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Ok. Had breakfast and tea, got a kitty curled up on my chest, fighting off a migraine but let's do this! Some comments and replies to what people have been saying about my #CovingtonCatholic thread.
First and foremost: I can only post my POV. I encourage people to watch for themselves and draw their own opinions. I included time stamps to help with that.
Second, I did not hear "Build That Wall" in either of the videos I cited. I heard shouts and chants I couldn't identify, but those could've just as easily been a recipe for chocolate chip cookies for all I know. The vids are inconclusive either way.
Third: I do not support, condone, or excuse the preacher or his group. Any skipping over of what they said was due to brevity and a choice on my part to focus on the interaction with Nathan's group, since that was the moment most in question. I'm sorry it came off otherwise.
I tried to make the preacher's group's offensiveness clear by talking about the slurs towards people on all sides, and how they threatened the skateboarder. My intent was to give the the general idea without giving greater voice to the horrible things they were saying.
So to be clear: the preacher and his group were deeply offensive to everyone. *I* would've had a hard time not getting into an argument with them and I'm a grown ass woman.
To that end, I agree with those who say that if the kids weren't wearing MAGA hats and it was JUST them getting into it with the preacher, many of us on the left would've been on their side. We've seen this with people trolling Fred Phelps's group at ComicCon.
BUT the kids didn't just go after the preacher. They went after Nathan's group as well, and Nathan's group did nothing except walk between the two groups while playing drums and singing.
I dispute the POV that the kids had no way of knowing if Nathan was with the preacher. The kids had been there long enough to see the preacher's group, which was five men standing close together and wearing similar clothing and who insulted the Natives as well.
Likewise I call BS on the claim that Nathan was acting in any threatening manner. The man was walking so slowly even the statue of Lincoln could've gotten out of his way. He stood still when people stood in front of him. As for example, Nick.
I pointed out the preacher's group saying how calm Nathan was as a way to say even these obnoxious assholes have to admit they can't find fault with what Nathan's doing. Of course some of that is that Nathan was helping them, but still. They said he was CALM.
Had Nathan been acting in a threatening manner, I think the preacher's group would've commented on THAT instead. The point isn't that suddenly they liked Nathan's group, but that they were observing what they saw.
As for the guy in Nathan's group who interacted with the kids, as I said, I didn't have the video to watch again. I wanted to be fair and acknowledge that it happened and that, in my opinion, the guy got rude with the kid.
I couldn't remember exact quotes on his part so didn't want to put words in his mouth. I tried to characterize it as best I could. Admittedly I am giving the guy some slack due to how the kid's Pangea comment made my eyes roll so hard it may have caused my migraine. BUT -
- in the end the guy was the adult. I can see how people might argue he should've been the mature one and ignored Kid Pangea. Personally *I* wouldn't have been that mature so I can hardly point fingers.
I also agree that the adults with the kids could've and should've diffused the situation from the start. I pointed out the adults making the kids back up from preacher's group at the end to show how at SOME point the adults finally figured out they should step in.
And as offensive and horrible as the preacher's group was, IMO the adults should've stepped in and redirected the kids right then and there. Instead the kids got riled up and rowdier with time. The teens reaction to the preacher was understandable, but it wasn't peaceful either.
Hence my comparison between the interaction with Nathan's group and the preacher's. Other than the tomahawk chop and the chanting, the interactions were pretty much the same on the kids' part.
If we agree that the kids were showing no respect to the preacher - justified or not - then the kids were likewise showing no respect to Nathan. In their eyes Nathan was equally offensive to the guy who told them they were racist incest babies. All Nathan did was sing and drum.
Purely my own opinion but I feel like these kids would've acted in similar manners in any instance where they were allowed to get riled up and stupid without adult intervention. In other words, this could've just as easily been them at a football game or a party.
BUT they specifically got racially offensive towards Nathan and his group in a way they did not with the preacher. They believed the fact of Nathan and his group being Native American was mock worthy.
They could've ignored Nathan but they didn't. They surrounded him as a group and even ignored the preacher for a time to focus on Nathan in a mocking manner.
I mean c'mon. I highly doubt the kid who yelled "THIS IS SO SWEET!" while watching Nick smirk at Nathan was referring to the beauty of Nick's pacifist attitude and deep religious nature.
Some could be argue that kids this age aren't old enough to know better manners. However, the attitude that being "other" like Nathan is mock-worthy came from somewhere. And shit like this is exactly what chaperones are supposed to shut down.
If these kids don't learn consequences of their actions at this age, when is that gonna kick in? The cynical part of me says apparently never, if the adults around them are any indication. Anyway, hit thread limit for now so will post and then add on later if more comes up.
BTW - if you ask me a question in the replies and I don't respond it's highly likely I didn't see it. I swear this stuff is coming in faster than I can keep track of and Twitter's interface doesn't help. No offense meant if I accidentally ignore you.
.@KaJo503 provided a link to this video: It has some edits but does show the interaction with one of the Natives and the kids that I mentioned (the one where I said the adult got rude but I could sympathize).
Two new items of note within that vid: Nick seems to try to tell the Pangea kid to cut it out. Also a chaperone comes by. Two of the people in the Native group ask her if she's responsible for the kids. The woman dismissively replies she's responsible for herself. 🙄
BTW, if people comment with obvious side agenda in either direction (eg "The Left is the cause of all racial conflict!" or "Religion itself is at fault for the MAGA kids' racism!") I'm not engaging. You're welcome to your opinions and debates, I just don't have the energy for it.
I don't mind replying to those who say I have bias (yes, as we all do) or that I could've phrased things better since, in spite of what my parents tell me, I know I'm not perfect.
That being said, I'm reluctant to spam people's feeds so if I've addressed the same point multiple times I'm less likely to keep saying it. I'm trying to use this thread as a one stop shop for that kind of thing, so hopefully that helps.
Also my head is feeling a bit better now, thanks to those of you who asked =)
Shout out to @wickediamond for this, it's brief footage of MAGA kids shouting "MAGA" and "BUILD THE WALL." It's not on the steps where the incident with Nathan took place, but maybe this is where the reports of the build the wall chant came from? instagram.com/p/Bs4lW0Og9kf
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