Thread by @BBuchman_CNS

Good morning from inside the Longworth building as we prepare for what is shaping up to be a contentious day of hearings underpinning the #impeachmentinquiry of @realDonaldTrump. Live-tweeting starts at 9AM ET.
@CourthouseNews

We are 15 mins out. My live-tweet thread begins here.
First half of today's hearing features testimony from NSC official Alex Vindman & VP Pence aide Jennifer Williams. Later, we hear from frmr. special envoy to Ukr. Kurt Volker and Tim Morrison, frmr Russia adviser to NSC.

The whoosh of camera shutters is all you could hear as Alex Vindman and Jennifer Williams entered to take their seats.
And we're gaveled in, now underway.
#ImpeachmentInquiry
@CourthouseNews

@CourthouseNews House Intel. Chair Adam Schiff, in his opening statement, recalls remark by Trump, acc. to Sondland. Trump did not give a "expletive" about Ukraine, Sondland said.
The expletive he refrained from using in this storied room was "shit." Trump did not give "a shit" about Ukraine.

@CourthouseNews During the July 25 call, Trump complained U.S. relationship w/Ukraine not reciprocal. Zel. thanked U.S. defense to deter Russia aggression. Trump's response? "I would like you to do us a favor."

The favor? Looking into Bidens/Burisma, Schiff says.
Neither issue part of the preparation for the call, he adds.
Note: Vindman believed Zel was prepped for the call in order to make the connection to Biden/Burisma when Trump brought it up. This corroborated by other testimony.

"You have shed blood for America and we owe you an immense debt of gratitude," Schiff says to Vindman, who has faced what he described as "scurrilous" attacks on his character from right wing and conservative spaces in the run up to today's testimony.
@CourthouseNews

@CourthouseNews Ranking minority member Devin Nunes is now delivering opening remarks. He says the accounts of those who have testified were skewed by the media.
I can't speak for all of the media, but you can read my entire live-feed and I know I reported what happened, nothing more or less.

@CourthouseNews Nunes has several questions he wants addressed that he claims have been ignored: To start: what is full extent of Dem prior coordination w/whistleblower and who else did they coordinate with incl. Schiff?

What is WB political biases/connections to Dem politicians? Has WB explained inaccuracies in complaint? What contact did WB have w/media that may be ongoing? What are sources of WB info? Who else did he talk to and was he prohibited by law from conveying any of that information?

Vindman is active duty. Served in S. Korea. Germany and Iraq. Deployed to Iraq during heavy fighting, hurt by a roadside bomb and received a Purple Heart.

He joined Trump admin in July 2018 when he was asked to serve on the Nat Sec Council.

Williams worked under George W. Bush and worked on Bush/Cheney presidential campaign.
In her role at Office of Vice President, she prepares Pence for meetings with foreign leaders, her expertise primarily on Russia.

Both Vindman and Williams rise and are sworn in.
#impeachmentinquiry
@CourthouseNews

@CourthouseNews Williams will deliver her opening statement first.

@CourthouseNews Willliams is going over her background first: she has served in foreign service for 14 years, total, worekd for 3 different administrations, 2 Republican and 1 Democratic. She has served overseas in Jamaica, Lebanon and London.

She's worked on humanitarian issues tied to Syria conflict, has worked as advisor on Middle East issues to deputy secy of state. In the spring she joined Pence's office where she works closely with State, Nat Sec Council and DoD to "promote foreign policy" objectives.

Timeline details from Williams:
- April 21: Zel wins the Ukr. election
- Apr 23: VP calls to congratulate Zel
During the call, VP accepted invite to attend Zel inauguration.

Williams said the window of Pence availability was "narrow" and Ukr. parliament wouldn't meet until after May 14. OVP did not expect to know whether Pence would attend until May 14 or earlier.
May 13: ass't to VP chief of staff calls, says Trump "decided the VP wouldn't attend"

No further explanationw was given.
Williams then informs NSC that Pence isn't going.
July 3: OMB places hold on tranche of military aid for Ukr.

"According to the information I received, OMB was reviewing whether the funding was aligned with the administration's priorities," she says.

After the hold, she attended meetings of the Policy Coordination Committee where the hold was discussed. During those meetings, State and DoD said they wanted it released but OMB wanted it to stay frozen.

Sept 11: she learns the security assistance for Ukr. is released.
"I have never learned what prompted that decision," Williams said.

She remembers: "I found the July 25 phone call unusual because in contrast to other presidential calls I had observed, it involved discussion of what appeared to be a domestic political matter."

To put in further context: she has listened to roughly a dozen presidential calls.

Vindman in opening remarks says if Ukr. pursued investigation in 2016 election, Biden or Burisma as Trump wanted, it would be seen as a partisan ploy the world over, subjecting Ukr. to international loss of trust, placing them in a precarious position

DEVELOPING. When they heard President Trump’s call w/his Ukrainian counterpart Volodomyr Zelensky from inside the situation room, a decorated Army colonel and a special adviser to VP Mike Pence were aghast and alarmed at what they heard.
courthousenews.com/pair-disturbed…
@CourthouseNews

@CourthouseNews Vindman addresses his father: "Dad, I'm sitting here today in the U.S. capitol. Talking to elected professionals is proof you made the right decision 40 years ago to leave the Soviet Union and seek a better life for our family. Do not worry, I will be fine for telling the truth."

@CourthouseNews Schiff has 45 minutes to conduct questions.
Did Vindman prepare talking points for POTUS for July call. Vindman affirms, he did.
The talking points incl. rooting out corruption in Ukr. cleared through NSC staff for the president, Vindman said.

@CourthouseNews On April call, Trump said to Zel, he'd send a "high level" delegation to inaug.
Williams affirms that was her understanding too at Office of VP but she was not witness to the conversation where Pence was pulled off. She learned this on May 13, before inaug date was set

@CourthouseNews Vindman testifies he warned Zelensky to "stay away" from U.S. dom. politics. It was clear there were "public actors, non governmental actors" that were promoting the idea of investigations of 2016 Ukr. interference, he says.

This warning was consistent with other advice Vindman gave to all nations in his portfolio, he says.

Real time reaction to hearing the call. Vindman pauses before he speaks but says "Without hesitation, I knew I had to report this to WH counsel. I had concerns and it was my duty to report my concerns to proper people in the chain of command."

"It was inappropriate, it was improper for the president to request, to demand an investigation into a political opponent, especially a foreign power where there's at best, dubious belief that this would be a completely impartial investigation," Vindman says of July call.

He continues: "It would have significant implications if it became public knowledge and would be seen as a partisan play, undermining foreign policy and our national security."

Schiff: You described this as a demand, what is relationship between Trump/Zel that he sees it as a demand?
Vindman explains it in context of military culture.

When a senior asks you to do something, even if its polite & pleasant, its not to be taken as a request, its to be taken as an order. The power disparity between the 2 leaders, my impresion: in order to get the WH mtg, Pres. Zelensky would have to deliver these investigations."

Williams recalls Burisma from the call. It was in her notes. But Burisma is not mentioned in the production of the transcript the WH has released - which is incomplete.

Vindman says word Burisma may or may not have been caught by those taking notes for transcript. When released Burisma referred to as "the company." Vindman says thats accurate, not a significant ommission. The people who listen may not have caught it but it's his job...

To review their notes, compare with his own, and flesh out details for official record.

We're into questioning from Dem counsel Daniel Goldman. He refers to Trump's statement on July call about Ukraine having "the server." Vindman affirms probe of Ukr. being involved in '16 election interference "not part" of official U.S. policy.

Vindman and Williams both affirm that they are not aware of any credible basis for belief that Ukr. involved in '16 election

In private, Vindman said it "didn't take a rocket scientist" to understand that Trump's push to have Zel. open investigation into Biden/Burisma was improper.

He stands by those remarks today.

Vindman said during opening remarks he believed Zelensky was "prepped" or "prepared" for the July 25 call.
A text from July 25, just a half hour before the call is deplayed on screens in hearing room. It's the text from Amb. Volker to Andriy Yermak, Zel aide.

Volker wrote: "Good lunch - thanks. Heard from the White House - assuming President Z convinces Trump he will investigate "get to the bottom of what happened in 2016" we will nail down date for visit to Washington. Good luck! See you tomorrow - kurt"

Dem counsel asked Vindman if he believed this was an indication of the prep work he believed Zelensky participated in ahead of the Trump call on 7/25.
Vindman, simply: "Yes."

Did Vindman discuss how written summary of call should be handled with NSC lawyers?
Vindman says yes, there was discussion. The conclusion, to his understanding, was that the transcript was viewed as "sensitive" and told to "avoid leaks."

Vindman paraphrases what he heard of what to do with transcript but recalls messaging as "preserve the integrity of the transcript."
He also concedes he didn't see the handling of the transcript at this point as "nefarious"

Putting the transcript on a secure system is not totally unprecedented, Vindman says, if you only want a small # of people to have access. Was it intended to be put on a highly classified system by lawyers or was it a mistake?

Vindman: "I think it was intended, but it was intended to prevent leaks and limit access."

Dem counsel asks if Vindman knows about the following and he affirms for all: Amb. Yovanovitch recalled from Ukr around May Zelensky inaug. Recalls Trump phone call w/Putin in early May; recalls Giuliani planned a trip to Ukraine to promote the "idea of investigations" for POTUS

During a meeting w/Ukr. officials, Vindman told Sondland that requests to conduct meetings re: investigations were inappropriate and "had nothing to do" with national security policy. Note: Vindman can't recall if Volker was actually in the room or heard him when he said.

No later than July 10, Dem counsel notes, the WH meeting was conditioned on investigations into Burisma and 2016 election, correct?
Vindman: Correct.

What was first thing Zel asked of Pence during their first meeting. Williams: Zel asked about status of security systems in Ukraine, he saw reporting in Politico that it was being withheld.

In her testimony, Williams said military assistance was not just important to assist Ukr. to fight against Russia but that it was also "symbolic in nature. What did that mean?

Williams: "Zelensky explained that equal with financial and physical value, it was the symbolic nature of that assistance. It was a show of support for Ukraine's sovereignty and territorial integrity."

He was stressing the need for the security assistance to be released, Williams adds.
Goldman: And if US was holding, would Russia see that as sign of weakening support for Ukr?

Williams: "I believe that is what Zelensky was indicating. Any sign that US support was wavering would be construed by Russia essentially as an opportunity for them to strengthen their own hand in Ukraine."

Did Pence provide a reason for the hold to Zel?
Pence did not but reassured Zelensky of "unwavering" support for Ukr. and need for Euro countries to "step up and provide assistance as well."

Pence conveyed to Zel he would follow up w/Trump. Then Pence spoke to Trump that night, though she wasn't privy to that conversation.

The security assistance was held for another 10 days after this meeting.

Williams, who is under oath, says she never discussed matters related to the July 25 call, or its substance, with member of the press.
Vindman, also under oath, swears he did not discuss anything with the press.

"I had it in my notes, I know thats what he said," Vindman says when asked if Burisma was mentioned in the call on July 25.
Williams had Burisma in notes too, she confirms.

Be sure to follow @KlasfeldReports for live-tweets too today. I'm backing off live-tweets for a moment while I update our story. Developing here: courthousenews.com/pair-disturbed…

@KlasfeldReports The committee is taking a short recess and I will resume live-tweeting when we are back.

@KlasfeldReports We will be underway again momentarily.

@KlasfeldReports This is now the 5-minute round phase from other lawmakers on the committee. But before we get into that, Schiff wants clarity on the following - POTUS instructed VP not to go before he even knew the date of the inauguration?
Williams: That's correct.

Schiff: So by the time he was told to go, no calculation on where POTUS may be or not be, because inaug date not set yet?
Williams: Thats right.

So when she got the message that Trump no longer wanted Pence to go - did she know Giuliani had to abort a trip he was to make to Ukr?
She saw it in the press, yes, she says.

She aware that Giuliani blamed people in Ukr. around Zel for having to cancel his trip?
Williams says yes.
This is the trip where Giuliani, on broadcast, said he didn't go to "meddle in elections" but to meddle in "investigations."

Vindman calls it "preposterous" that he would leak information when asked by Rep. Jim Jordan.
"I never did and I never would," Vindman says.
cc: @KlasfeldReports
@CourthouseNews

@KlasfeldReports @CourthouseNews Jordan gave us a taste of what is to come with Tim Morrison testimony later. Jordan seized on Morrison stmt where he said he didn't think July 25 call was "improper."
Jordan did not mention Morrison testimony about Sondland taking orders from Trump to push for investigations.

@KlasfeldReports @CourthouseNews Vindman is asked point blank: would he call himself a Never-Trumper?

"Sir, I've called myself never-partisan," Vindman says.

@KlasfeldReports @CourthouseNews Rep Jim Himes utterly slammed Devin Nunes for attacking Vindman's integrity. Notes the Purple Heart Vindman wears on his chest, says that the insinuations are no less repulsive even when they are "wrapped up in a Brooks Brothers suit"

@KlasfeldReports @CourthouseNews GOP Rep Ratcliffe railed against the proceedings then says things have shifted from quid pro quo to extortion to bribery w/o good cause. Pelosi promised compelling details to emerge about bribery, he says, yet to him - those details, that evidence is "invisible."

@KlasfeldReports @CourthouseNews Schiff offers some clarity:
"Bribery does involve quid pro quo. It does involve an official act in exchange for something of value. It could be a WH meeting, it could be $400M in military aid. It could be investigations into a political rival." He continues:

"We don't ask fact witnesses to make judgments about whether crime or bribery has been committed or what the founders had in mind when they itemized bribery or other high crimes and misdeameanors," @RepAdamSchiff says. "That is our job to decide."
#impeachmentinquiry

Schiff added: "That's why we don't ask you. And you aren't aware of all the facts that are deduced in an investigation."

Vindman says the attacks on him on Twitter and in the media have "marginalized him as a military officer."

Color from the gallery - I am seated behind members of the public today but in the press section and when Utah Rep Chris Stewart asked Vindman if Trump ever served in the military, there were a few chuckles from public spectators.

Rep Stewart saying Vindman interpreted the call between Trump and Zelensky wrong. Whether the request was "improper" was his interpretation, not "the two individuals who were talking to each other."
"They didn't interpret it that way," Stewart says.

I reached out to one of the whistleblower's attorneys this morning, @AndrewBakaj, after House Intel ranking minority member Devin Nunes launched into a series of attacks on the whistleblower's credibility & insinuated WB leaks to media.
(continued)

His client HAS NOT had any communication with the media "whatsoever," Bakaj said.
“None. Representative Nunes’ comment is absolutely irresponsible and he knows better. As a result, this is malicious,” @AndrewBakaj told me.
@CourthouseNews

"I am tired of Members of Congress using their positions to push flat out lies. As a member of the intel. community, my client is not authorized to communication with the press without clearance from their home agency. Thus my client has had no contact with reporters of any kind"

Bakaj, who reps the WB along w/attorney @MarkSZaidEsq, did have a suggestion for Rep Nunes. “I suggest he start focusing on addressing facts as opposed to using a public hearing to espouse lies about my client."

Bakaj continued: "I will not allow Mr. Nunes – or any other Member of Congress – to use my client as a part of a desperate and deliberate misinformation strategy.”
@CourthouseNews
cc: @KlasfeldReports

@CourthouseNews @KlasfeldReports Eric Swalwell pushed for more info on role of VP Pence. About that meeting between Zelensky-Pence meeting on Sept. 1 in Poland.
Pence did not bring up the Bidens or investigations at that meeting, Williams says.

Swalwell puts the question into the ether: "Although Pence will do a lot of things for Trump, was he not willing to bring up Bidens/Burisma/investigation because he thought it was wrong?"

Williams, whose public testimony has been both evenly delivered and aligned with private testimony all day thus far, responds that she isn't in position to speculate.

All the more reason Congress should call on the Office of the Vice President for testimony and records.

A moment of levity injected into this day. Vindman is a twin. So is Rep. Joaquin Castro. Castro says it's nice to have a fellow twin in the room, hopes Vindman's brother is nicer to him than his is. Castro's brother "made him grow a beard!" he says.

Rep Jordan asked Vindman about the chronology re: what Vindman heard the July call. Asks why Vindman didn't go straight to Morrison, his superior? Jordan slams Vindman for "talking to the whistleblower, the lawyers, everyone else."

Immediately after Vindman expressed concern and he began performing work functions, Eisenberg circled back to him, Vindman said and "told me not to talk to anyone else."

"Rep. Jordan, I did my job," Vindman says.

There have been a lot of tweets today! Dive into Vindman and Williams hearing coverage with our @CourthouseNews story here:
courthousenews.com/pair-disturbed…
cc: @KlasfeldReports

Rep Jim Jordan expressing outrage that Speaker Pelosi called Trump an imposter recently. He is onto the familiar talking point: claims Dems have been trying to oust Trump since Day 1 etc.

You may not be able to see this but Sciff is sitting up straight as an arrow and barely blinking as Jordan throws out baseless accusations.

Rep Peter Welch: "I heard Jim Jordan's criticism of the process but I didn't hear an answer to the question as to whether it is proper for the POTUS to demand a foreign gov't to investigate a U.S. citizen and political opponent."

Welch's questioning is meant to establish that Ukraine fought, bled, died, to root out corruption under the admin of Viktor Fedorovych Yanukovych.

Welch addresses @realDonaldTrump: "You want to investigate Joe Biden, Hunter Biden? Do it. Do it hard. Do it dirty. Do it the way you do," Welch says. "Do it. Just don't do it by asking a foreign leader to help you in your campaign. That's your job not his."
@CourthouseNews

@realDonaldTrump @CourthouseNews Call-back to his opening remarks, Vindman says he feels confident enough to tell his dad not to worry about his telling the truth here today "because this is America," he says.
"This is the country I have served and defended. Here, rights matter," he says.
Applause in chamber.

@realDonaldTrump @CourthouseNews We are into closing remarks for Vindman and Williams. Nunes first. He says Democrats are feeding Americans "poison" in their undertaking of the impeachment inquiry.

@realDonaldTrump @CourthouseNews Schiff now delivering closing remarks. Says he wants to address some of the evidence presented before we wrap.

@realDonaldTrump @CourthouseNews Not withstanding all the Qs Vindman got on talking to his supervisor, why he went to NSC lawyer. Schiff says to committee: are you aware we asked Mr. Morrison whether he went to NSC lawyer? Are you are that he did?

Schiff: Are you aware, when you say, you had this problem w/Vindman going to a lawyer not a supervisor, Morrison didn't go to superviser either.
In that case, Schiff says, he hopes his colleagues will "give him the same hard time" if such an offense.

Schiff: The only lament I hear from my colleagues - the bid to get the political investigations wasn't successful.
The whistleblower blew the whistle, the whistleblower the president wants to punish.

Schiff: My colleagues say this is OK, it is OK it was a failed effort.
That does not make it any less odious, he says.

Schiff recalling the comment re: Trump "doesn't give a shit about Ukraine."
"The president may not care about it. But we care about our defense and defense of our allies and we darn well care about our Constitution."

We are adjourned for the first half of today.

The #impeachmentinquiry resumes shortly with testimony from former special envoy to Ukraine Kurt Volker and Tim Morrison, the senior Russia official on the National Security Council.
Stay tuned!
@CourthouseNews

@CourthouseNews And we are back. Schiff opens the hearing.

@CourthouseNews Schiff names Giuliani at the top. Going to be typing that name a lot for the next few hours.

"When Biden was considering entering the race, POTUS personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani began a campaign to weaken Biden's candidacy by pushing a campaign to investigate him and his son."

@CourthouseNews The text from Volker to Zel aide Yermak heard 'round the world coming up alot today. Reminder, Volker wrote to Yermak: "Heard from WH, assuming president Z will investigate/get to the bottom of what happened in 2016 we will nail down date for visit to Washington. Good luck!"

@CourthouseNews More repetition in the opening remarks ahead of Volker/Morrison testimony. This repetition from Nunes who calls proceedings a "circus."
"Impeachment is the jurisdiction of the judiciary committee, not the intelligence committee," Nunes says.

That's true, House Judiciary does have jurisdiction over impeachment in the final phase of this inquiry. But per the House resolution that was authorized almost a month ago now, the rules are clear: House Intel investigates, when the time comes, House Judiciary called in

By the way, during the break, I roamed the halls and bumped into Matt Gaetz.
Almost one month ago, Gaetz led a group of House Freedom Caucus Republicans to storm the SCIF where private depositions were unfolding in a secure room.

At the time, Gaetz fiercely proclaimed to a cluster of reporters staking out the closed hearing that the proceedings were little more than the work of chairman Adam Schiff’s “kangaroo court.”
But on Tuesday, Gaetz’s intensity was dialed down w/o a bevy of cameras present.

He quickly hurried to his office tucked some seven floors away from where the inquiry is unfolding and would not answer questions about the legitimacy of Wednesday’s proceedings or the resolution that authorized them.

But when it came to attacks by fellow Republicans launched on Vindman’s credibility during Wednesday’s hearing, Gaetz’s said the assertion was a conflation.

“I don’t think its proper to conflate the testimony, beliefs or politics of one veteran to every single veteran. I represent more active duty military than any member of Congress and the most important accountability is to my constituents in uniform,” Gaetz said.

"They have diverse views," he said.
Gaetz fielded a question fom Perry O’Brien, a veteran of the Afghan War and organizer for Common Defense.
O’Brien said he came to the hearing Wednesday seeking accountability.

“I would like to see Trump held accountable for his crimes and I would like to see the highest office in the land restored to a position of honor,” O’Brien told me.
For his part, Gaetz said he believes the president will eventually be vindicated.

“The facts will show he did not commit bribery,” Gaetz said.
When asked if he was “100 percent sure” no bribery occurred, Gaetz did not say no but instead pointed to questioning on the committee from Republican Representative John Ratcliffe of Kentucky.

"John Ratcliffe went through the transcripts. There wasn’t even a reference to bribery,” he said.
The inquiry itself is an affront to democracy, Gaetz said.

“I think democracy is a pretty sacred value and the president won the election and he gets to continue to serve out his term and these efforts at grandstanding are a threat to that,” Gaetz added.

As the heavy wooden door to the lawmaker’s office clanged shut, Gaetz ignored a question shouted to him about whether he believed Vindman, a veteran, had his reputation besmirched Wednesday.

O’Brien said the reaction was “typical” to some who defend Trump “no matter where the facts lead.”

“Even if it means attacking someone with honorable service like Lieutenant Colonel Vindman. It’s really disgraceful and shows why so many veterans like myself have lost faith in those who claim to represent them,” O’Brien said.

Tim Morrison says in his opening statement that he does not know who the whistleblower is nor will he speculate as to who it may be.
He adds he did not appear to question the character or integrity of his NSC colleagues.

Tim Morrison "I continue to believe Ukraine is on the front lines of a strategic competition between the West and Vladimir Putin's revanchist Russia."

In his opening remarks, former special envoy to Ukr., Kurt Volker said at no time was he aware or knowingly took part in effort to urge Ukraine to investigate Biden.

Volker was also not on the call between Trump and Zelensky on July 25.

He wasn't made aware of any references to it until the rough call transcript was released.

Volker providing background: when he came to State in 2017, he said there were "major complicated questions swirling in the public debate" about the direction of US policy toward Ukr. Qs over sanctions etc. He wondered if "some kind of grand bargain" w/Russia may be on table

Would there be a trade in recognition of Russia's seizure of Ukr. territory for some other deal in Syria or elsewhere, Volker wondered.

Would it turn into another frozen conflict?
There were several diplomatic vacancies in key roles, meaning "no one was really representing the U.S. in the negotiating process about ending the war in eastern Ukr."

As the most senior U.S. official assigned to work on Ukraine, he knew he had to step forward and provide leadership.
"If anyone needed to speak out publicly, I would do it," he said.
Volker was eager to be transparent.

But when he learned in May 2019 that there was a "significant problem" impeding the U.S. ability to strengthen support for Ukr. new president in his effort to ramp up Ukr. anti-corruption fight, he was faced with a choice. Ignore it or accept it was his responsibility and fix it

The word sent back from Ukr. after Zel inaug was very positive. It struck Volker because it was very different from the "negative narrative" about Ukr. and Zel. that was being fueled by Rudy Giuliani, the president's attorney.

Volker recounting how Trump was skeptical about inviting Zel. to the WH. Trump said Ukraine was a "corrupt country, full of terrible people" who "tried to take me down."
Trump would eventually sign the congratulatory letter to Zel, but it was 4 wks before a date was nailed down

Volker told the Ukrainians it was a scheduling issue that caused the delay in setting up a date for the meeting after several wks passed. But finally, Volker decided to tell Zel. they had a "problem with information reaching President Trump from Mayor Giuliani."

This conversation occured on July 2 during a bilateral mtg at a conference on Ukr. economic reform in Toronto.
(Note, VP pence aide Williams said she first learned of the delay in aid July 3, FWIW)

At the meeting with Zel, Volker suggested he call Trump directly to renew their personal relationship and to assure Trump that he was committed to investigating and fighting corruption.

Zel's aide approached Volker a couple days later and asked to talk to Giuliani directly. Volker agreed to make the connection because he believed it would help toward shifting bad perspective on Ukr. from WH.

Volker urged Zel's people to understand: Giuliani is a private citizen, POTUS personal lawyer and not representing the U.S. government.

Volker: "Likewise, in my conversations w/Giuliani, I never considered him to be speaking on the President's behalf or giving instructions. Rather the information flow was the other way - from Ukr. to Giuliani, in the hopes this would clear up the infor reaching President Trump."

On July 10, after hearing from Zel aide Yermak, Volker writes to Giuliani seeking a meeting. They finally met on July 19. At the meeting, Volker told Giuliani Ukr. prosecutor gen. Lutsenko wasn't credible and was "self-serving"

Volker said "to his surprise" Giuliani agreed and mentioned the accusations about Joe Biden, the interference in the '16 election and "stressed that all he wanted was for Ukr. to investigate what happened in the past and apply in its own laws."

Volker emphasized that no one in "new team governing Ukraine" had anything to do with what happened in 2016.
"I also said that it is not credible to me that former VP Biden would have been influenced in any way by financial or personal motivesin carrying out his duties as VP."

After the meeting, Volker connects with Giuliani and Yermak by text. They meet in person on Aug 2. Giuliani stresed need for Ukr. to investigate what happened in '16.
We'll get more into the timeline as we go. Now we are into 45 minute rounds starting w/Schiff.

Schiff asking about Ukr. prosec. general Yuriy Lutsenko. Why is it that Volker didn't find him credible and told Giuliani as much?
Before getting into that, Volker dismisses allegations by Lutsenko that smeared Amb. Yovanovitch

The smears against Yova. had zero credibility. Lutsenko was interested in preserving his own position and wanted to avoid being prosecuted himself, Volker says.

Volker also said allegations against Joe Biden were not credible to him.

For Volker, at first he didn't "thread the needle" on discussions about corruption in Ukr. being tied to Biden and Burisma, but he would later come to understand that is what it meant.

"What are the chances that in that call [Trump] didn’t say, ‘Oh, and by the way, I canceled military aide to Ukraine,” Tim Kaine asked, speaking to Courthouse News in a lengthy interview by @KlasfeldReports today.
STORY:
courthousenews.com/tim-kaine-has-…

@KlasfeldReports Dem counsel asks Morrison if Trump rec'd talking points for the July 25 call. Morrisons affirms he did receive. They were based on U.S. policy objectives.

Morrison was also listening on the call. He was disappointed with what he heard, he says. He wanted more "full throated" support from US for Zelensky, who had run on an anti-corruption platform.

Goldman referring to the excerpt from summary of the July 25 call released from WH.
Goldman: The references to Crowdstrike, the server, the 2016 election, to Biden and son, were they included in POTUS talking points?"
Morrison: "They were not."

Volker, who was not on the call, said he was "surprised and troubled" by the call record and said that after reading it, it was clear to him that the Biden, Burisma and 2016 election Trump discussed on call were designed to serve POTUS political interests, not natl interest

Volker says "I don't recall that language from my testimony. Was it in my testimony?"
Dem counsel Goldman w/o missing a beat: "Yes, it was."

We're reviewing texts between Sondland, Volker, Yermak et al where the draft announcement sought by Giuliani from Zel is being discussed.

Did Volker find these reqs unusual? Volker, essentially: Trump had his doubts about Ukr., he believed the announcement would be helpful to improving perception.
Now, Volker backtracking, says he wouldn't view the announcement as a condition. This prompted giggles in chamber.

Morrison saw Sondland and Zel adviser Yermak have a sideline meeting - Sondland told him that the Ukr. would have to have Ukr. prosec general make stmt about investigations as a condition for having the aid delivered.

Morrison was uncomfortable with this. He reached out to Bolton to discuss after the fact. That's when Bolton said: "tell the lawyers."

DEVELOPING via @KlasfeldReports and myself.
courthousenews.com/trump-given-no…
#ImpeachmentInquiry

@KlasfeldReports Volker recalls Tim Morrison asking what role Sondland played. Volker said he found it "helpful" that Sondland had the "political contacts" that he did. "If Sondland could use to support the same goals, then indeed that is helpful," Volker said.

@KlasfeldReports Dem questioning has concluded, Nunes takes opener to ask if President ever asked either man to commit bribery or extort Ukraine, they say no.

@KlasfeldReports GOP counsel Steve Castor is leading questions.

@KlasfeldReports Has America's policy toward Ukr. been strengthened during Trumps tenure? Is it fair to say that is in part due to Pres. Trump? Volker agrees, in part. The defense given in last year are part of that, he notes.

@KlasfeldReports Castor asks about the aid delay. Did that strike Volker as uncommon?
Volker says no, he has seen it happened in the past.

@KlasfeldReports Once the aid was lifted, did Volker feel Ukr.-US relations were strong? "Yes, yes," he says. Agrees with Castor characterization that the meeting on sidelines between Trump and Zel at UNGA in NY was positive.

@KlasfeldReports Castor asks if Trump had negative view of Ukr. for a long time before all of this. Volker says Trump did.
It was Volker's role in Ukr. that helped sway those perspectives, Volker acknowledged. He helped Trump understand Zel. was, as Castor described, "indeed, a good person."

@KlasfeldReports Volker confirms he knew exactly what Trump meant when commenting that Ukr. was trying to "take him down."
To the best of knowledge, did POTUS genuinely believe that? Castor asks. Volker hedges, then, I believe he was concerned about it, I dont know if he genuinely believed it.

@KlasfeldReports I'm going to back off live-tweeting for a few minutes as I work on updating our story. Live link to hearing available here: c-span.org/video/?466377-…

@KlasfeldReports Morrison says he wanted access to the transcript to be restricted. When he learned that it was stored on SCIF, he says it was "represented to them that it was a mistake."

"We were in the process of pulling Bolton and POTUS materials for a planned bilateral mtg between POTUS and Zel" Morrison says. When he went to do that, he couldn't pull up the readout. He asked NSC staff & in their research they said it was pulled by Eisenberg.

Morrison asked why. Eisenberg relayed it the event as the result of"administrative error."

Morrison says he was disappointed by the call, but not because it alarmed him. He was seeking that "full throated" support of anti-corruption efforts in Ukr. and felt the call didn't achieve that.

During depo, Castor asked Morrison if he believed Vindman leaked information.
Morrison: "Others represented that, yes."
Morrison also said Vindman did not "keep him in the loop" at times, despite being his supervisor.

Did Vindman ever become frustrated that he felt cut out of Ukr. portfolio?
Morrison: Yes.
Nature of his concerns?
"The easiest way to say it is he was concerned about Ukr. trip he didn't go on. Concerned about 1-1 matters with Taylor and certain other matters," Morrison says.

Castor asks Volker about the irregular channel described by Bill Taylor (re: Giuliani foreign policy reach in Ukr). Did Taylor ever engage with him and share concerns in a telephone conversation? Volker says no.
Says Taylor never hinted there was a problem

We are on a 10 minute break.

And we are back. The number of public spectators has shrunk considerably, but as for the rest of us in the chamber (And in the press rooms dotting Capitol Hill) we're still going strong. We have a 15 minute round that begins with Dem counsel Goldman.

Volker: The readout he got from July 25 call, it was a good phone call, Zelensky reiterated his commitment to corruption. Volker said the readout was exactly as he expected it to go.
That July 25 text - that "get to the bottom of what happened in 2016" text though...

Dem counsel Goldman notes how corruption wasn't mentioned in that text though, not by name. All that was mentioned was the 2016 election.

Goldman to Volker: You understood "the investigations" were Burisma and the 2016 election?
Volker: Yes, because in theory they were looking into Ukrainians.

But in his testimony today, he admits in retrospect, the purpose for Giuliani and Trump to want the investigation is for political benefits or getting info on Biden.
"It's correct that I learned that," but that came much later, after release of transcript, he says.

Then he says he didn't know about Giuliani until later.
Goldman: You knew Sondland was involved back on July 10? Volker agrees but Biden wasn't mentioned then.
Goldman: But when we're referencing Burisma in this context, you understand it means to include Biden?
Volker: Yes.

Morrison says he decided to keep track of what Sondland was doing, though didn't always act on what he discovered. Now, carefully, Morrison affirms, he did not endorse the idea of Zelensky making an announcement about investigations

Nunes asks if Schiff is going to ask for an additional 15 minutes, accuses Schiff of "magically" creating rules for testimony. Schiff tells him it isn't magical, it's part of the rules authorized in resolution for inquiry.
Nunes then calls the proceedings a "drug deal"

In a deleted version of the above tweet, I mistakenly referenced the drug deal quote to Schiff. It was not Schiff. it was Devin Nunes.

We are going into 5 minute rounds. Schiff asks about the July 10 meeting between Bolton and Alex Danykuk. Sondland made a generic comment about investigations, all thought inappropriate. Convo didn't continue, meeting concluded.

We asked about that meeting, you said "nothing about this," Schiff says. Asks why didn't he tell us about this?
Volker says that is what he remembered during the testimony but after hearing Vindman's statement, it jogged his memory.

Schiff, so for 6-7 hours when we asked you about the investigations, you didn't remember Sondland bringing up? The mtg where Bolton called an end to it by labeling it some drug deal that Sondland and Mulvaney cooked up?
Volker says he doesnt recall an abrupt end to the meeting.

It was essentially over, Volker says.

You now understand you should have seen it otherwise. If you thought it was appropriate, why are you saying today it was inappropriate.
It was not the place or time to bring up that, Volker says.

It was the first time meeting between US-Ukr after Zel election, Volker adds.
Schiff: Was it also inappropriate because they were trying to get the WH meeting?
Volker: Possibly.

Schiff asks if Morrison thinks it would have been appropriate for Trump to ask for investigations into Pelosi, John Kasich or even Volker. What about Biden?
Morrison hedges, says in regard to them, no.
Schiff: But not Biden?

"I can only speak to what I understood at the time," Morrison says.

Rep Turner asks Volker if Ukrainians ever told him they understood they wouldn't get a meeting, phone call or aid unless they acquiesced with Trump request for investigations. Volker said no.

The problem w/that, however, is that Ukraine didn't know the aid was delayed until September, according to multiple witnesses testimony. Seems unlikely Ukraine would say they know the meetings are conditioned on aid if they didnt know the aid was delayed. Pence aide knew July 3

Two earlier tweets linking to a story that had not yet been updated were deleted. Will share the updated story after technical issues cease.

Link fixed, story here and developing:

https://twitter.com/CourthouseNews/status/1196939373989617665

Hearings began at 9AM ET. It is now 7:30PM ET. And the ushers just brought in a new small wave of public spectators. Wow.

Rep Hurd asks Volker if he has "clear understanding" of what Sondland and Giuliani were doing in all of their interactions. Volker, I can't say I had a clear understanding, I thought Sondland and I were working on getting a mtg between Zel. and Trump. (related to broader things)

Rep Castro is up for questioning.
When Morrison met Sondland for first time, Morrison understood Sondland's mandate from POTUS was to "go make deals," according to his own earlier testimony.

Morrison also confirmed through Castro Qs - anytime Morrison checked to see if Sondland had visited with Trump when he said he would be doing so - Sondland had in fact held that meeting with POTUS.

Important point from Rep Denny Heck: DoD certified aid to Ukraine in *March* because it believed Ukr. had fulfilled its efforts to beat corruption.

Then Heck, coyly, says to Volker - does he know what one of the first anti corruption laws passed in Ukraine after Zelensky was elected was? Drumroll on the irony here folks - - it was a measure for impeaching Ukraine's president if necessary.

UPDATED - courthousenews.com/trump-given-no…

Several hours later- closing remarks now being delivered by Nunes. Schiff will close out the day.

Nunes says Dems are "pinning their hopes" on bribery. Claims Dems leveraged secrecy of House Intel committee to hold its "preview" to the main event of impeachment inquiry. Media collusion claims, etc. etc.

Nunes calls this a "salacious spy comedy."

Now onto Schiff.

Schiff thanks Volker for amending his earlier testimony to reflect that, in retrospect, Volker should have seen connection of Biden to Burisma investigations requests.

Schiff: You've been asked to opine on term of bribery but not asked to opine on meaning of terms of high crimes and misdemeanors.
Again, Schiff defines bribery for the viewing public. He did this earlier today as well.

“Bribery involves an official act in exchange for something of value," Schiff repeats.
Says that something of value could be the WH meeting or military aid, again.
Says GOP objecting only because he got caught, Schiff voice booming as he speaks

Why should Americans care about this, why should we care about Ukraine, Schiff asks.
Well, Schiff says the proof is in the pudding. Look to the conversation Sondland had w/David Holmes in which Sondland told Holmes Trump didn't "give a shit" about Ukraine.

"He cares about the big things," Sondland told Holmes. To which Holmes pointed out that Ukraine was at war with Russia and that's a "big thing."
Sondland corrected Holmes, saying Trump cares about big things that impact Trump's personal interests.

And with that very long day of testimony in the books, live-tweeting has concluded. Back it tomorrow with the hotly anticipated testimony from Gordon Sondland. We will also hear from Laura Cooper and David Hale.
@CourthouseNews