose of that not to get the journalists to believe there was something to the allegation?" T: No, it was to speak to McCabe's motivation
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H asks if he discussed the alleged campaign with NOS or Andrew McLindon and if they felt it was wrong, Taylor says 'no' to both. (Both NOS and McLindon deny being part of having any knowledge of any smear campaign)
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H goes to 30-page statement Taylor made to tribunal on May 5, 2017. He said "I was to say that McC was driven by agendas, motivated by revenge and revenge driven by allegation, the sexual allegation, made against him by another member's daughter..."
#DisclosuresTribunal [cntd] "...a number of years ago....gone to was put in such a way that there was no smoke without fire, I would drop that in when talking to the journalists".
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H: Did you not say just a few minutes ago you DIDN'T say to journalist 'there was no smoke without fire". Asked if he can clarify, Taylor repeats that he was instructed to tell journalists McCabe's motivation for making complaints was motivated by revenge
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H clarifies it's his (Taylor's) case there was a 4-party campaign involving Call, O'Sull, McLindon and him. Asked if any talk about stopping campaign after C stood down? Taylor: No. Says he was never in the commissioner's office after Callinan stepped down.
#DisclosuresTribunal O'Higgins asks Taylor if he can explain why there would have been a sudden halting or cessation of the smear campaign after MC left, if two people who were allegedly 'in on it' were still in situ? Taylor can't explain.
#DisclosuresTribunal O'Higgins asking about the pre-PAC meetings (before Callinan went before PAC and made 'disgusting' remark...we know minutes for meetings show Sgt McCabe and Ms D allegation was discussed). O'H asks if Taylor was ever asked to neg brief jours at such meetings?
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor says 'no'. O'H asks if the smear campaign was ever discussed at these meetings, T says 'no. O'H puts to him that MC, NOS, AMcL were all at those meetings. Taylor: They were strategy make sure Comm had all info prepared for PAC questions
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H puts it to Taylor would it not have been logical for him to involve the Garda Press Office to 'get the message out' Taylor it would have been inappropriate to do so. Says GPO dealt with 'run-of-the-mill' queries. Says it was at Comm's level
#DisclosuresTribunal OH reads out name of every journalist Taylor claims he negatively briefed. Asked how they reacted, Taylor says they didn't. Says "journalists don't they process it [info] is their business" Says they've their other sources & can make own inquiries
#DisclosuresTribunal OH puts it to Taylor that journalists, acting legitimately, would come back and ask for documentary evidence or ask further questions...Taylor repeats: I passed on information - it was a matter for them to progress other sources and ask questions
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H says Taylor is suggesting that each journalist remained mute every single time he allegedly negatively briefed them about Sgt McCabe
#DisclosureTribunal O'H asking about T's claim AGS dir of comms Andrew McLindon was aware of alleged campaign. O'H asks why McL wasn't named as someone who was aware of campaign by Ta until May 5, 2017 (McL wasn't named in his PD). Also didn't tell McCabe of McL's alleged invlmt
#DisclosurseTribunal Taylor said McLindon didn't come up in his conversation with McCabe (in Sept 2016). O'Higgins points out he also didn't come up when he made his first two statement to the tribunal. Taylor agrees.
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H now asking when T had his "epiphany" of coming forward about the alleged campaign. O'Higgins pressing for a date or a time of a period in his life that prompted this. Taylor, again, says he had time to think, his thought process evolved, can't give date.
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H reminds T how he prev said he had time to think outside the "Hothouse of Garda culture". O'H points out he was suspended in May 2015...PD was Sept 2016. Taylor repeats it was an "evolution". O'H puts it to him he confided in somebody, T says yes, his wife
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor can't give an exact date, repeats it was an "evolution in his mind" and he made up his mind "to do the right thing". O'H asks if he told his wife - prior to realising if it was wrong - that he told wife Michelle about the campaign. Taylor agrees
#DisclosuresTribunal OH asks when he told his wife of his instruction, Taylor says he can't give a date. OH points out he has told the tribunal he was given instruction in mid-2013
#DisclosuresTribunal OH asks what was approximate period of time btwn him telling wife Michelle about his instruction and realising it was wrong. Taylor can't help..repeats "it was an evolution in my thought process".
#DisclosuresTribunal OH is asking about his wife's reaction was when he told her of the instruction to smear McCabe. Taylor: "I can't state what the reaction was".
#DisclosuresTribunal OH "Was she not surprised...?" Taylor: "This was an order from the Garda Commissioner." OH: Did she not comment on whether that was appropriate or fair?" Taylor: "My wife is not a member of AGS...she wouldn't be making any comments in relation to that"
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor repeats he only spoke to MC, NOS, and MCL about the alleged campaign - he didn't speak to retired garda, or friend or acquaintance not in the gardai
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H asking Taylor about his contact with Michael Clifford whom he agreed was considered "previously off limits" in May 2016. Taylor said contact was made to thank him for an article he wrote.
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H asks Taylor if he knew at that point the smear campaign was wrong? Taylor repeats this "epiphany" was an evolution of thought and he made his PD in September 2016.
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H raises his meeting with Fianna Fail TD John McGuiness. Taylor said "in late 2016" McGuinness contacted his wife. Tribunal hears his wife was a member of Fianna Fail at the time. [Charleton clarifies there's nothing wrong with being a member of FF]
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H asks Taylor when he got legal representation. Taylor says first consultation was in December 2014.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH on chronology: Oct 2013, Roma kids issue, article appears about that; March 24, 2014, Martin Callinan steps down, after which Taylor was never in Comm's office; May 2014, T is told he's being transferred out of GPO; June 10, 2014, Taylor starts in Traffic
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H putting to Taylor he wasn't happy about being put out of GPO and continued his own press office by continuing to disclose details to journalists. Taylor says this has already been dealt with by a comprehensive investigation
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor said he had a lot of contact with journalists during his time in GPO and "I kept in touch with them afterwards". O'H asks if he recalls sending a text: "I'm currently in the dungeon in Dublin Castle, awaiting parole."
#DisclosuresTribunal OH suggests to Taylor that he saw his transfer as a "significant and dramatic fall from grace".
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H goes to statement of Taylor to Clerkin investigation that he said first time he became aware of the Roma incident in Tallaght (on Oct 22, 2013) was in media. O'H puts to Taylor this was false. Taylor says it isn't.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH puts to Taylor that when CS Clerkin gave evidence to tribunal he said this claim by Taylor (during Clerkin investigation) was false as Clerkin said his investigation showed Taylor had seen the patrol officer's report about the incident before media article
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor says this is incorrect and he didn't see the patrol officer's report. O'Higgins says this wasn't challenged by Taylor's legal team when Clerkin gave his evidence.
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor says that any conversation he had with his legal team is privileged. Taylor also tells Judge Charleton he did not leak any details of Roma incident to any newspaper
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H puts to Taylor that the investigation into him about alleged leaking didn't start with Taylor and that it started out about the Roma incident. Taylor agrees.
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H puts to Taylor Clerkin invest found Taylor was in daily contact with journs up until February 2015 (having been in Traffic since June 2014). OH suggests things got worse for Taylor then in spring and summer of 2015, leading to arrest in May 2015. T agrees
#DisclosuresTribunal O'Higgin goes back to November 25, 2014 - when NOS was confirmed as Commissioner. O'H asks T how he received that news, did he welcome it or not? Taylor said he sent her a text congratulating her.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH asks if that congratulatory text reflected his view. Taylor repeats: "She was appointed Comm, I accepted that and that was it." Charleton steps in and asks how he felt about it. T: "It [NOS] wouldn't have been my number one choice, but that's just me"
#DisclosuresTribunal OH: Did you not tell a colleague you were gutted? Taylor: She wouldn't have been my number one choice to be Garda Commissioner.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH suggests to Taylor this wasn't a good development for his career.
#DisclosuresTribunal Hears a complaint was made by Supt Taylor's wife to GSOC in Feb 2016 after a message from phone number of phone Taylor no longer had came through to a Viber group of a neighbour - requesting to join the group.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH continues with the timeline and points out Taylor applied for a Judicial Review to stop criminal and disciplinary investigation against him on Feb 29, 2016 [NOTE: tribunal has already heard that DPP first ruled no prosecution against Taylor in Feb 2016]
#DisclosuresTribunal [ALSO NOTE: Tribunal has already heard the application wasn't ultimately successful]
#DisclosuresTribunal Hears in his JP applic to High Court, it was put on Taylor's behalf that his arrest in May of 2015 was made "exclusively for the purpose of....causing embarrassment ...and/or...inflicting emotional pain and suffering...and/or...public ridicule and contempt"
#DisclosuresTribunal Charleton intervenes and says what he alleged in JR was effectively an allegation of "an abuse of public office". Taylor: "It was a traumatic inflicted pain..." OH: Are you abandoning the claim that the arrest was for the purpose of embarrassment?
#DisclosuresTribunal OH suggest the sentence infers AGS did something improper. Taylor: I'm not impugning their integrity. OH asks if he's then withdrawing the allegation as set out in JR bid. T repeats he was saying the arrest caused him embarrassment
#DisclosuresTribunal OH reads out other section of JR bid in which he said investigators were "Tactless...unneccssarily autocratic and oppressive and they failed to afford DT a reasonable level of courtesy and respect." OH says he has an opportunity now to withdraw this claim.
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor tells how he was stripped of shoes, belt and placed in a cell after he was arrested by appointment and he wasn't a flight risk. OH presses Taylor: Are you saying officers were heavy-handed?
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor repeats he was stripped of shoes, belt and placed in a cell. OH pressing Taylor to say if he stands over his claim in the JR application. Taylor repeats he always treats people with civility...says he would always shake hand with a prisoner, etc.
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor also wrote in his JR application: "On a date unknown evidence obtained in the course of the aforementioned investigation was tampered with or interfered with." Asked if he still stands over that, T says this concerned the Viber text (see prev tweet)
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor said he still hasn't got an answer on what happened with the Viber message. OH pointing out evidence from last week when there was an exchange about this tampering claim: Here:
#DisclosuresTribunal Charleton now specifically asks "Are you saying AGS tampered with your phone, any of your phones, with a view to manipulating evidence?" T says he can't answer that, he raised his concern about the Viber matter and he has yet to establish how that happened.
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor says he requested permission from gardai to go to Viber to find out how the incident occurred and said he was willing to pay, but gardai didn't give him permission.
#DisclosuresTribunal After many attempts to get a clear answer if he believes AGS tampered with his phone and Taylor repeating he's never felt he got an adequate answer, OH moves on.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH asks what prompted his wife to contact McCabe in 2016. DT says McCabe called him, DT said he'd call him back - but he didn't intend to - and his wife called him. T confirms this was after his contact with Clifford (this tallies with McCabe's evidence)
#DisclosuresTribunal OH says wife Michelle says first contact with McCabe made in April/May 2016 but Taylor believes it was later.
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor, his wife and McCabe met on September 20, 2016. Taylor said before the meeting, he had spoken to a priest.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH (again) trying to find out when exactly he realised what he was doing was wrong. Says before meeting McCabe, he only told his wife and a priest of this realisation.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH (again) asking about his wife's reaction. OH says she makes point that Taylor was in a bad place and his mood was low at this point in time. Taylor agrees. T also agrees, at this time, he faced criminal/disciplinary proceedings and was under pressure
#DisclosuresTribunal OH has asks DT detailed questions about what he told Michael Clifford when they met. He's asked if he told Cliff hat NOS's husband headed up the investigation to him? (doesn't recall) Did he tell him of unhappiness about NOS husband involvmt (doesn't recall)
#DisclosuresTribunal OH asks if he told Clifford that he denied being the person who leaked info about Roma matter to journalist Mick McCaffrey. OH also asks if he told Clifford he was an outcast as consequence of investigation into him (DT).
#DisclosuresTribunal OH pulls up on screen sections of Clifford's McCabe book (which he had sent to Taylor for accuracy). It says Taylor was "disappointed" he was moved out of the GPO and re: investigation into Roma leak, NOS appointed her husband "to head up the investigation"
#DisclosuresTribunal breaks for lunch
#DisclosuresTribunal has resumed. Hears legal representation for journalist Gemma O'Doherty is here. Ms O'Doherty is also here.
#DisclosuresTribunal Judge says that's fine and says he's sure she has some questions.
#DisclosuresTribunal O'Higgins goes back to chapter from Mick Clifford's book (which Clifford had sent to Taylor to check for factual accuracy and didn't seek changes on). OH reads out section where 'by June 2016 DT's life had completely transformed, he was on reduced pay, etc.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH reads out from chapter: "One minute a well regarded senior garda, working in close proximity to commissioners and presidents, the next something of an outcast, to whom even former colleagues were wary of associating with."
#DisclosuresTribunal OH continues reading: ""In early June an acquaintance of McCabe's had been in contact with Taylor on a separate matter. In the course of a conversation, Taylor expressed regret for what had been visited on McCabe by senior management over the years."
#DisclosuresTribunal OH continues: "Some weeks later this was conveyed to McCabe in a casual manner, but the latter found it interesting." OH tries to find out who this person is. Taylor said, as he said this am, he spoke to priest but T DOESN'T confirm this is the "acquaintance"
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H continues reading about when Michelle Taylor (DT's wife) met Sgt McCabe: "Through it all, she displayed a burning sense of grievance at what had befallen her husband." OH asks if he felt aggrieved. T says he was deeply upset for his family re: loss of pay
#DisclosuresTribunal Charleton steps in and asks if he felt he was a victim. Taylor repeats he was concerned for family over pay issue. Charleton again puts to him 'you weren't thinking of yourself as a victim?' Taylor: No.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH continues to read about meeting between T and McCabe...that T unburdened himself to McCabe...that he told him he was involved in a campaign of black propaganda against McCabe...that there were a number of strands to the campaign..
#DisclosuresTribunal OH continues...that there were hundreds if not thousands of text messages sent to media and garda personnel casting McCabe in a dark light...and excuses were invented as to why there was no official record of child abuse allegations...
#DisclosuresTribunal OH asks Taylor if the excuses bit was in fact part of the campaign against McCabe [that excuses were invented to explain why no official record of child sex abuse allegations] Taylor says no. OH asks why he didn't tell Clifford this when he read the chapter
#DisclosuresTribunal OH asks why Taylor didn't tell Clifford to that out (or the bit about the texts). Taylor repeats several times that he didn't forensically examine Clifford's chapter, he scanned it, he didn't go through it line by line.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH confirms with Taylor that it's his position he didn't "unburden himself" to anyone other than his wife and the priest before he met Sgt McCabe.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH tells T he has difficulty with idea his Sept 20 2016 meeting with McCabe was truly cathartic moment where he unburdened himself for first time of his dark secret. OH said he elswhere disclosed the campaign to Clifford on an earlier occasion. Taylor: No.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH goes to statement of Taylor from March 8, 2018 in which he told the tribunal he talked to Clifford before meeting McCabe and told him about the smear campaign. In his statement: "I had a conversation with Michael Clifford before I met Maurice McCabe..."
#DisclosuresTribunal Statement cntd: "... this was late summer 2016. I told Michael Clifford about the campaign to negatively brief journalists about Maurice McCabe. I told him I was to brief journalists negatively about Sgt McCabe in respect of Ms D 2006 allegation..."
#DisclosuresTribunal [Cntd]..."on the instruction of Martin Callinan..." Taylor says he didn't tell Clifford the full detail or exact instructions. "I did not go into the actually words of what I was saying." OH pulls up on screen Clifford's statement to the tribunal
#DisclosuresTribunal sees tribunal investigators put to Clifford the passage in previous tweets from Taylor's statement and asked if he agrees with this account. Clifford told investigators he thought it was earlier but he says that in the meeting, he recalls Taylor putting..
#DisclosuresTribunal "a lot of emphasis on text messages being part of the issues around Sgt McCabe particularly'. Clifford says he recalled Taylor saying he would reference sex abuse allegation in communications by text with journalists.
#DisclosuresTribunal Clifford said, in early Oct 2016, he recalled asking Taylor again about texts being part of the campaign against Sgt McCabe and Taylor "confirmed that text messages were part of the campaign against Sgt McCabe"
#DisclosuresTribunal OH now asking about when Clifford met McCabe in summer '16 [before he met McCabe in Sept '16] and his purpose of meeting. Taylor says it was to discuss his own situation.
#DisclosuresTribunal Asked if smear campaign came up, Taylor says they talked about McCabe but he didn't give him details of smear campaign. OH goes back and reads Taylor's statement in which he said he neg briefed about McCabe. Taylor repeats he didn't go into detail w/Clifford
#DIsclosuresTribunal OH: Clifford seems to be clear in his statement that you discussed the campaign with him in summer in 2016 and placed a lot of emphasis on texts. Taylor says he's never said in any statements (including his PD) that texts were used in smear campaign
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor repeats it's always his evidence that texts were sent to Callinan and NOS in respect of media updates about McCabe. OH specifically asks Taylor: Did you tell him [Clifford] the FACT there was a smear campaign? Taylor: No I didn't
#DisclosuresTribunal OH puts to Taylor that he wanted to bring down Noirin O'Sullivan. Taylor: Absolutely not. OH: Weren't you anxious to bring her down? Taylor: "I was suspended Garda Superintendent. I could not have any ability to do such a thing."
#DisclosuresTribunal sees a letter dated Oct 3, 2016 -from a Protected Disclosure Manager to then Justice Minister Frances Fitzgerald - who said he got McCabes protected disclosure on Wed, Sept 28, 2016 and he got Taylor's protected disclosure on Fri, Sept 30, 2016
#DisclosuresTribunal O'H confirms with Taylor that on evening of Oct 3, 2016, he met with TDs Clare Daly and Mick Wallace in his house that evening. OH: what was the plan? T: They asked to meet and I met them. Said he didn't know they were going to raise matter in Dail
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor says he didn't call NOS a liar when he spoke to Mick Wallace
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor also says he didn't portray himself as a victim to the TDs.
#DisclosuresTribunal O'Higgins goes to Mick Wallace's statement. MW told tribunal Taylor had confirmed to them that he was part of campaign to destroy McCabe and he was very sorry for that. He said the tipping point came a few weeks previous when they had a family trauma...
#DisclosuresTribunal MW stmt: "He also told us that snr management in AGS were convinced that Maurices' motives weren't good and that his efforts to expose things going on in AGS were linked to his own grievances with the force." T agrees with this
#DisclosuresTribunal MW's statement that Taylor did speak of derogatory texts and he says it was his understanding these were about McCabe but concedes he/they were making that assumption that T, Call and NOS were fabricating texts about McCAbe of derogatory nature
#DisclosuresTribunal MW's statement said Taylor would have appreciated that Clare Daly and him were raising the matter on the floor of the Dail and MW couldn't recall him ever contradicting what he [MW] would have said in relation to him in the Dail chamber.
#DisclosuresTribunal O'Higgins goes through Mick Wallace's notes of his meeting. "When she moves, she's lying" (McDowell raised this yesterday) Taylor denies calling her a liar. Says these are Mick Wallace's notes.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH says W is clear Taylor was "giving off" about NOS and her husband's involvement and T felt "targeted improperly", T said he didn't say he was targeted improperly but pointed out NOS husband was involved and six members of Traffic were interviewed about him
#DisclosuresTribunal OH reads out Wallace's notes include the note: NOS: The most unaccountable commissioner. Taylor: "Those weren't my words." Note also says McGowan handpicked them - no advertisement.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH puts to Taylor that he was fixated on NOS and her husband. Taylor: I don't accept that. OH puts to Taylor he was keen to paint himself as a victim. Taylor: I don't accept that.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH recalls Clifford wrote article about protected disclosures in Oct 2016 (without naming McCabe and Taylor). OH asks if he gave Clifford his PD. Taylor is adamant: I did not supply him with any copy of my Protected Disclosure.
#DIsclosuresTribunal OH puts it to Taylor that he was anxious to "do down" NOS but he had to involve Martin Callinan so Taylor came up with the retrospective period when he was in GPO and Call was Comm.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH: "Nobody would have believed an allegation purely against NOS, she was deputy at the had to involve Martin Callinan at the time." Taylor: I don't accept that.
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor confirms he visited Martin Callinan at his home in June and October 2014. OH puts to him that during these visits, he was critical of NOS about his transfer. Taylor: I was disappointed to leave the Press Office.
#DisclosuresTribunal OH puts to him that Callinan advised him to get on with job and that he had the ability to make a success of his new role. Taylor said Callinan told him to get on with his job.
#DisclosuresTribunal Taylor confirms he made another visit to Callinan's home (after his arrest in May 2015).
#DisclosuresTribunal OH says it's Callinane's evidence that in this visit T was "more agitated", talked about how badly he'd been treated, and was giving out about having been put in a cell and his shoes & belt being taken from him
#DisclosuresTribunal Tribunal has broke for five minutes and then Supt Taylor's wife Michelle will give evidence. Not known yet if Supt Taylor will return but it seems likely.
#DIsclosuresTribunal Supt Taylor's wife Michelle now in witness box. Kathleen Leader BL, for tribunal, now taking Michelle Taylor through her evidence.
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor tells tribunal she believes she learned of the alleged smear campaign after Supt Taylor was suspended (May 2015)
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor confirms it was her impression there were neg feelings - she thought were coming from Garda HQ - towards McCAbe over penalty points. Leader tries to ascertain when she had knowledge of neg feelings towards McCabe and knowledge of negative briefings
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor said she believes she learned that Taylor was instructed to brief media negatively about McCabe when he was in the press office (Taylor was in GPO from July 2012 - June 2014)
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor said she knew the campaign involved Supt Taylor telling journalists there was a "backstory". Ms Taylor can't specifically say when she became aware of Ms D issue.
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor said she never really asked Supt Taylor to tease out the backstory or ask Supt Taylor which journalists he allegedly briefed.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader raises Ms Taylor's statement.. Asked by tribunals investigators if she ever overheard Supt Taylor brief a journalist, she said he was always on phone and wouldn't have known who he was talking to...
#DisclosuresTribunal but "I would have heard him brief negatively against Sgt McCAbe to the effect I have described above [Ms D allegation] as he would have taken and made calls in our home and he was always on the phone."
#DisclosuresTribunal [ctnd] "I cannot be specific as to names or dates. It was when he was Garda press officer." (specifically, Ms Taylor was referring to Ms D and claim McCabe was motivated by revenge due to the Ms D investigation).
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor she can't recall any specific calls. She repeats it was ongoing and he was always on the phone. Leader says no member of GPO has given evidence to the tribunal that they were aware that Taylor was leading a neg campaign and...
#DisclosuresTribunal ....and Leader points out she's the only tribunal witness to say they witnessed this alleged campaign. Ms Taylor repeats: "I just heard there was a backstory."
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader now asking about her and Supt Taylor's meeting with Sgt McCabe. Tribunal has already heard Sgt McCabe initially rang Supt Taylor, he didn't call him back but Ms Taylor called him back and met him. They met in Skylon Hotel for coffee.
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor said it was very polite and alleged smear campaign was not discussed. She said she went home and told Supt Taylor that McCabe was a very nice man and suggested he meet McCabe. They eventually met Sept 20 2016.
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor said when Sgt McCabe came in, after shaking hands, etc..Supt Taylor told McCabe: Maurice, I have to be honest with you, there was a campaign against you and I was part of it. Ms Taylor said it was very emotional.
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor categorically says: He [Supt Taylor] never texted journalists negatively about him." Asked how she's so sure, Ms Taylor says he wouldn't put anything in texts...said he did text about media items on McCabe.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader: Was Noirin O'Sullivan's role in relation to criminal investigation into Taylor discussed? [NOTE: McCabe's PD says: "He stated that he was now being targeted becase he "knew too much"] Ms Taylor: No, just the criminal investigation and impact on family
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor says she did tell McCabe she was concerned about NOS's husband being involved in the investigation into Taylor. Says she did tell him they had fears about getting a fair hearing.
#DisclosuresTribunal McCabe's PD [in relation to carpark meeting btwn Callinan and FF TD John McGuinness]: "Dep McG was warned against believing any evidence that I would give at PAC on the basis that I was a serial sex abuser who abused my own children and nieces."
#DisclosuresTribunal Asked if this was discussed, Ms Taylor says no.
#DisclosuresTribunal Re: texts, Ms Taylor said Supt Taylor told McCabe he would only send texts about media updates. Leader says it's the understanding of three other witnesses that texts WERE used in alleged smear campaign: McGuinness TD, Clare Daly TD and Michael Clifford
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor says Supt Taylor is not a great texter, he'd sooner pick up the phone.
#DisclosuresTribunal Re: Supt Taylor going to a priest, Ms Taylor said around that time, there was a lot of money pressures and she thought Supt Taylor was going to die.
#DisclosuresTribunal Re: Sgt McCabe's protected disclosure where it says that Supt Taylor told him Noirin O'Sullivan would go to any level to lie, Ms Taylor says Supt Taylor didn't say that.
#DisclosuresTribunal Re: the Viber message, Ms Taylor said the neighbour who raised the concern (when a message from the number of a phone Supt Taylor no longer had attempted to join a private group) brought it to Ms Taylor's attention. Ms Taylor said she was very embarrassed.
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor confirmed she made the complaint about the Viber message to GSOC (gardai can't make complaints to GSOC) [This was also referred to earlier this morning]
#DisclosuresTribunal hears Ms T in stmt to trib said: "Dave told McC that his 3 phones were taken off him in the investigation and they were probably downloaded onto Oisin which is a seprate computer sustem to PULSE and Dave felt there were probably files on Dave on that system"
#DisclosuresTribunal hears Ms T in stmt to trib said she can recall Supt Taylor telling her Noel Cunningham told HIM [Taylor] that "Noirin is after throwing me under the bus" - this was at time matter about Mullingar meeting in O'Higgins Comm was sent to GSOC by NOS (May 2016)
#DisclosuresTribunal Michael McDowell, for Sgt McCabe, puts to Ms Taylor that his overall suggestion to her that McCabe's account of the meeting is correct
#DisclosuresTribunal It's Taylor and Ms Taylor's evidence that DT didn't talk to McCabe about what was allegedly discussed at the carpark meeting btwn MGuinness and Callinan. McDowell says it doesn't make sense that they'd discuss it without discussing content of the meeting.
#DisclosuresTribunal McD explains McG had already told Dail Callinan had made derogatory comments about McCabe to him in May 2016 [McG said: [Callinan] confided in me in a car park on the Naas Road that Garda McCabe was not to be trusted and there were serious issues about him].
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor confirms Supt Taylor did tell her about the alleged 'Noirin has thrown me under a bus comment' re: Mullingar meeting and GSOC, allegedly made by Supt Cunningham to Supt Taylor
#DisclosuresTribunal Mr McDowell put to Ms Taylor that it was her case that McCabe advised Supt Taylor to make a protected disclosure and this was advised by "Michael". McD said McCabe says this isn't correct. Ms Taylor: That's my recollection of the day
#DisclosuresTribunal Counsel for Mick Clifford asking about the texts. Ms Taylor repeats what Supt Taylor said about texts was about media items not the smear campaign. [Counsel for Clifford basically going through the discrepancies btw Cliff and DT account gone over previously]
#DisclosuresTribunal Counsel for John McGuinness TD now putting similar question to Ms Taylor re: texts. Counsel: "Could it have been said at that meeting [with McGuinness] that texts were used as part of his campaign?" Ms Taylor: There were no texts use to send neg messages
#DisclosuresTribunal Noel Whelan, for AGS, puts to Ms Taylor she has said she overheard more than once DT giving a backstory about McCabe to journalists. Asks if she can anchor any of these occasions. Ms Taylor: "I can't" Ms T can't recall any details re: time of any briefings
#DisclosuresTribunal has heard Supt Taylor did speak to a priest. This is chaplain of AGS Fr Joe Kennedy. Asked when Supt Taylor talked to Fr Kennedy, Ms Taylor can't say for sure but thinks it was before (poss two weeks before) DT met Sgt McCabe
#DisclosuresTribunal Ms Taylor tells Noel Whelan, for the gardai, that she was "shocked and upset" when she saw the story in the Irish Examiner on Oct 4 2016 about Taylor and McCabe's protected disclosures.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader ask Ms Taylor about the Clerkin investigation into Supt Taylor and what was her understanding of it. She said she understood it was about alleged leaking of info re: Roma children. Ms Taylor also confirms to judge she never knew name of Ms D
#DisclosuresTribunal Today's hearing has ended. Tribunal will resume tomorrow morning at 10.30am with Supt Taylor back in witness box. Former Garda Commissioner Martin Callinan is scheduled to appear after Supt Taylor's finishes.
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