Thread by @shayshinecastle

OK I'm going to start a new thread for open comment since I anticipate some heavy Nagle criticism.

Speakers 3-5 are likely here for that purpose. They are Boulder Progressive folks.

The first two guys are frequent flyers who have continuously and consistently disagreed with the city on a couple of issues: Online petitioning and dark skies.

Masyn Moyer up now. "Councilwoman Nagle I'm here bc of you." A little over 2 yrs ago I watched your campaign and ID'd with you as a resident of affordable housing and small business owner. "We elected you bc of your campaign promises and we believed in you."

Since on council, I've found you ignorant and uneducated on social justice and racial issues. Your ignorance is creating harm. (all paraphrasing here)

"You angrily dismissed our concerns and called us obnoxious."

Now addressing other members: Several of you opted out of GARE (equity) training and didn't go to the listening session on racism. You've never spoken up for ppl of color.

Clapping and whistling from the audience. Mayor Weaver reminds audience not to make noise bc "we want this to be a safe space." Much laughter in response.

SarahDawn Haynes, who considered a run for council: When I thought about joining you up there, I had a friend ask if I was ready to have ppl tell me they hate me in the grocery store line. So I know this is hard. Discussions on race are hard.

"We can do this. We can hang out. We can read, we can talk. The conversation is never going to end in our lifetime so I hope we can engage."

Anna Segur: Council member Nagle is white, privileged and in denial that she perpetuates white supremacy.

"As a private citizen it's up to council member Nagle if she wants to be insular and uneducated. But as an elected official," she has to do better.

Says Nagle's rhetoric is often found in white nationalist circles; compares it to statement like All Lives Matter.

She's now sharing instances of racism her husband faced. I interviewed them both about a confrontation in a community garden. It was heartbreaking. Unfortunately I wasn't able to turn it into a story, but it's still worthy of knowing.

Shawn Rodda. "I was deeply offended by comments you made. ... I have no problem with Sam and Bob as mayor and pro tem. They're qualified and no one else raised their hand. But you didn't say that. You went on a rant denying white privilege."

"You're so privileged that you have the privilege of not looking us in the eye when we're talking to you."

Audience breaks into applause and Mayor Weaver cuts them off again. "That is not OK. We need a safe space for everyone."

Rodda: "To the rest of council... I wrote an email. I got one response. I've seen two of you make public responses. (Brockett and Friend) Your silence is deafening. That is part of the problem."

Suzanne De Lucia is here supporting councilwoman Nagle. The first.

a"I could regale you with stories of discrimination and unfairness I've faced" as a female engineer. "I know what an old white boy's club is when I see it. I know I'm white; I think we're all privileged in oh so many ways just to be here."

"But I have not seen the racism in councilwoman Nagle. ... I also feel abuse was given to council members Yates and Weaver." She worked for Wallach's campaign.

"Thank you councilwoman Nagle for your wisdom and attempt to bring reason to the situation."

Riley Mancuso talking about a student of color he mentored who was nervous to come here bc of the reputation of racism Boulder has.

"It's not just about saying the right thing ... the reason the city of Boulder remain deeply racist and racially segregated places are bc of your policies and actions."

"You need to make changes that show you are aware that race, ethnicity and all of these issues affect everything. From the arbitrary laws (camping ban and smoking ban) that are twice as often enforced against ppl of color. ... You need to take action."

Hey! Our third non-Nagle speaker. On the poor snow removal on sidewalks, crosswalks, etc.

I've got a picture from my walk home today demonstrating just this.

That is a mound of snow on the sidewalk along 28th by Mapleton. Like, cool cool, I'll just teleport myself to the other side.

I mean, I just walked around, but to Haydel's point: not everyone can do that.

OK, back to Nagle speakers. Mark Gelband is up. To have someone on council call us obnoxious is obnoxious. It's disgusting.

"You got all defensive in your letter. As the son of a Holocaust survivor, I find your illusion to your Judaism offensive. You really do need to educate yourself to what it means to the kind of privilege you're talking about."

"I'm looking forward to my apology!" Gelband shouts as he walks away from the dais.

We've got another non-Nagle speaker up now, so I'll explain that Boulder tonight is considering a resolution against racism. They announced it after Nagle's comments and resulting backlash at the last meeting.

They did a similar thing in summer 2018 after I published the three-part series on racism, moving up a discussion on equity work. Today's resolution was going to be later in the year, I believe.

John Spitzer, a PLAN-Boulder person, says we should be proud of Nagle's accomplishments on council. Says the audience is "rancorous and angry," and that we should "all work together" to make it a better city.

This guy also hosted neighborhood meetings to drum up opposition to Attention Homes, the housing for homeless youth downtown. So...

According to attendees, he spread false fears that the homeless kids might be pedophiles (homeless kids are more likely to be *victims* of abuse than perpetrators) which is especially gross since his adult son was arrested for child porn.

But, yeah, let's all stay calm about racism.

Kathleen Hancock from Think Boulder is here to school us on "civil discourse."

I'd hoped I wouldn't have to give this comment bc the previous comments would be civil. But they weren't, she says, so...

"While those kinds of divisive attacks are routine in national politics, I thought Boulder was better than that."

"Boulder does suffer from racist attitudes; there is no question. Every city in the country does. We have to work together, though." Council's role is "to be forgiving of mistakes" and "represent a wide variety of views."

Nagle acknowledged that she could have done better, Hancock says. In contrast, an advisory board member attacked my group and never apologized. "We can do better."

Beth Hondorf asks that Nagle not be included in the discussion of the resolution against racism bc her comments are against the principles in the ordinance.

First Obama reference!

"The council should have stopped the meeting after these comments, but we were all in shock," Hendorf says.

Claudia Hanson Thiem, "I've already said my piece on Nagle's comments and the overwhelming silence from council" (in the Daily Camera) but she wants to talk about equity after all: RE snow removal and sidewalks.

"I feel profoundly disrespected by how the city deployed its resources in the last week," Thiem says. "If we have to ration something like snow removal, we should focus on our most vulnerable residents... and walking, biking and transit."

Cam Netherland, a CU law student, asking Boulder to reconsider its camping ban (that residents cannot lay down and "shelter" themselves with a blanket or tent). And urges council to open the shelter all winter long.

The law isn't interested in ending homelessness; it's interested in ignoring it, Netherland says.

Emily Wingeier is our last speaker for open comment. She is here to talk about ADUs but also "appreciates" the conversation around racism, but I *think* she's criticizing ppl who are criticizing Nagle. We should speak in a way that isn't "getting mad and start(ing) fights."

Also threw in something about snow removal. Riding the bus, she's seen how crap it is at the curbs. Makes it difficult for ppl to get off and on, especially those with mobility challenges.

OK, we're moving to staff responses. Bill Cowern is going to talk about plowing in a bit, so stay tuned.

This will apparently be the Nagle/snow thread.

Cowern, interim transportation director, starts by thanking staff for working split 12-hour shifts for a week so that every Boulder response vehicle was out on the roads.

Which, yes, kudos to staff. It's the policies we need to look at here.

"We were hit with a massive storm. Record-setting: Largest since 97. More than 24" of precipitation in 24 hours."

Freezing temps fore and aft complicated our response, Cowern says.

The Denver Post wrote about this! The weather part: denverpost.com/2019/12/02/den…

De-icer was applied during the storm but not before, bc there was precipitation before...?

Bc of low temps, "we were unable to make much headway" until yesterday when it warmed up.

"This is understandably frustrating, but our plows do not make snow go away. They just moved the snow, and there have to be decisions about where it gets moved."

"The safest way is to do it in the way we do it," which means sometimes blocking curbs, sidewalks, etc.

"Happy to discuss" ways to do it differently in terms of resources, but "those are significant numbers."

No residential streets plowed in first 4 days. Every asset was on main arterials and other priority areas.

Some ppl don't want residential streets plowed bc it will wall in cars and driveways, Cowern says. "There's not a win-win when it comes to plowing residential streets."

In many cases, bike lanes became storage for snow, which is frustrating, he says. But there's nowhere else for it to go.

City waited for warm temps, bike lane snow to melt and then "slushed it out" into the roads.

Storm will cost city $400,000. ~$1.8M in 2019 on snow and ice control. The most in a long time. "We'll be fortunate if we can cover that in the transportation fund."

Yates asking qs: Some cities that get a lot of snow do snow removal. Do we do that? Can we expand it?

Cowern: "We have to. Especially in a big event like this." We have to make big piles and then move it out. A "massive" pile at the Boulder Airport.

FIELD TRIP TO GO SEE THE GIANT SNOW PILE!!

Young: I have experienced difficulty accessing bus stops. What are the challenges associated with clearing shelters, bus stops and access?

Cowern: Idk how many bus stops we have; the city has a few we do maintenance for. 204 places the city contracts shoveling and plowing for; some bus stops on that list. RTD is responsible for some; property owners for others.

But not every bus stop is accounted for.

"There are certainly some bus stops that do not get shoveled or plowed and are probably in pretty bad condition right now."

But the "biggest" ones, the city makes efforts, he said.

Young: How can we make it better? Can we partner with businesses or property owners?
Cowern: Yes, some of them are managed by RTD, biz, property owners. We have explored that; we'd be up for exploring it more.

Boulder could also explore a "volunteer program" to clear things, Cowern says.

Brockett: Do we focus at all on making sure the crosswalks are cleared in the days after?

Cowern: Crosswalks are cleared by plows; issue is the access. "That is not an area, I don't believe, that any of the..."

Someone else answering this from staff. Some are cleared at "high-traffic" bus stops or other "critical" areas.

204 locations Boulder contracts out for plowing/shoveling: cost $45K during this storm.

There are "tens of thousands" of access points in the city, Cowern says.

Swetlik q: What is the compliance mechanism for ppl not complying with snow removal? And what did that look like during this snow incident?

Private property owners responsible for sidewalk in front of property unless it's a multi-use path. Ppl have 24 hours after the end of the storm to shovel. Boulder decides when the storm ends. It's $100 ticket if you don't shovel

Carr: There are "many" sidewalks that have not been cleared. Compliance is complaint-based bc there are simply too many miles of sidewalk to police.

If you ignore your ticket, Boulder will pay someone and bill you.

Swetlik asks if tickets offset some snow removal costs. No, city attorney Carr and manager Brautigam say, shaking their heads and laughing.

Friend: How do we not afford it? Other cities do. Asks for numbers. "There are a lot of jobs that are low-paid where you can't call off. You don't get a snow day."

Cowern: Meeting everyone's expectations are hard bc there are so many. Plowing every residential street would take an additional $1.3M/yr to $1.9M/yr, that would "prob" provide "pretty good service during a typical storm" but would be "completely overwhelmed" in a storm like this

To get all the access areas cleared: $500K, "every storm that we had," Cowern says. "Conservatively."

Wallach started to move onto the Nagle feedback with this. "I think when you call somebody a racist.." before Weaver cut him off bc we're still doing snow.

The end of a sentence has never been more highly anticipated.

Weaver sums up Boulder's approach to snow removal: Wait 3 days for the sun to come out.

Did not know that was official policy but OK. Not too insane in a sunny place like CO, but as Weaver says, with climate change, is that going to be good enough?

Boulder has a fleet of 15 plow trucks, apparently.

What does a plow truck cost, Weaver asks. And how much does it cost to operate, per truck, on average?

Cowern doesn't have that answer now but he will get it to council. They're having a long-term budget discussion next week, so that's good timing.

I keep typing that now we're going to hear the end of Wallach's sentence but we're discussing other things.

An open comment discussion hasn't gone this late in awhile.

OK, Wallach up. I'm holding my breath!

"I think it is a very serious allegation when you accuse somebody of racism. You need to know what's in their head, you need to know what's in their heart. Based on my experience, I do not believe for even a minute that my colleague is a racist."

Diversity and inclusion aren't the only values in Boulder. Others are "respect, outrage and grace." Many of those comments tonight included those. Outrage does not teach.

Someone from the audience yells out "that's racism."

Omg he is quoting the Bible. "Let he who is without sin among you cast the first stone."

Friend is going to respond to those comments, either now or later under the racism resolution.

Audience visibly and audibly off put by Wallach's comments.

Well, some of them.

Friend thanks the speakers on white privilege. "That is not calling somebody racist, if you're calling out white privilege, that's not the same thing at all. We need to work hard on not being defensive. ... There were words spoken from this dais that caused harm."

"We need to do a better job of learning." Also appreciates Nagle "showing up" to "take in" the feedback. "I'm sure that's not easy."

Ppl asking for "solidarity" among council: "That is a form of oppression, in my view," Friend says. "We can't have ppl in power protecting other ppl of power. We need to be guarded about closing ranks."

Young, responding to Wallach: "We need to treat it as a teaching moment."

"I was the only person of color" on council when I joined. "I didn't even know I was a person of color." But "I started getting emails and calls" from residents. "So I started reading and reading."

Something she learned: how deep-seeded (seated?) in racism Boulder's policies are.

Talking about Frederick Olmsted's city planning and the intent to keep out residents of color from buying homes here.

And Boulder's decision to outlaw "dirty" industries with majority workers of color. "Adding those things together, you begin to get a picture of the answer to the question, 'Why is Boulder so white?'"

Her journey has been "self-guided." It takes time and intention, she says. "You can't call somebody racist without understanding that we all are."

"We just need to move forward and be kind to each other and understand that not all of us have spent the time it takes to begin to understand how complex this is and how enormously taxing it will be to dismantle it."

"Calling somebody a racist is a failing to understand that we all are."

I might have missed it, but I didn't hear anyone call Nagle a racist... they called her comments racist. Personhood vs. behavior.

But, again, I might have missed it. It was a lot to type very quickly.

Brockett: White folks need to work hard to understand and do what we can to reverse system racism. "It's very important to do the work that we can to understand our history and not just call out things that are actively racist, but to be actively anti-racist ourselves."

"There are few things more difficult to talk about than issues of race in our society but it's important we have the courage to confront them."

Swetlik thanks speaker SarahDawn Haynes for "reaching a hand" and offering to have conversations about this with Nagle. "It's important none of us be dismissive with one another; as soon as your dismissive... that's really, really not going to help anything."

"Try to lend a hand before you do anything else. I think that's going to be our best path forward here."

Junie Joseph speaking on these issues for the first time. "I'm the only black woman in the room. I was very afraid to... not afraid, but cautious. To my colleague, I didn't want to come across as rude."

To Young: You say everyone is racist. I don't think I'm racist. Do I have room to grow? Yes. "Racism is structural."

"People have msged me and asked why are you silent? As a black woman, just being in this room is part of my advocacy. I hope residents who look to me... it's going to take me some time to grow into this role. Give me time to grow. But I understand the community frustration."

"While it is understandable to be angry, the real conduit of justice is our system that marginalizes ppl every day."

Even if 1 council member isn't willing to work on social justice, we can still make progress. Even if 2 are not willing, we can still make progress. But I hope all of us are willing."

Weaver addressing this now: "It has taken me many, many conversations with (Young) and others to come to where I am today."

He's reading a statement.

That he wrote.

Acknowledging the history of oppression. "Not acknowledging that being white comes with privileges, often hidden ... denies our history" as well as current understanding, Weaver says.

"We have not lived the same experiences. Acknowledging the existence of white privilege of white ppl" does not diminish our accomplishments, but it acknowledged past and ongoing harms.

OK, that's the end of this very long, very interesting open comment period. Every muscle in my back is so tense right now.

Sometimes I think I've chosen the wrong career.

@threadreaderapp please unroll, thank you!

Also, I've got a check coming your way next time I get paid. Thanks for all the unrolling you've done for me and the Boulder Beat!