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#DisclosuresTribunal Should be noted, Paul Reynolds said that he called McCabe the night before his O'Higgins reports and left a message.
#DisclosuresTribunal Stephen Rae, outgoing Group Editor of INM, has started to give evidence
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae has gone through his career. Patrick Marrinan SC, for tribunal, is taking Rae through his evidence.
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae says he doesn't know Dave Taylor and he's never met him. Says Taylor tried to contact him for help about his thesis but Rae didn't respond to him.
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae says first he heard of Ms D allegation was when Paul Williams was interviewing Ms D and writing his story. Asked if he had any inkling there was a Ms D or someone like that in McCabe's past? Rae: Absolutely not.
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae says, at the outset, all he knew is that D family wanted to tell us their side of the story.
#DisclosuresTribunal After PW interviewed Ms D, Rae said he was told Paul Williams and a videographer travelled to Ms D house and interviewed her and there was a video.
#DisclosuresTribunal Marr: This potentially was a big story? Rae: Potentially, yes. Marr: Was it being presented on basis she was making allegs of sex assault going back to when she was a child..or purely those allegs weren't properly investigated? Rae: Plainly it was both
#DisclosuresTribunal Marrinan: We know that Ian Mallon and Claire Grady also involved in process before publication/watching video, etc, along with Fionnuala O'Leary and Dearbhail McDonald. Rae confirms there were at least six meetings about PW articles
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae said there was a sense that 'this was too good to be true'. He said they had to ask 'why now?', 'why us?'. Marrinan tells the tribunal that Claire Grady, in statement to tribunal, said she was suspicious that the story may have emanated from the gardai
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae says it never occurred to him that the story would have come from gardai. But he says Grady was right to be suspicious. He points out the D family contacted Paul Williams directly.
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae denies claim INM would have been negative of Sgt McCabe. Rae says 98% of all coverage across INM titles and online would be positive of Sgt McCabe
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae says he's never heard of any INM journalist being pushed a line about McCabe by Supt Dave Taylor.
#DisclosuresTribunal Michael McDowell SC, for Sgt McCabe, has no questions for Rae. Mark Harty SC, for Gemma O'Doherty, is now asking Rae questions
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty asking Rae about his time working at the monthly magazine Garda Review.
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae describes GR as a "kind of current affairs magazine for law enforcement in Ireland". Rae moved to Herald, as security correspondent, in 1994.
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty suggests time at GR would have assisted his work in Herald. Rae: I would have had sources within the police...corruption in the police was something I reported on.
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty recalls evidence of Gemma O'Doherty when she said Fr Niall Molloy's garda file was given to INM. Asked if this is the case, Rae: I'm not going to say. Judge says there had been an inquest, there were multiple files copied, many people may have had it
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty asks about INM being found in contempt in relation to Anglo Tapes. Rae: Not first time round but the second time round, yes.
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty: Do you recall the incident which involved Gemma O'Doherty in April 2013, in which she went to house of Martin Callinan (to check his address in relation to a story on his pen points being wiped). Rae: I recall the incident
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae: I was told the following morning that she had gone to the house at 10pm the previous evening. Rae said Michael Denieffe told him this. Harty: The hour keeps moving later and later..her evidence is that it was early in the evening..
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae: I got a memo from Tom Brady...he had taken a call from someone in the police force at 10.15pm...Officer said that Gemma had been at house 15 mins earlier.
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae says manner in which OD went to Call's house "wasn't proper and it wasn't the professional way to do thing" Asked if he was involved in Denieffe and INM member meeting with Asst Comm John Twomey after OD called to Call house. Rae: I don't think so
#DisclosuresTribunal [WILL COME BACK TO RAE EVIDENCE. Paul Reynolds is back in witness box]
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader has returned to Reynolds' pages of notes of May 2016. One note: "Call to Maurice McCabe 8/5/16. 9.55pm. Call, no reply, left a message, told him doing report, tomorrow. If he'd like to call me back good" - this is re: O'Higgins reports on May 9, 2016
#DisclosuresTribunal Another note refers to Ms D investigation which says: "Initial complaint" Mentions 2 gardai "working in same station" and "boss down the corridor asked to investigate it".
#DisclosuresTribunal Asked about this: I don't know where it came from, could have come from a conversation but I couldn't put a time on it.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader ask was this relevant to O'Higgins ahead of his broadcasts on O'Higgins. PR: No, and it wasn't used in the reports either. Leader:
So what relevance does it have? PR: It has no relevance.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader suggests whoever he was talking to was pointing him to the D allegation. PR disagrees. Also says: I don't think that illustrates any revenge or illustrates anything in the terms of reference (of tribunal ).
#DisclosuresTribunal PR says the discussion was more about the investigation being carried out by a local garda instead of someone from outside. Leader: Why did you think you were being told about that [Ms D]?
#DisclosuresTribunal PR: I didn't think about that. Leader: You're a journalist. PR: I already knew, at that stage, there was no prosecution. Leader: That's the point - why were you being told about it? Did you ever ask yourself that? PR: No.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader outlines the allegation was brought back to him several years after he heard the DPP's directions. PR says he was never suspicious. PR says journalists are news gatherers, they take in all kinds of information
#DisclosuresTribunal PR repeats his analogy from this morning about how journalists write everything down when at a court case
#DisclosuresTribunal PR is asked why he chose to report on certain chapters of the O'H report. PR: I think the only one I left out was the Pulse chapter. He said it was complicated and within the time he had, he thought it could have been dealt with by a standalone report.
#DisclosuresTribunal PR says he regrets he didn't because Irish Times subsequently did that and got good headlines out of it.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader puts to PR that, from his notes, it would seem that material DID creep into his notes to the effect that the Ms D matter did seem to be the matter that started of all of this (McCabe's complaints). Leader suggests this goes along with Taylor's claim.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader also goes to Maurice McCabe's protected disclosures in which he said he was satisfied "on impeccable authority" that PR's reports on RTE on May 9, 2016 were planned and orchestrated by NOS personally using brieffing material prepared at Garda HQ
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader says McCabe says he was told by John Barrett that the reports came from "block one" in Garda HQ which is a reference to the Commissioner's block in Garda HQ. Leader says Barrett says he never said this.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader reminds PR of the term of reference of tribunal. Leader: For some reason the Ms D matter comes into your notes...while you were preparing your broadcasts...PR: There's no reference to them in the broadcasts..
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader: They're in your notes. PR: There's a reference to the facts surrounding that allegation...they are I don't necessarily see facts as a negative briefing. In fact I don't..ppl were telling me what the facts were surrounding the issue.
#DisclosuresTribunal PR accepts that someone brought the facts to his attention but he says he doesn't think anybody deliberately brought them to his attention. He says MS D matter came to him in course of a conversation about issues re: policing in Baileboro
#DisclosuresTribunal PR says the notes didn't appear in his broadcasts. PR is asked if Noirin O'Sulivan was his source. PR: No.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader: You came up through the ranks together? PR: Yes
Leader: She was in text contact and phoning you, at least, in Sept 2016, Oct 2016 and Feb 2017. PR: That's all after the publication of these reports.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader: You appreciate we only have certain phones of NOS. Leader adds that texts the tribunal has seen show they were on friendly, personable terms. PR: With all people I tend to have professional but personal relationsihp.
#DisclosuresTribunal Leader: You knew NOS? PR: Of course I knew her, I've interviewed her plenty of times. Leader: In view of all of that..did she use that relationship to influence your reports on May , 2016? PR: No. And I think that's clear.
#DisclosuresTribunal PR: I'm here because 3 people have made false allegations against me...These allegations are on social media..ppl see them and believe them.
#DisclosuresTribunal McDowell is asking PR questions. He's asking him about his report on the O'Mahony in investigation into penalty points in February 2014. McDowell puts it to PR that his report/s put McCabe in an unfavourable light.
#DisclosuresTribunal PR says no, the story was based on fact he had sight of direction McCabe was given in Dec 2012. PR said he wouldn't tell McDowell his source. Asked if there would have been any reason for him to delay with reporting this info. PR says he doesn't think so.
#DisclosuresTribunal Asked if he sought editorial guidance for the Feb 2014 report (like he did for the O'Higgins report): PR says I didn't see it as big a story...I never saw this as a big deal.
#DisclosuresTribunal McD asks again, PR: I don't think so...
#DisclosuresTribunal McD points out the initial report didn't include the actual direction - which was to desist from accessing PULSE. PR: As fas I was conceded that was already well ventilated.
#DisclosuresTribunal McD claims PR only contacted McCabe after the story went up online. PR disagrees with this. Says when he did eventually speak to McCabe, McCabe said he was giving a statement to Prime Time. PR said he found this strange and was puzzled
#DisclosuresTribunal McD has asked PR can he recall who he was speaking to - who mentioned the Ms D matter to him (which was written in his notes in relation to the O'Higgins report )? PR: I'm not going to say.
#DisclosuresTribunal McD says he's not looking for his source, just wants to know if he can recall who said it. PR: I'm not getting into any conversation about any source I was talking to.
#DisclosuresTribunal PR: I'm afraid I'll have to take it to my grave, Mr McDowell...I can't help you, Mr McDowell.
#DisclosuresTribunal PR: I never got the sense from these people that they were pouring poison in my ear against McCabe. I mean this obviously was something that happened in was an incident that happened..
#DisclosuresTribunal PR: Nobody was consistently and deliberately hammering away at me, giving me neg stuff about McC. This came up & we moved on. I'm jotting down notes..taking everything down..not relevant..didn't use it..notes are stream of consciousness..nothing hangs on it.
#DisclosuresTribunal One of PR's notes says "described this as poisoning and attempted murder" - this is in relation to one of the complaints made by McCabe in relation to how gardai handled an incident in takeaway where urine was put in vinegar bottle.
#DisclosuresTribunal PR says he doesn't think somebody told him this info expecting him to go on television and say McCabe alleged the incident was attempted murder. PR: I've come to the tribunal with my palms up...these are just thoughts, notes...
#DisclosuresTribunal PR: I can't stand over accuracy or provenance of these notes...these were not supposed to be poured over by a team of highly intelligent and well trained lawyers.
#DisclosuresTribunal McD asks PR about the note which refers to Ms D investigation and says: "Initial complaint" Mentions 2 gardai "working in same station" and "boss down the corridor asked to investigate it".
#DisclosuresTribunal PR claims that this was about the investigation being handled locally - not about the investigation itself. McD in ref to the "boss down the corridor" tells PR that that is something he couldn't have thought up himself.
#DisclosuresTribunal McD tells him it's incorrect as Ins Noel Cunningham (who investigated the Ms D allegation) wasn't "down the corridor", he was in another station. PR says "down the corridor" is a turn of phrase.
#DisclosuresTribunal McD: Somebody was suggesting to you that that was an error or improper aspect of the investigation. PR: There was no criticism of the investigation, nothing negative about Sgt McCabe, it was about the fact the investigation shouldn't have been handled locally
#DisclosuresTribunal McD asks how the Ms D matter/invsetigation was relevant to O'Higgins. PR: It was relevant to policing in Baileboro. McD: But it wasn't relevant to the O'Higgins Commission of Investigation? PR: Well I didn't put it my reports
#DisclosuresTribunal Judge steps in to say that what McDowell is suggesting is that this claim may feed into narrative that this could have made McCabe more embittered. PR: That's a big jump, I never got that impression.
#DisclosuresTribunal MCD asks if the mention of Ms D in the April note (attached) and Ms D in the May note (see pevious tweet) could have been given to him by the same person. PR: It could have been a variety of people.
#DisclosuresTribunal MCD says, as PR says it could have been a "variety" of people, it's possible then that the chairman should conclude that more than one person mentiond the D matter to him. PR: The chairman should not conclude anything on the basis of these notes.
#DisclosuresTribunal PR did confirm to McD that the notes are contemporaneous
#DisclosuresTribunal PR says he doesn't think the notes are evidence of anything and that one can only speculate about them. PR: I do not now, and did not then, see these notes [of conversations, thoughts, etc] as casting aspersions on Sgt McCabe.
#DisclosuresTribunal Noel Whelan, for gardai, has asked - given John Barrett is claiming he never told McCabe that Paul Reynolds's reports on O'Higgins came from Block 1 [Garda Commissioner's office] - if Sgt McCabe is maintaining that allegation
#DisclosuresTribunal McDowell has told the tribunal that he will take instructions overnight - he was depending on Mr Barrett in this respect. Judge: And you know of his updated statement? McDowell: He can only go on what he was told.
#DisclosuresTribunal McDowell says that it may be the case that Sgt McCabe may instruct that the allegation can only be sustained on basis of Mr Barrett
#DisclosuresTribunal [NOTE: The tribunal previously when Noirin O'Sullivan gave evidence that Mr Barrett has told the tribunal that the didn't tell McCabe this. See mention of this here:…
#DisclosuresTribunal [GOING BACK TO STEPHEN RAE's evidence....He had been saying Gemma O'Doherty's calling to Callinan's house was "improper" and "unprofessional".
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae said, from a management point of view, someone in INM should have been told she was calling to Callinan's house. Rae repeats he was told Call's wife was distressed. Rae: "Someone should have known, in the building, she was going to house late at night"
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty points out the points were related to Callinan's personal car. Rae: You don't arrive at a house at 10pm whether you're a Garda Commissioner, Mr Soap or Mrs Soap. Says there's a hierarchical structure in the papers for a reason.
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty: The situation is though she she was simply checking the address. Rae: Yeah but it was at 10pm. Harty: It wasn't at 10pm. Rae: But all I'm saying is what was in the memo..
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae says he spoke to OD, she apologised for what she'd done, she said she was chasing a hot story and "now that she'd thought about it, she should have done it a different way". Rae: Nobody is saying it was bad story, it was just the way she went about it
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae: Once it was legally checked and it went through the press office [OD evidence is she was told to deal solely with Dave Taylor], we ran it, and we ran it on page one.
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty: Why were two senior editorial members going to meet an uttelry unaffected Asst Comm about this? [This is in reference to the meeting in Harcourt Terrace with Ass Comm John Twomey]
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae: I think it was the whole way this story was handled..we were always going to run the story..they went along as a courtesy as guards viewed it as a security breach.
#disclosuresTribunal Harty: Why were they going cap in hand to Asst Comm to apologise? Rae: It was a courtesy call as they saw it as a security breach. Harty:
So they were summonsed. Rae: Michael Denieffe wouldn't be going cap in hand to anybody
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty says this was a story about the men who was overseeing the penalty points process having penalty points quashed. Rae: That's why we had it on page one
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty: Can you explain why, within two weeks of this story, Gemma O'Doherty was given by her marching orders? Many of us here are lawyers, we know the terms of redundancy, it's usually last in, first out. O'Doherty was there 17 years.
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty: Having been the person who presented you with that scoop two weeks earlier, she was selected for involuntary redundancy. Rae says it was a difficult time for INM costs wise, assets in South Africa had to be sold, etc.
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty: There was only one journalist who had been made involuntarily redundant [Gemma O'Doherty]. Rae: Yes.
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae: O'Doherty was working in features dept, she was travel editor...what was clearly necessary at the time was INM had to pivot all our resources into a central digital hub. Hard decisions had to be made.
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae: Question was - could we keep on slow journalism, features writer and travel editor. Harty queried Rae use of term "slow journalism". Harty: This wasn't a slow journalist, this was an investigative journalist?
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty: She was offered travel writer job on freelance basis but not news? Rae: She could have done news on top of travel writing.
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty: O'Doherty was told she had to go though Supt Dave Taylor on this story (on Martin Callinan's penalty points). Rae said OD was told to go through the normal phases. Rae suggested OD could have gone to Tom Brady, of INM, to confirm Callinan's address
#DisclosuresTribunal Harty asked Rae for the identity of the other INM person who attended the meeting in Harcourt Terrace with Asst Comm John Twomey, Michael Denieffe and Supt Taylor. Rae: I can't recall.
#DisclosuresTribunal Counsel for former editor of Sunday Independent Anne Harris put to Rae that Harris (when she gave evidence) was asked about her relationship with INM. Rae was asked if, after Harris left INM, if he went for lunch with her and if he suggested she work...
#DisclosuresTribunal [cntd]... in a consultancy capacity with INM. Rae confirms this is true. Said he offered her a contract as a mentor to young journalists. Judge asks relevance of this, Harris counsel says it's because she was cross examined by INM on basis she had a grudge
#DisclosuresTribunal Also, INM counsel put to Rae emails OD had with him & others in INM after she called to Callinan's house (these were all put to OD when she gave evidence). INM counsel said there wasn't a "wit of evidence" to suggest OD dismissal had anything to do w/ gardai
#DisclosuresTribunal INM counsel said the contemporaneous emails don't point to a newspaper coming down on OD "like a tonne of bricks". INM counsel points out the article was ultimately published.
#DisclosuresTribunal Rae also told tribunal that, at one point, he was blacklisted by the Garda Press Office, said INM's relationship with gardai has been "adversarial".
#DisclosuresTribunal See this for Gemma O'Doherty's appearance at the tribunal…
#DisclosuresTribunal Tomorrow the tribunal will hear from Claire Grady, formerly of INM, Ray Burke, of RTE, John Barrett, head of HR at An Garda Siochana, Fionnan Sheahan, of INM and Conor O'Callaghan, of Three Ireland.
#DisclosuresTribunal The tribunal won't be sitting next Mon/Tue or Wed. Clare Daly TD and Mick Wallace TD are scheduled to be give evidence next Friday. [Should also be sitting on Thursday]
#DisclosuresTribunal Diarmaid McGuinness SC, for the tribunal, has said there may be additional witnesses. He said the tribunal is just awaiting confirmation and statements from these witnesses.
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