Thread by @MeaganFrancis

Recently my #podcast co-host and I broke ties mid-campaign with a #sponsor - the first time in 400+ episodes that we've done this. I'm sharing that story in this thread about #podcastads, with two goals in mind.

The first goal is to help #podcast listeners think more critically about the ads they're hearing, particularly in sensitive and high-stakes topic areas like #health and #wellness, #finance and #money, and #relationships .

My other goal is to empower #podcasters to advocate for themselves (and ultimately their listeners) in these sponsor-content creator relationships.

So, credentials: I've been #podcasting for about 8 years, & working with sponsors for nearly 6. I have been co-hosting @TheMomHour with my friend and business partner Sarah Powers since spring of 2015. We've published over 400 episodes + have been downloaded over 7m times.

Sarah and I also co-own @LifeListened, a podcast production studio and creative agency focusing on brand/audio content partnerships. Over the years we've worked with hundreds of brand partners and have produced close to 1000 ad spots and brand integrations.

All that to say - while we're a small operation and still learning every day, as #indie #podcasters and #agencies go, we have been around the block a few times.

And this month, *for the the first time ever, we decided to break ties with a #podcast #sponsor mid-campaign. This wasn't an easy decision, and there were ramifications to our business which I'll describe a little later.

To set the stage: Sarah and I are normally fairly picky when it comes to the kinds of #ads we'll run. It's not uncommon for us to turn down potential #sponsors when we aren't enthusiastic about the product or service, or simply don't think our listeners will respond well to it.

After all, ideally a #podcast #advertising campaign should be a win-win-win: the advertiser gets more attention and sales, the #contentcreator makes money, and - most importantly - the listeners get introduced to products they really need or love.

Since we operate on the premise that we won't promote a product or service we don't actually think our audience will love, we can honestly say what we think + inspire our listeners to check out the sponsor, knowing many will love it. Win, win, win.

Over the past year or so, though, we've seen a few changes happening in the #podcast #advertising landscape that threaten to mess up the above formula:

First, we have seen an uptick in the quality of 'personal experience' that #podcast #advertisers expect us to include in our ad reads - a level that often now borders on #spokesperson work, which is a different thing altogether.

Second, we sometimes aren't given enough time to try the product or service adequately before the campaign launches. That's where things get really hairy, and that's what led to us withdrawing from this particular #podcast sponsor mid-campaign.

It went like this: one of our #podcast ad agencies pitched us to the brand in mid-December. They committed with a signed contract on December 29 for a series of three #ads, the first of which ran on January 1.

Since getting started would require me to go over all the education, download the app, and go shopping for food before I could start - all in the middle of winter break - it was pretty much impossible for me to actually start the program before we ran the first #podcast ad.

So the first script centered around the talking points the brand provided, and mentioned how excited I was to get started with the program. Which was true - and I figured that by the time we recorded the second in the series, I'd be well on my way and loving the program.

As it turns out, I did not love the program for many reasons, and did not feel that what was offered had been accurately described in the materials we had access to. Plus, it was just a bad fit for my lifestyle and the health/food philosophy we share with our listeners.

It would have taken a significant amount of my time and energy to complete the program, and in the end I didn't feel confident it would something I could authentically share with listeners or encourage them to buy...so we cancelled the second and third ads in a three-ad buy.

By the time Sarah and I realized the #advertiser was not a good fit, I'd already sunk hours of time into getting set up, and together we'd already scripted, recorded, produced, and run an ad - at cost to our business plus the opportunity cost of having given up ad space.

And...when we cancelled the remaining two ads, our agency informed us that pulling out of the remaining two ads was a breach of the entire contract - so we won't be paid at all, including for the one ad we did run, which by this point has reached over 16,000 listeners.

Now, here's the thing. We knew when we cancelled the #ad #campaign there was a good chance we would miss out on the revenue from the delivered spot, not to mention eating the opportunity cost of having given that spot up and the time we put into researching and producing the ad.

Yes, it does feel super shady that a sponsor essentially gets a free ad because we did the right thing and didn't run ads we didn't feel good about, but we signed the contract, and we accepted the consequences.

And we're an established #podcast and can afford to take that hit.

But what about the newer, less-established #podcasters who wouldn't be able to afford to cancel? Or who don't know they even have the right to push back on bad contracts, or pull out of deals they don't feel good about?

And, hey, what does this all mean for us #podcast listeners? How many ads have I heard that are based on the company's messaging and passed off as genuine endorsements but are really just content creators "doing what they have to do" to meet their contractual obligations?

There are three big lessons I've taken away from this experience that I hope will be valuable to both #podcasters and listeners:

1) Podcasters, Advertisers and Agencies: We need to have a better understanding of the differences between #advertising, #endorsement, and #spokesperson work. They are not all the same. Buying air time is not the same as buying a specific, trusted host's voiced recommendations.

(I'm guessing some old-school #radio folk can help us out here.) The lowball CPM model isn't valuing the trust and authenticity a great host brings to the table. Don't undersell that.

2) On that note: #podcasters (and the #agencies who represent us) need to be increasingly willing to push back on unrealistic contract terms and timelines.

Those unreasonable timelines put content creators in a position of EITHER delivering sponsored segments they don't feel great about, or getting screwed over if they make the very reasonable decision not to follow through when a product isn't what they thought it would be.

3) #Podcast listeners: we need to keep a healthy dose of skepticism and push back when we think our favorite hosts are venturing into shaky ground.

I do believe an #advertising -based #podcast revenue model can still be upheld with integrity. I just think it's going to take us all keeping ourselves honest. But hey, this is podcasting. If we don't have honesty, what have we got?

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