@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv Waikwa is establishing Anand's area of expertise in data, #DigitalID & cybersecurity. This morning the Respondents had tried to challende @iam_anandv credentials
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @waikwawanyoike "why did you say the law should come before technology?" - @iam_anandv "the objectives of tech projects change over time. A tech project can optimize goals which are not aligned with rights"
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv Anand explains that "it is possible to tune and modify the architecture of a system to obey the law. The reserve is not correct" #NIIMS #HudumaNamba
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv The only way to make an informed decision on a #DigitalID project such a #NIIMS is through making the architecture and design publicly available for people to examine and comment on @iam_anandv
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv Waikwa is asking Anand how he knows about the design of #NIIMS. Anand explains that the stated objectives around the #HudumaNamba are the technical goals of the project and these give insight into system architecture and design
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @iam_anandv explains #NIIMS is "centralized but federated system" which means that functional databases (e.g. tax records, health, transport) are linked back to a central database, holding people's personal information including #biometric data, through #HudumaNamba
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv Waikwa asks Anand to explain the relationship between 'deduplication' and a 'multimodel system' - Anand explains that a multimodel system is the process by which to achieve deduplication
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @iam_anandv says it is mathematically impossible to state that a multimodel system such as #NIIMS is deterministic. This means you can't say with certainty that no two people will be issued the same #HudumaNamba and it is possible that a person may be double-registered
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv In a system like #NIIMS , a threshold will be used to determine how likely it is that a #HudumaNamba matches a specific person. But the threshold probability will never be 100%
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @iam_anandv explains that in #Aaadhaar there were people who were enrolled in the system but were not granted access because the system is not deterministic. This problem will also arise in #NIIMS
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv Anand explains the concepts if linkage and harmonization: harmonization is a standard that says what each field in a database should look like. Linkage means that there is a common field that connects databases. In #NIIMS this would be the #HudumaNamba
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv Waikwa asks Anand to explain the difference of Identity and Identification - Anand says identity relates to a person's legal existence. Identification however is a third-party defined process that they use to determine who a person is to them
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @iam_anandv says "Identity is 'who am I'. Identification is 'who are you'" and that #NIIMS is designed as an identification system
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @iam_anandv has five concerns about #NIIMS: 1) purpose-free architecture (#GOK can use the data for anything they want)
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @iam_anandv has five concerns about #NIIMS: 2) system design - (enrollment: the amount of data captured for #HudumaNamba; deduplication)
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @iam_anandv has five concerns about #NIIMS: 5) breaches/fraud and whether other less archaic systems considered
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @iam_anandv is concerned about exclusion in #NIIMS because people may not get access to services they should be legally entitled to
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv #NIIMS & #HudumaNamba hurdles: 1) need an existing ID; 2) bad quality biometrics; 3) people circumventing the system when they aren't registered; 4) mismatch in your info in existing databases when linking them to NIIMS database; 5) updates & lockouts need costly re-enrollment
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv Anand explains that encryption doesn't prevent hacking. When the data from #NIIMS is being used for comparison or deduplication, it has to be decrypted
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv Regarding #surveillance @iam_anandv says that #GOK will have a key to decrypt #NIIMS data anyway, so encryption doesn't help against government surveillance
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv The problem is not with surveillance in the central #NIIMS database. You can get access to all functional databases which contains all information on someone, such as tax, health & transport records - there is no due process @iam_anandv
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv "the best practice has always been to distinguish civil databases from crime databases to avoid fishing expeditions" - #NIIMS interlinks these databases
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv "linkage done without oversight and public consultation is problematic" @iam_anandv
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv Anand explains that #Aadhaar was used to profile voters in #elections. This could also be done with #NIIMS and other linked systems
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv The #NIIMS authentication log would give a detailed record of where anyone has used their #HudumaNamba and could allow profiling
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv The Respondent is objecting arguing that Anand is bringing in new areas not covered in the statement
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua says the Respondent said that ambiguity could be clarified on re-examination and @waikwawanyoike points to the fact that Anand had in fact outlined his list of concerns, which are also in his witness statement
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua The Court finds that there are a few new issues raised on re-examination and is asking the petitioners to link their questions to limit their questions to issues raised on cross. The Respondents can also ask their witnesses about any new issues raised at this point
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Waikwa asks Anand about his concerns on #NIIMS breaches and frauds
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua There are two ways in which frauds happen: 1) high value targets - compromising a person with known info (e.g. calling someone claiming to be a bank giving some info and asking them to reveal more)
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua There are two ways in which frauds happen: 2) fraud at scale - e.g. setting up companies with leaked identities & biometrics (this can happen if there is a breach of the #NIIMS central database or any of the functional databases)
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua With fraud there is a cost/benefit analysis: how hard does the fraudster have to work to get what benefit? If you use just one #HudumaNamba for everything, then the cost of fraud is low and the benefit becomes high because it is all linked through #NIIMS
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua In #Aadhaar most breaches and leaks happened in the functional databases (e.g. tax, health records, transport), so this can happen even if the central database is harder to breach
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Waikwa is questioning Anand on #GOK submissions and understanding of open-source technology projects
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Anand explains that an open-source tech project allows the creators of a system to draw on the knowledge of other experts who can contribute. Everyone can look at the system but people who can contribute to it are limited by peer review
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua An open source project has a much more robust structures because it is not limited to one or two people creating the system @iam_anandv
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Anand explains why he doesn't think #NIIMS will protect against #terrorism or breaches as a closed-sourced system: in an open-source system more people will find loopholes that can be abused by law breakers
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua The Court is asking for clarification on what the loopholes in #NIIMS are that should be pointed out
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Anand says that without having the system architecture and design publicly available, it's not even possible to identify all the loopholes
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua In India @iam_anandv worked with government authorities to fix loopholes in the #Aadhaar system
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua The Court is asking is what the witness is saying that "information about the #NIIMS system should be put out in public so that the public can help the designers fix loopholes" - Anand confirms that this is exactly what he is saying
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Anand states that not just system design information but also management processes should be put to the public #NIIMS #HudumaNamba
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Waikwa is asking Anand about his statement that #NIIMS is an archaic system and what alternatives system designs should have been considered
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Anand says that functional databases which are back-referenced to a central database are problematic. #Austria solved this by not referencing information from the functional databases back to the central database. The databases are siloed.
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Anand explains that #Estonia chose not to use biometrics for identification but uses pin numbers and these are less likely to leak
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua if you roll out a system which has has flaws, a law will not fix it - biometric cloning is very easy and there is a big black market for this in India. Alternative system built together with relevant laws, you have far less risks @iam_anandv
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Anand says that in #Estonia the population database is centralized but this only contains basic civil registration information. Functional databases are not linked back to the central databases and are pin-based
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua #Estonia #DigitalID is not like #NIIMS - the chip in your card containing your biometrics does not link back to a central database and the system is pin-based @iam_anandv
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua Anand says #NIIMS will be a waste of funds because the cost of the inefficiencies to the state and the population will likely be high. He notes that the cost/benefit analysis has not been put out in the public by #GOK
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua "a #DigitalID project is like the digital infrastructure of the country" - @iam_anandv is arguing #GOK has to be more transparent about the #NIIMS design and cost/benefit analysis
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc @waikwawanyoike has concluded his re-examination of Anand
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc @thekhrc counsel asks what the threshold is for a multimodel system to be deterministic. Anand says you would have to collect very high amount of data,e.g. entire body image, & complete biographic history to reach the level of probability that would make the system deterministic
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc Reviewing government submissions, Anand says that #GOK would prefer #NIIMS to be a closed-source system
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc @thekhrc: "is it possible that the government could have disclosed certain aspects of the #NIIMS architecture and design without compromising system security?" - @iam_anandv explains that this would be possible
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc Regarding the form in which #GOK would provide info on #NIIMS, Anand says that it would usually be technical architecture literature in a so-called design document format (this would not disclose each algorithm it would just show openness)
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc "The government could say we will give you enough info to balance your need to know with our need to keep secrets" while still providing info on #NIIMS design @iam_anandv
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc Anand is questioned about #NIIMS hub and spoke model (centralized but federated) and whether it is possible for a person who breaches one functional database to find back-channel to centralized system - this would depend on the protection of the centralized system
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc It is not entirely impossible for someone to breach a central database based on having breached a functional database
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc The Court is asking about the risk re the centralized and federated databases - Anand says that the damage can be very high when there is a breach and that the exposure is higher if functional databases are linked back
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc In a de-centralized non-linked system, the amount of information lost is much less in a breach because one database with information is not linked to another database with information
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc The court is asking how Anand without having looked at the system 1) can draw conclusions that this system is more vulnerable to exclusion; 2) are all these problems related to system design; 3) what would he do to remove the problems he has identified
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc Anand says that he can look at an existing system and see what mistakes have been made and look at the new #NIIMS system in terms of principles and goals and point to similarities that will lead to similar risks
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc "these are systems that affect people's lives and you cannot afford to make failures because failures have impacts. Biometric systems have faults" @iam_anandv
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc The court asks if there is any system that can completely remove the issues Anand highlighted with regards to fraud, mass surveillance or profiling
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc "What you want is an architecture that instead of mass surveillance allows targeted surveillance to happen with judicial oversight" @iam_anandv
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc Anand says that there is no system that is completely immune to fraud or mass surveillance but the impact of the fraud can be limited and the cost of the fraud can be increased
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc @waikwawanyoike wants to ask one more follow-up question
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc "In your view does #NIIMS as designed allow for mass surveillance and if so why?" - "Yes it does. Once you link everything with everything, what prevents a person in the government to go and see it for whatever purpose"
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc Questioning of @iam_anandv has concluded. He has testified in the #NIIMS case one and a half days
@waikwawanyoike @iam_anandv @MarthaKarua @thekhrc The bench rises for the day. Tomorrow witnesses from the Nubian community will be cross-examined #NIIMS #HudumaNamba
